How far can you trust a manufacturer (Topower) ?

Oklahoma Wolf said:

Topower's factory is closed. They don't make anything now... hard telling what's actually in that little metal box.

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Not my area of expertise but I'll take a look... Is some other company just using their name then? I do run across one site with their name on it that claimed a long and unbroken lineage ( sales jargon of course) but it's sure be nice to know a bit more if possible.

I know I should try open the box.... But if I can tell you what caps are I there could you tell me if they're quality or not? I did run a search on them before, but I just got a bunch of posts in forums. No real way to tell whom is actually informed or not. I suppose the same applies here, but frankly youre well spoken of around here

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Janus67 said:

There's no 'easy' way to OC a power supply. The only real way to void it's warranty is to open the case of it.

That said, I have yet to see a PSU warranty that covers the cost of items that have died if it died, but someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

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That answers part of my question, thanks

What I meant about OC affecting warranty is will it void the PSU warranty as well. Of perhaps if you OC your MOBO /cpu and the GPU Fries, then the GPU company may try to use the OC on the other components to weasel out of the warranty?

overclocking your CPU/GPU/etc does not void any PSU warranty that I've ever seen. The power supply doesn't know any different, all it knows to do is pull and send the requested voltage to the parts requesting it.

I'm still skeptical that quality must be determined by the dent in my wallet,

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There is typically a premium, yes. But price isn't a barometer for quality.

I am of course interest to hear if the name brand powerbox that fried your stuff was on the list

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Even the best PSUs will fail. The point is that there is less chance of a quality PSU failing versus a garbage one.

I'll have to read for myself of course but do PSU warranties typically cover components they fry?

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From a reuptable brand, more likely, than a crap brand...

overclocking your CPU/GPU/etc does not void any PSU warranty that I've ever seen. The power supply doesn't know any different, all it knows to do is pull and send the requested voltage to the parts requesting it.

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Exactly.....

EarthDog said:

There is typically a premium, yes. But price isn't a barometer for quality.

Even the best PSUs will fail. The point is that there is less chance of a quality PSU failing versus a garbage one.

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well of course but there must be something else at work with Mr Gone's failed psu. I know if you leave a car battery sit for too long the electrolyte can deplete, but something makes me doubt there was anything like that going on there. If there was a psu that was 100% reliablwe Id get it, but as of now with that story added in - it makes my percentages look better ( and yes I know thats not what hes saying, Im sure if we asked he'd say he has had so many psus that didnt go bad and this was just a small percentage-- which is true. Im at a 50/50 right now 1 bad Diasblotek and one maybe bad Topower ) Long story short I know you guys are right and I Do get the point of the story he told. Id just like to know what happened to his, especially since it was fresh out of the box. id be madder than hell if I bought a premium psu and it fizzled like that and ate other components as well.

from a reuptable brand, more likely, than a crap brand...

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Any that you know of? They move to the front of the list is why I ask

i had a dynapower psu incinerate a transformer inside itself, then promptly melt the power switch on the back, i was lucky it didnt kill the rest of my gear.

knoober said:

well of course but there must be something else at work with Mr Gone's failed psu. I know if you leave a car battery sit for too long the electrolyte can deplete, but something makes me doubt there was anything like that going on there. If there was a psu that was 100% reliablwe Id get it, but as of now with that story added in - it makes my percentages look better ( and yes I know thats not what hes saying, Im sure if we asked he'd say he has had so many psus that didnt go bad and this was just a small percentage-- which is true. Im at a 50/50 right now 1 bad Diasblotek and one maybe bad Topower ) Long story short I know you guys are right and I Do get the point of the story he told. Id just like to know what happened to his, especially since it was fresh out of the box. id be madder than hell if I bought a premium psu and it fizzled like that and ate other components as well.



Any that you know of? They move to the front of the list is why I ask

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Use the PSU list? THe difference between most on there as far as failure rate is a couple of % at best...

That said, we love the Seasonic brand across the board.. or the EVGA Supernova G2 series are high end.

No I meant if there were any with a warranty that would guarantee other components they would move to the front of the my list for replacement I was trying to be cheeky. Like I said I'll get one of the tried and true, but it's on the back of the list ( I know it should be first, but I promise not to cry at you guys if it from my rig before I can replace it). First off all, I need this beast to run reliably. This is a winter project that's run a bit long due to complications with parts!

If you want to know specific characteristics of a quality PSU, go read some of the reviews on jonnyguru.com.

EarthDog said:

the EVGA Supernova G2 series are high end.

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That was my last purchase withiin the last few months. I don't regret it's cost since they have a very good track record, but even they can fail. BUT the reports of those testing my G2 850watt on real loads indicate it to be comprised of good components.

And what happened to me and some much older albeit new power supplies has nothing what so ever with whether it is advisable to run less than well respected parts in one's own system. It was not my intention to mention brand names of the older power supply that failed since they are NO longer made anyway. And its replacement NOS the same...no longer manufactured. So not of any consequence. The high dollar pretty well respected supply that failed and took out my hard drives was about 50 days out of warranty and that one really ticked me off. But this is computering and we go on. Stuff fails. My TV failed out of warranty. I did not swear off of TVs but bought another.

When I said I was having this urge to replace the power supply that is again NOS from the same era as the failed one was to indicate that I know and respect that junk power supplies can be the ruin of good parts and without warning. Nothing more and nothing less. No further background required. I am going to buy another along the lines of my EGVA G2 to take this NOS out of the mix.

