Windows 10 to become mandatory for all users soon....

Hopefully if you're in a large enough IT situation you're using enterprise licensing which nullifies the concern. If you're on professional hopefully the IT guy is using the appropriate group policy settings to block the updater.

It would be interesting if someone challenged Microsoft's "we can do what we want, it's in the EULA" justification...

All this will stop in two months when Windows 10 is no longer a free upgrade, so they better hurry up and file if they're going to...

Used to be ctrl+F4 would close any window without having to click it or resorting to Task Manager. A handy tool when dealing with unwanted malware installation click spaces. Doesn't work in winten. Don't know what key strokes do the same thing in winten.

Ctrl+4 closed this page for me in windows 10

Audioaficionado said:

Used to be ctrl+F4 would close any window without having to click it or resorting to Task Manager. A handy tool when dealing with unwanted malware installation click spaces. Doesn't work in winten. Don't know what key strokes do the same thing in winten.

Click to expand...

I always did Alt+F4, never tried ctrl+f4

Janus67 said:

Hopefully if you're in a large enough IT situation you're using enterprise licensing which nullifies the concern. If you're on professional hopefully the IT guy is using the appropriate group policy settings to block the updater.

Click to expand...

Companies that use enterprise are REALLY large. We support many 150 workstation and smaller businesses, not a single one has enterprise/VL/MAK windows licensing. Some of them don't even have all their machines on a domain.

Blocking the updater has been our primary strategy, although not exactly blocking. We manage the updates so we (until a few months ago) were able to just not allow the patches related to GWX. Unfortunately M$ moved the goal post again and is now including GWX components in IE Security patches.

Your posts stinks a bit of "if you're a small business, tough ****". I think it's unfair to say the least to try and pin a single bit of blame on the businesses for the issues Microsoft's strategy is causing, regardless of their size. M$ has created more issues with 'accidental' 10 upgrades recently than all the ransomware cases we've had to handle combined (thankfully both numbers are very low, because of the amount of work WE'RE doing for our clients).

I work for a MSP, fwiw.

- - - Updated - - -

c627627 said:

All this will stop in two months when Windows 10 is no longer a free upgrade, so they better hurry up and file if they're going to...

Click to expand...

You're assuming they will stop offering it for free. There's no reason to think they will suddenly start charging for something they can only trick people into installing for free.

The saga continues: KB3035583 is back in the 'Recommended' Windows Update Patch List this morning, tricking you into installing it along with everything else.
Once it's installed, it'll ask if you want to install Windows 10.
If you decide that you don't want to install Windows 10, it will offer you a convenient time to install Windows 10 anyway.
If you decide you don't want to install Windows 10 - your options are Install Windows 10 or 'X', where 'X' means Install Windows 10.

But there is a third option, that will allow you to opt out until next month when it will install it one last time...

c627627 said:

The saga continues: KB3035583 is back in the 'Recommended' Windows Update Patch List this morning, tricking you into installing it along with everything else.
Once it's installed, it'll ask if you want to install Windows 10.
If you decide that you don't want to install Windows 10, it will offer you a convenient time to install Windows 10 anyway.
If you decide you don't want to install Windows 10 - your options are Install Windows 10 or 'X', where 'X' means Install Windows 10.

But there is a third option, that will allow you to opt out until next month when it will install it one last time...

Click to expand...

Microsoft's already back tracked on that, it was removed from the patch within the last day or two. This again demonstrates they will do ANYTHING to get Windows 10 on a machine, which in-and-of-itself should be cause for alarm.

Pinky said:

Companies that use enterprise are REALLY large. We support many 150 workstation and smaller businesses, not a single one has enterprise/VL/MAK windows licensing. Some of them don't even have all their machines on a domain.

Blocking the updater has been our primary strategy, although not exactly blocking. We manage the updates so we (until a few months ago) were able to just not allow the patches related to GWX. Unfortunately M$ changed the goal post again and is now including GWX components in IE Security patches.

Your posts stinks a bit of "if you're a small business, tough ****". I think it's unfair to say the least to try and pin a single bit of blame on the businesses for the issues Microsoft's strategy is causing, regardless of their size. M$ has created more issues with 'accidental' 10 upgrades recently than all the ransomware cases we've had to handle combined (thankfully both numbers are very low, because of the amount of work WE'RE doing for our clients).

I work for a MSP, fwiw.

- - - Updated - - -



You're assuming they will stop offering it for free. There's no reason to think they will suddenly start charging for something they can only trick people into installing for free.

Click to expand...

