Whole House DVR Project...About to pull the trigger

JrClocker · Apr 21, 2016

Here are some screen shots.

First, here is the QNAP NAS interface...from a web browser.

Even though you are in a web browser, it feels like you are in an app. Here are a couple of windows open:

- - - Updated - - -

Next, I downloaded and installed Plex media server onto the NAS. Yes, that's right, it runs directly on the NAS. This is a pretty impressive piece of software:

The interface is intuitive. And setup was SUPER easy. Really cool!

Juan71287 · Apr 24, 2016

Love all this. Wish I could get something like that

I would be super happy. I been wanting a qnap NAS but just have not been able to afford one. Just got to say keep up the amazing work

JrClocker · Apr 28, 2016

Quick update today...no pictures.

(1) I have all of my "TV Shows" into Plex
(2) I have all of my movies into Plex
(3) I have about 20% of my music into Plex

Plex does a nice job at organizing the titles, and I love the visual presentation. My wife thinks it's great too, and she has no problem using the Plex interface. This is a good thing!

The only down side is having to organize some of your titles. Plex does an OK job of matching up your titles to the correct metadata, but it does get confused sometimes...and you have to name the title properly (for automatic metadata download) or manually set in Plex. I chose to rename the unmatched titles. Not frustrating, but just takes time.

Plex Server:
As stated above, I have the Plex server running on the new QNAP TS-453A NAS. I have had ZERO issues so far with this setup. The QNAP appears to have plenty of horsepower to feed up multiple streams. While I have had 3 running at the same time, these were all in "direct play" mode and did not require any transcoding (I used Handbrake to convert all of my DVD/BluRay rips to MP4).

Time will tell if the QNAP will have enough horsepower to run both the NAS and the upcoming HDHomeRun DVR software. My backup plan is to move the Plex server over to a Windows 10 laptop if required. As I have chosen to rename my media files, brining the existing media into a new server should be quick.

Plex Media Player Apps
I have tested a number of the Plex Media Player apps...here is my 10,000 foot view:

- Play Station 3 App: works OK, but it's buggy. The interface tends to get sluggish after you run a couple of movies or TV shows through it. It takes longer for the app to "skip ahead" in a video than what it actually takes to watch the video you are trying to skip. You have to restart the app to clean it up. Also, the app will not remember the sound setting. It's annoying to have to tell it to use Dolby Surround each time versus the 2 channel audio. It looks like it keeps defaulting to the first audio track in the movie versus keeping the app setting.

- Roku App: I have this running on a Roku 3. It runs VERY nice. Quick, responsive. None of the issues that the PS3 app has. This one was done very nicely.

- Android App: I have this running on a Nabi Big-Tab. It runs VERY nice. Just as good as the Roku App. This is a good thing, as my "future state" is to use the Android NVIDIA Shield boxes to replace my cable boxes

- iOS App: I have this running on an iPad (a few years old) and an iPhone 6S. It runs VERY nice. As good as the Roku and Android apps.

- Windows App: I have run this on multiple Windows 10 boxes. It's VERY nice.

- Web Browser App: I have used this on 1 Windows 10 box in Microsoft Edge. It works VERY nice.

Overall, I am happy and impressed with the Plex Apps. The only poor performing one so far is the PS3 app. Annoying, but workable...not my future state, so no negatives in my overall value proposition.

Final Thoughts:
I like the Plex software. In fact, I like the Plex experience so much, I just paid the $150 for the "lifetime" Plex Pass membership. I think this software is good enough to pay for.

It's nice to be able to pull all of the DVDs and CDs out from my family room and put them in a box in the garage...less clutter...no need to call "Horders" anymore!

Next Steps:
(1) Finish integrating music library into Plex
(2) Order and Setup HDHomeRun Prime for Live TV and integrate into Windows, Android, and iOS devices
(3) Order and Setup HDHomeRun DVR software onto NAS, and integrate into Windows, Android, and iOS devices
(4) Order and Setup NVIDIA Shield devices and remotes, integrate Plex and HDHomeRun

...and most important...

(5) Ditch my cable boxes and start saving $40 per month! :thup:

JrClocker · Apr 29, 2016

Quick update...

To check the transcoding performance of Plex running on the QNAP TS-453A, I purposely throttled the network speed connection to one of my devices down to 2 Mbps. Here are some quick results:

1. Transcoding a 480p video in real time: No issues
2. Transcoding a 720p video in real time: No issues
3. Transcoding a 1080p video in real time: This was too much for the QNAP device. Processor usage spiked to 95%+. It eventually streamed the movie after about 30 seconds of buffering

This performance is in-line with what is on the Plex webpage.

