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NV GPUs do not support DX12 Asynchronous Compute/Shaders

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sobe

sobe

Unscathed Member
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Joined
Jun 22, 2005
Please keep in mind that by accessing this link you certify that you understand the possibility of obscene language as per peoples' opinions on the comments that are on the page. This link comes with a Mature rating.

https://www.reddit.com/r/pcmasterrace/comments/3j2wpj

I am hoping this doesn't get pulled by mods due to the language involved in the comments, but my primary point is the OP where the information is located which is the intention of this thread.

Surely this can't be right, in regards to Maxwell and DX12 as a whole?
 
Thanks for the link! (You are OK with the warning... thanks for that!)



...can someone name the DX12 titles that are currently out? How about the number of them due out by the time Pascal hits the shelves in 2016?

Then: http://arstechnica.co.uk/gaming/201...ly-win-for-amd-and-disappointment-for-nvidia/

In the only benchmark I have seen, of an unreleased game. It appears that while there is a small performance penalty using the DX12 path, it doesn't make NVIDIA GPUs not usuable. At 1080p, its what, 10%? Clearly more than negligible, but not debilitating. Personally, I'm glad they aren't on the hypemobile like AMD is and touting features that aren't terribly relevant to most people considering that there is nothing out for a while that will use DX12. Pascal will be here and hopefully they don't have this kick in the pants!
 
While I agree with that Joe, nVidia has said that they supported DX12. When it turns out that their newest GPUs fail to include a featureset that can greatly improve performance (as seen by AMD's benchmarks).

I agree, there's only 1 DX12 game available to be benchmarked (and it's in early alpha mode), but the fact that the feature isn't just a driver improvement that nVidia can do but instead of apparently missing on the hardware is a bit of an issue for those thinking that they would get a nice performance boost come DX12 as we expected to see (and did see from AMD in this case).
 
That is a good point Janus. I did not think of it from that perspective. I wonder if we will see similar increases across more titles as they come out. This game is pretty unique from what I heard when I talked to some of the devs E3 and can really use (read: need) that parallelism DX12 offers with the Async compute/shaders such as this RTS game that can have 1K units each with their own lighting. I believe we will still see positive scaling in other titles, but this may be a perfect use scenario where its crushing the NVIDIA GPUs (ok, not crushing, but losing performance). If there are games that use less parallel processing if the NVIDIA GPU will then not show a difference. Still, if AMD GPUs are gaining, I'd like to see similar increases with the NVIDIA GPUs as well.
 
It's only going to matter more and more as the consoles both use AMD GPUs as well, and they (or at least the Xbox One) will be getting the Windows10/DX12 upgrade to take advantage of that as well. If more games are coded to support that for the consoles (and the AMD parts) it would only show benefit to those that own GCN1.1/1.2 (not sure if GCN1.0 can support it) cards.
 
Interesting, but as Janus said we're talking about one game and one game that is in alpha. We'll see how this unfolds, but it could turn out to be another AMD optimized game vs NV optimized, which I can't stand. By the time DX12 becomes mainstream, both teams will have new gpu's anyway.
 
That's true, although the developer has come out and said that they didn't develop for either platform but just focused on utilizing the features that were available for DX12.

A separate reddit thread than pcmasterrace (instead just /r/pcgaming):
https://www.reddit.com/r/pcgaming/comments/3j1916

http://www.overclock3d.net/articles...ssuring_them_to_change_their_dx12_benchmark/1

Basically it comes down to nVidia's drivers saying they have a supported feature (async compute) but infact the hardware isn't made for it. I agree that by the time the DX12 games start to come out Pascal will likely be out by then, but I feel bad for the people that bought the current gen nVidia cards that 'support' DX12 but not to the full capacity.it would be like getting into a car that says it has radio but you can only turn the dial in increments of .7, sure you will get some channels and if you go around enough times you probably will eventually find what you are looking for but not as efficiently
 
I think you summed up my thoughts perfectly Janus, just seems like a big "F YOU" to those that bought 980 Ti's under the impression of NV's advertising of full DX12 support.
 
I think it's still too early to say Nvidia's cards are incapable of async compute. If the drivers are saying they are when it doesn't actually work in the game it could just mean nvidia hadn't turned the feature on yet or maybe the drivers weren't ready for it yet. As others have said this is only one game and it's still early in development.

I don't think Nvidia has responded yet, but if it is true that their cards are completely incapable of async compute then that would be a shameful deception on their part. Dx 12 compliance should mean full dx 12 compliance.

This isn't the first time the two companies have had a card that wasn't fully compliant. Remember how Kepler was kind of sort of but not really dx 11.1? And while the geforce 6 series was shader model 3.0, ati had to settle for 2.0b. They were able to find workarounds before maybe nvidia can find a solution.
 
what else is new? that's pc gaming for you. now neither amd or nvdia have a next gen card ready for the next big thing. amd has no ram and no drivers. nvidia has no async compute. double fail. this whole thing is giving me deja vu.
money-toilet-paper.jpg
 
with it being Nvidia on the deficit end- that will cause the dx12 benchmarks to be pushed back so that they can figure out a way for the green cards to be faster
 
Over at beyond3d, a programmer there wrote a little program to test for Asynchronous compute (graphics + compute concurrent execution). Test results show that Nvidia GPUs cannot perform this function while AMD GPUs can. This is something console developers have started to use on PS4 and is available with DX12 (and Mantle/Vulkan). Ashes of the singularity will use it on AMD GPUs only as Nvidia asked them to disable it on their GPUs after the developer reported major problems trying to use it. Their implementation is "modest" according to the developer but console developers are reportedly starting to use it more extensively. Look for Tomb Raider, Hitman, and Deus Ex early next year to see if it will have a larger performance impact in those games.

https://forum.beyond3d.com/threads/dx12-async-compute-latency-thread.57188/page-23

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The AoTS developer today said that Nvidia told them that Async compute is not totally enabled in their drivers and that they are working on it. It seems that Nvidia's solution requires a software front-end approach whereas AMD's is totally hardware driven so it's not known how effective Nvidia's solution will be assuming they get it up and running by release.
 
it'll be mantle all over again somehow. it sounds great and it'll end up being nothing because nvidia will make sure of it. they have too much pull. god i hate them but i love them. one way or another if you bought a 980 ti you can play anything for awhile...yeah....yeah that's it....
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