That was not my intent. I've only worked in two IT places, both of which have 1000-5000 machines/users and we use enterprise licensing. My statement was more related to some horror stories I've heard of decently sized business still not using enterprise licensing and having the **** hit the fan when hundreds of machines randomly got upgraded.

I completely agree with you that what they are doing is about as unfriendly to consumers (and SMB) as possible.

Janus67 said:

That was not my intent. I've only worked in two IT places, both of which have 1000-5000 machines/users and we use enterprise licensing. My statement was more related to some horror stories I've heard of decently sized business still not using enterprise licensing and having the **** hit the fan when hundreds of machines randomly got upgraded.

I completely agree with you that what they are doing is about as unfriendly to consumers (and SMB) as possible.

Click to expand...

It's funny (sick) that M$'s strategy hurts the kind of businesses that can LEAST afford to deal with it. Enterprises can afford to tap into their 7 digit+ profits to correct a problem, a lot of these smaller busineses operate on shoe string budgets and an hour or two of paid tech time to correct problems literally hurts them. LITERALLY causes them financial hardship. And often that one or two machines performing that function, when suddenly ofline for some Windows 10 related issue (or offline while it's reverted back to Win 7/8) can limit productivity for that station and/or employee for that time, further financially penalizing them for being "small". It's businesses like this I would hope could get some satisfaction from a class action suit, one that would cost M$ so much they wouldn't dare ever do this again.

As a home user of windows (never worked in IT), I have been disabling windows udates for several years now as I consider it to be a process which need not run 24/7. To have the IT dept. of a large corp. simply leave windows update running, is imo, cause for firing. As long as you have a proper backup and learn how to block it, windows 10 is yesterdays news. Unfortunately there is no enable/disable updates button in the OS which is how Msuck is attacking EVERYONE.

habbajabba said:

As a home user of windows (never worked in IT).

Click to expand...

You should have considered truncating your reply right there...

Okay, I'll at least give you some idea *why* "IT" runs these annoyances called updates... we'll start with - it's the law. HIPAA law requires medical businesses who handle patient information to adhere to certain, baseline technology security requirements. One of them is using an operating system that receives regular security updates (so, no Windows XP, for example). So regardless of how you feel about it, any business in the medical industry touching patient data (which is nearly all of them) must perform windows updates on a regular basis or be out of compliance. If they're out of compliance and they're breached, both the practice/business and the IT company/individuals who signed off on their compliance paperwork (audit) can be fined, etc. This also affects their business insurance rates, which in the medical field are a huge cost.

The same is true for many industries.

And yes you can disable windows updates, so not sure what "Unfortunately there is no enable/disable updates button in the OS which is how Msuck is attacking EVERYONE" means. You can hide updates as well, so not only do they not get applied they don't appear as available updates either. How are you not getting updates?

Do what you want at home. But leave the rest to us.

I am guessing no one has figured out how to selectively apply Windows 10 Professional updates, it's still all or nothing, right? The moment you even check what updates are available, every trivial non security update still begins installing?

Pinky said:

You should have considered truncating your reply right there...

Okay, I'll at least give you some idea *why* "IT" runs these annoyances called updates... we'll start with - it's the law. HIPAA law requires medical businesses who handle patient information to adhere to certain, baseline technology security requirements. One of them is using an operating system that receives regular security updates (so, no Windows XP, for example). So regardless of how you feel about it, any business in the medical industry touching patient data (which is nearly all of them) must perform windows updates on a regular basis or be out of compliance. If they're out of compliance and they're breached, both the practice/business and the IT company/individuals who signed off on their compliance paperwork (audit) can be fined, etc. This also affects their business insurance rates, which in the medical field are a huge cost.

The same is true for many industries.

And yes you can disable windows updates, so not sure what "Unfortunately there is no enable/disable updates button in the OS which is how Msuck is attacking EVERYONE" means. You can hide updates as well, so not only do they not get applied they don't appear as available updates either. How are you not getting updates?

Do what you want at home. But leave the rest to us.

Click to expand...

Problem#1 W10 does not give you all the options mentioned. Third party software is required.
Problem#2 If my company's IT department didn't vet every update before turning it loose on my network, I'd fire people too. Too many M$ updates break things. Again, W10 doesn't allow for that.

With the data mining, ridiculous update policy, and strongarm "upgrade" tactics, I wouldn't put Windows 10 on a business network if all I had was a lemonade stand and a laptop. I don't think habbajabba was saying never update. I believe his point was any IT department that lets M$/Windows do whatever it wants, whenever it wants, is irresponsible in the extreme and isn't doing the job they were paid to do.