So, as long as I can keep my Plex clients in "direct play" mode, this solution should work OK. I will still have to determine what sort of CPU load the HDHomeRun DVR software puts on this.

The funny thing is that the QNAP device has hardware acceleration for transcoding, but the Plex server does not use it.

JrClocker · May 2, 2016

Quick update:

Got the port forwarding on my router working properly, and now I can stream my movies, tv shows, and music outside of my house.

Plex rocks!

I'll be ordering the HDHomeRun Prime tuner box and DVR software very soon

ssjwizard · May 3, 2016

cool, sounds like its going well. This is a couple steps beyond my setup at home.

JrClocker · May 9, 2016

OK - got all of my movies and TV shows loaded into Plex.

All of my DVDs are now sitting in a box in the garage :thup:

All of my non-iTunes specific music is in Plex...(I'm having a issue getting iTunes music to play in the Windows Web app...streams fine to my iPhone.)

The HDHomeRun Prime tuner has been ordered! (Will arrive on Thursday!)

Next step: schedule the cable guy to come install the cable card, and move on to the next phase!

(I'm very excited about seeing if the next phase will work well!)

JrClocker · May 13, 2016

Got these yesterday:

(1) HDHomeRun Prime (got on Amazon on sale for $110)
(1) 2-way RF splitter
(2) 3' RG-6 Coax

The HDHomeRun Prime is actually much smaller than I thought it would be...just a tad bigger than the palm of my hand!

Plugged the coax, Ethernet into switch, DC power...BAM the thing turned on. It did everything...total plug and play...I was not expecting this! The software tools that come with it are very easy to use.

I don't have the cable card yet (picking up tonight), but the unit did find the QAM channels below 100.

Picture quality is nice and the picture looks great. Streaming a "standard definition" QAM channel takes about 2 Mbit/sec of network bandwidth (I know this because the tools say so!).

Steamed TV over WiFi to a couple of different laptops...picture is great!

Next steps:
(1) Setup HDHomeRun Prime for my "subscription cable" for Live TV and integrate into Windows, Android, and iOS devices
(2) Order and Setup HDHomeRun DVR software onto NAS, and integrate into Windows, Android, and iOS devices
(3) Order and Setup NVIDIA Shield devices and remotes, integrate Plex and HDHomeRun

...and most important...

(4) Ditch my cable boxes and start saving $40 per month! :thup:

Nimblor · May 15, 2016

What are you going to be using for the front end for live TV and DVR?

JrClocker · May 16, 2016

Nimblor said:
What are you going to be using for the front end for live TV and DVR?

HDHomeRun has a viewer app for live TV...it works pretty good...the channel guide needs some work.

HDHomeRun is also working on a DVR application (still under development...in beta stage).

My plan is to run the HDHomeRun DVR (cost is $60) as...future state...it's supposed to work with DRM content.

The only content that appears to be DRM is my HBO channels (thank you Brighthouse Networks!) I haven't been able to get HBO to play yet on any device...even though it's supposed to.

I am playing around with NextPVR and Kodi for a front end (as it's free). Once I get used to the software and systems, I am going to drop $60 on the HDHomeRun beta software/firmware and see what it does. My backup plan will probably be NextPVR and Kodi if I don't like the current status of the HDHomeRun product.

I watched the Lightning hockey game on Friday night on the HDHomeRun viewer app on a Nabi Android tablet (my son's...this tablet is HUGE).

JrClocker · May 16, 2016

On May 12, 2016, HDHomeRun released a new build of their DVR application that turns an NVIDIA shield into a DVR. The DVR is accessible by any device on your network. Hrm.

They also allow for you to connect an external USB 3.0 hard drive in as the recording media for the DVR (so you can stay with the $200 shield instead of having to buy the more expensive one). HRM!

They plan on a release in June to support full DRM content! HRM! HRM! :thup:

The NVIDIA shield has pretty beefy hardware in it (gigiabit wired Ethernet is huge!)

I'm going to continue playing around with the NextPVR/Kodi to get it working (just to have fun), but I may have to move up my approach with the HDHomeRun DVR software setup sooner than I intended. I played around with the WiFi remove app on my iPhone for Kodi. Even though I plan on using the Logitech Harmony remote, it was pretty cool!

This latest development is a major milestone for them. Have a full DVR application running on one of these boxes avoids having to setup a separate PC server machine...