RGone...

I think I understood that to be what you meant. I have no real curiosity about the brand so much as what could be the cause of the malfunction in a mechanical (or in this case electronic) sense. As previously stated any PSU can go at any time regardless of cost or manufacturer, but do you consider the long out of service period spent on the shelf to be part of the cause? If you simply shrugged and moved on to the next PSU and rebuilt I can appreciate that, but I'd still like to know if your PSU was a defective unit, or if the long time period had a role to play. Perhaps a random surge that such past a surge protector (I know that probably doesn't happen)?

As I said I wasn't trying to get a brand or anything, just trying to figure out if there are certain storage practices that need to be done or something. I'm also beginning to fear getting good a "spoiled" PSU, that has sat too long on a factory shelf, or was shipped in a truck that was over 100 F o a summer day..... I need a "fresh" PSU!

just trying to figure out if there are certain storage practices that need to be done or something. I'm also beginning to fear getting good a "spoiled" PSU, that has sat too long on a factory shelf, or was shipped in a truck that was over 100 F o a summer day..... I need a "fresh" PSU!

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You really need to not be thinking this deep about it...there is no way anyone could know how long a unit sat on a shelf or was shipped in a refer truck or sat in a sauna. Come on knoober...

EarthDog said:

You really need to not be thinking this deep about it...

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My aplologies E_D. I had no freeken idea this could take such a meaningless spiral. I will take my big boot and kick myself out of here.

RGone...

You should see if it makes a loud popping noise like Powmax (get it... pow... lol) by intentionally overloading it

Meaningless spiral? Oh come on No seriously it was a legit inquiry. I was hamming it up for effect, but thee is an honest question there with real science behind it.

To begin: why are the pins on your cpu and other circuits made from gold even though it has slightly less conductivity (iirc, please don't be too mean if I'm wrong) and a higher cost than copper? Because gold is less susceptible to corrosion from exposure to the atmosphere is why. Copper may conduct electricity and hear like a champ, but it will make a chemical reaction with just about anything, including oxygen. So gold is the go to product for many things, and barring gold other things like, palladium or silvery alloys. My supposition here is that over time (even in the sealed box) something made of copper reacted with oxygen or some stubborn for of humidity and caused corrosion, which caused increased resistance and more heat and then a sizzle. In light of this knowledge I wonder if my questions on shelf life are quite so silly? As I said it was a real question, just dressed in silliness so as not to be such dry reading and to add a bit of personality.

And do let us not forget that this thread was supposed to be about the emails I exchanged with a person of unknown rank and employment within a PSU manufactory, and whether anyone else saw them as dubiously as I did. I do apologize for the silliness though, and shall try to keep it to a minimum in the future, although I think I won't be able to maintain this level of cogency either!

Edit: I've never noticed the vendor discussion forum before. Perhaps this should have there. If I were to put up a post on this topic there, should I link to this post or try to have this one moved to that section?

There is no need for a thread there too.. this is fine...

Lets see...

On a cheap (read: NOT "inexpensive"... CHEAP!!) psu you are getting ->

- Lowest quality capacitors from the lowest bidder
- you think you're getting copper wire on a diablo tek? heh..
- the thinnest and weakest materials that are the cheapest to produce
- combining all of that with people that are getting paid 12 cents an hour to produce as many units as they are told.
- quality control? ha..

Combining all of those factors together nets you an *insert crap psu here*.

Is cost indicative of quality? Mostly yes. There is a point of diminishing returns, and from jonnyguru reviews, pretty much all the good ones over 70$ are pretty much on par with each other for the most part (splitting hairs on ripple suppression and modular capabilities, etc) and you begin paying for features and capacity over "quality" (which is inherent to them at that point). Does that mean a 20$ (literally, they go on sale for 20$ all the time) CX430 is a ticking time bomb? No, not really. By far not the best, but a relatively solidly built powersupply for those on a tight budget.

Lets compare diablotek soldering and tracing (on a thin pcb)->



To an evga supernova g2 ->



The chances of a cold solder on that diablotek is pretty damn high from the looks.


Now, lets look at components ->

EVGA supernova G2 uses Nippon capacitors. Some of the most well regarded in the world! Unsure of the specific model used, but average consumer cost is around 2$ for a 2700uF (what the evga uses) capacitor. They are so good, that chinese manufacturers make counterfeit models.

Diablotek uses LCZ capacitors. They sell for .4 cents each. Not "4 cents", 40% of ONE cent to buy one(source : alibaba). What kind of quality do you think you're buying?


Thats just the tip of the surface.







Bottom line, how much should we trust manufacturers? We shouldnt! Thats why people host reviews on sites like jonnyguru and do the work for you.

I built a new truck. Its super safe, TRUST ME.

Gentlemen you have convinced me. As I have said I will be on the look out for a new psu and it just might be from the list. Really it will be. I was perfectly happy with what I had until I got such an answer from the guy at the company. While I was offered a replacement directy instead of having to dink around with the seller, I dont think giving a chance to provide another suspect product is where the money is at. If this guy had shown me something to say that there was in fact a line of "high efficiency" models that used a 120mm fan instead of the 140mm it was supposed to be (per the website specs) then Id sit tight on my purchase and not even worry. But when I hear (paraphrased) " You got a special one" after explaining how mine differed from the official specs... well Im not gonna say the guy was lying, but I am gonna search for a true and tested psu (which yes includes reading reviews) . Thank you for all your patience in explaining it to me ad naseum