Alaric said:

Problem#1 W10 does not give you all the options mentioned. Third party software is required.
Problem#2 If my company's IT department didn't vet every update before turning it loose on my network, I'd fire people too. Too many M$ updates break things. Again, W10 doesn't allow for that.

With the data mining, ridiculous update policy, and strongarm "upgrade" tactics, I wouldn't put Windows 10 on a business network if all I had was a lemonade stand and a laptop. I don't think habbajabba was saying never update. I believe his point was any IT department that lets M$/Windows do whatever it wants, whenever it wants, is irresponsible in the extreme and isn't doing the job they were paid to do.

Click to expand...

My reply wasn't aimed at Windows 10, and I likely misinterpretted habba's post as it was likely discussing (although not very clearly) the points you raised above. *That* is a whole different subject and discussion altogether.

Our rule of thumb for Windows 7/8.1 updates is to only apply critical updates when they're released, but all other updates we let sit for about a month to see if problems end up getting reported. The recent Outlook patches that were putting it into safe mode, and other bugs related to M$ Office updates, never reached our client's computers for the simple fact the problems were discovered and addressed well within that 30 day timeframe.

We haven't formally worked out our strategy for Windows 10 because the adoption has been very slow with our clients, much of that due to the fact we've been advising against it and they've mostly been sheltered from the upgrade nags/whoopsie upgrades. I honestly think there will end up being another concession from M$ regarding their new update push strategy (if you can even call it that - it's more like an imposition than strategy).

Just to be clear - I have nothing against Windows 10 as a functional operating system. I upgraded my cheap, hardly ever used laptop as a test, several months ago. Windows 10, aside from some video playback issues related to the intel video driver, has been fine. I just don't trust M$ anymore. Not that I ever did entirely, but their Windows 10 startegy has completely soured me personally and professionally. I think it really started with the removal of the start button with Windows 8. They acted like it was no big deal, reinventing their own wheel. When 90% of their userbase demanded it back they STILL didn't bring it back, instead giving everyone the finger with the equally useless start button with 8.1 . I think there's something unhealthy going on behind the walls in Redmond. The kool aid is tainted.

And to be more forthcoming, I have seen firsthand issues related to the upgrade from Windows 7 and 8.1, as well as post-upgrade issues from Windows 10 updates causing various and unexplicable problems. When it goes belly up it's about as craptacular as one might expect, for free. But when it works it works well, and it works most of the time for the clients who are using it.

I misunderstood, then. I thought you were referring to Windows 10. Apologies for the misunderstanding.

works most of the time

Click to expand...

Yeahhhh, I think I'll pass on "upgrading" to reduced functionality and reliability. If I had to change my OS (Say, at gunpoint) to another M$ OS I'd go with Vista. Windows 10 offers me absolutely nothing worth giving up my $100 W7. It would be like trading a Cadillac for a Tesla. LOL

c627627 said:

It's a good idea to secure a free Windows 10 license, even if you want to revert to Windows 7/8 straight away.

After that there are many tools to help, like
https://www.grc.com/never10.htm
and
http://win10wiwi.com/


View attachment 177553


http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer...anish-microsofts-unwanted-windows-10-advances

Click to expand...

Thanks for this, I was always a fan of GRC. I had an unwanted update fail, somehow my drive boot order was out of wack. I forced the SSD to be first & 10 reverted itself back to 7. I plan to get this 7 key updated, but when I'M ready - NOT MS!

Alaric said:

Yeahhhh, I think I'll pass on "upgrading" to reduced functionality and reliability. If I had to change my OS (Say, at gunpoint) to another M$ OS I'd go with Vista. Windows 10 offers me absolutely nothing worth giving up my $100 W7. It would be like trading a Cadillac for a Tesla. LOL

Click to expand...

Me three, typing this on my GWX sheltered and utterly stable Win7 Pro x64 desktop.

I will likely upgrade the entire machine before a newer version of Windows is installed. Then I will have the difficult decision as to whether I should even stick with Windows. How's Linux looking nowadays, anyway?

I will likely upgrade the entire machine before a newer version of Windows is installed. Then I will have the difficult decision as to whether I should even stick with Windows. How's Linux looking nowadays, anyway?

Click to expand...

And that is exactly where I am in the Windows process. An SSD, a better graphics card, and some faster RAM and my current rig will remain my all purpose PC for several more years. If I build a dedicated gaming rig I'll make the decision regarding Windows then. I'm hoping that there will be a functional Steam OS by then. Otherwise, Ubuntu is looking good. LOL

Well I'm going to do a fresh install of win7 on my 2nd partition of my windows SSD. I already have my established win7 installation on the 1st partition. When I make the move to Linux, I can just buy another SSD as they are getting rather inexpensive these days.