JrClocker · May 18, 2016

Last night I was able to successfully activate the cable card with my cable company. This enabled the DRM content to be properly flagged...by the way...if you live in the Tampa Bay area, HBOL (Latino) is not a copy protected stream...anybody can tune into it! Too bad I don't speak Spanish :/

Additionally, I successfully finished setting up NextPVR and Kodi.

The software was straight forward to setup, however the channel guide options are limited.

NextPVR pulled down pictorial channel logos for about 50 of my 460 channels. It was a bit tedious to get a picture for each channel logo, but I finished last night.

Getting the channel logos into Kodi was a bit of a pain. Kodi only brought over a portion of them from NextPVR. The only solution I could find was to map a network drive onto my NextPVR server, and point Kodi here to find the logos...it found them and all was well after that. (I chose to keep the channel logos all in one place to avoid have to manage duplicate copies.)

As expected, any channel flagged as "DRM" protected by the cable company will not play through Kodi. They currently only play through the HDHomeRun Andriod app...but I knew this going in.

I setup a recording session for "Star Trek The Next Generation" (once a geek...always a geek). We will see how well this works. Assuming successful, I'll be looking to see if there's any software out there to remove commercials for me. If not, I'll use video editing software and cut out the commercials.

I got the Kodi interface working, and found a skin that I like. I like the fact that I can have the weather forecast and other stuff on the main screen.

However, I find the Kodi interface to be cluttered and cumbersome to use. The cable box interface is much easier to navigate and use...I was not expecting this after all of the Kodi hype.

Does somebody make a Cable Box skin for Kodi?

I'll post some pics later tonight.

Next stop: HDHomeRun DVR...and see if I can use this one program to replace the NextPVR / Kodi combo!!!!

wagex · May 18, 2016

i have found the right skin is everything for kodi EG my kodi machines that use dlna to play / share library / share watched video's with my main unit, on those machines i run a special version of confluence that allows you do set dlna content on the home page instead of having to go to videos>ect. i did find this not sure if it will help http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=195476

i agree and also find that using kodi for anything other than streaming content (video files) off of a local server is a bit clunky. eg i tried to use a netflix addon for it, i could not stand using it and would power on my xbox to stream netflix or hulu that or at one point i had windows media center configured to a hotkey and would use that for netflix. big reason why i think htpc's are a thing of the past its much easier to have an android machine that you can switch between apps super easy. i can go from kodi to netflix, to youtube, to hulu, to amazon content, all with a few clicks on a remote with no advanced configuration needed.

hd homerun has an app for android called "hdhomerun dvr" dont know how hard it would be to configure for an android device that wasnt from hdhomerun themselves but it might be worth looking into. https://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=119&t=33103
there also seems to be an android hdhomerun view app for playing content though the reviews arent super great on it.

JrClocker · May 18, 2016

wagex said:
i agree and also find that using kodi for anything other than streaming content (video files) off of a local server is a bit clunky. eg i tried to use a netflix addon for it, i could not stand using it and would power on my xbox to stream netflix or hulu that or at one point i had windows media center configured to a hotkey and would use that for netflix. big reason why i think htpc's are a thing of the past its much easier to have an android machine that you can switch between apps super easy. i can go from kodi to netflix, to youtube, to hulu, to amazon content, all with a few clicks on a remote with no advanced configuration needed.

I actually like the Plex interface better than the Kodi interface for watching recorded videos/TV Shows/Music. It's very simple to use, and visual...unlike the Kodi...scroll...scroll...click...click...click...

I am avoiding DLNA because that's so...old school!

The Plex interface is nice...also, with Plex I can stream content outside of my house. The setup was easy, and my kids are loving being able to watch movies at their house from my house.

wagex said:
hd homerun has an app for android called "hdhomerun dvr" dont know how hard it would be to configure for an android device that wasnt from hdhomerun themselves but it might be worth looking into. https://www.silicondust.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=119&t=33103
there also seems to be an android hdhomerun view app for playing content though the reviews arent super great on it.

My last step is to use the HDHomeRun DVR app. It's still in the beta stage, but the reviews on it have been very good. The front end and backend are designed to run on Windows, Linux, Android, NAS, Apple, etc.

Also, they have a plan and roadmap to solve the DRM recording issue. Right now, there is only Windows Media Center (Windows 7 and 8) and Tivo. I ruled out Tivo as I refuse to spend that much $$ on specific hardware than can only run...well...Tivo.

I have used their Andriod view app. You don't need any specific Android hardware to run it. To run their DVR software on an Android, you need beefy enough hardware though.

If HDHomeRun is successful, they will be a game changer. However, I am not sure if it will be too little too late...check out Sony Vue:

http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-playstation-vue/

Upside:
- Cut the cord...only need internet
- Prices more competitive than cable
- 5 steams of TV for the same price
- DVR in the cloud

Downside:
- Need a PS device (at least 1) to have the service (but you don't need to run on the PS device)
- Local channels are not available in all areas (no freaking way I am making a Frankenstein to have OTA and streaming TV)
- DVR only holds shows for 28 days
- Missing some channels...but they are adding more every day

wagex · May 18, 2016

JrClocker said:
I actually like the Plex interface better than the Kodi interface for watching recorded videos/TV Shows/Music. It's very simple to use, and visual...unlike the Kodi...scroll...scroll...click...click...click... with the pure amount of customization and amount of skins for kodi i think that is a non issue.

I am avoiding DLNA because that's so...old school! The Plex interface is nice...also, with Plex I can stream content outside of my house. The setup was easy, and my kids are loving being able to watch movies at their house from my house.
i just use dlna to share the movie information and everything between my kodi machines, it even shares what shows are watched already ect i have used plex in the past and having software running on the server end to handle stuff in such a horrific way as plex does id rather not.

My last step is to use the HDHomeRun DVR app. It's still in the beta stage, but the reviews on it have been very good. The front end and backend are designed to run on Windows, Linux, Android, NAS, Apple, etc.

Also, they have a plan and roadmap to solve the DRM recording issue. Right now, there is only Windows Media Center (Windows 7 and 8) and Tivo. I ruled out Tivo as I refuse to spend that much $$ on specific hardware than can only run...well...Tivo.

I have used their Andriod view app. You don't need any specific Android hardware to run it. To run their DVR software on an Android, you need beefy enough hardware though.

If HDHomeRun is successful, they will be a game changer. However, I am not sure if it will be too little too late...check out Sony Vue:

http://www.cnet.com/products/sony-playstation-vue/

Upside:
- Cut the cord...only need internet
- Prices more competitive than cable
- 5 steams of TV for the same price
- DVR in the cloud

Downside:
- Need a PS device (at least 1) to have the service (but you don't need to run on the PS device)
- Local channels are not available in all areas (no freaking way I am making a Frankenstein to have OTA and streaming TV)
- DVR only holds shows for 28 days
- Missing some channels...but they are adding more every day
i have playstation vue, you dont need a playstation device just need to sign up for a ps account on their website all i have is firetv's to play the content on, the dvr in the cloud is awesome been using it often. some shows it will go more than 28 days sometimes its kind of weird i think if the content is also considered on demand you can watch it whenever even after the dvr is gone.
i agree that the local channels are annoying but i also didnt have any local channels when i signed up

JrClocker · May 18, 2016

I haven't had any bad experience with Plex yet.

The installation was a breeze.

Add content to the specific media folder...boink...metadata found - was a breeze.

View apps on every platform I have in my house (though the Playstation App needs some work still).

Can access the content from anywhere on the internet.

My only negative on Plex is that they do not use any sort of hardware acceleration for transcoding.

I think it boils down to what you first start with when you begin this adventure.

wagex · May 18, 2016

JrClocker said:
I haven't had any bad experience with Plex yet.

The installation was a breeze.

Add content to the specific media folder...boink...metadata found - was a breeze.

View apps on every platform I have in my house (though the Playstation App needs some work still).

Can access the content from anywhere on the internet.

My only negative on Plex is that they do not use any sort of hardware acceleration for transcoding.

I think it boils down to what you first start with when you begin this adventure.

i actually used plex to begin with it was the first app i used for local network playing video besides WMC, till i discovered how horrid their database system is, 100's of 1,000's of folders piled inside eachother to make a "database". i think i probably used plex for a year or two.

i also have terrible upload speed so remote transcoding was a pain for me and killed all 12 cores on my server to attempt.

ive never had any issue with xbmc scrapers finding meta data for any content on my server either though. but my library is super neat and clean and properly labeled by tvdb and imdb database names.
im sure they have made alot of improvements on plex since i stopped using it i know they now support passthrough audio and direct video streaming with 0 transcoding. i think it boils down to individuals needs.

Nimblor · May 21, 2016

I have had no issues with plex. I have found no better live tv / scheduler / DVR than WMC which is really holding me back.

JrClocker · May 22, 2016

Got the first of my NVIDIA Shield TV units on Friday:

Amazon was having a deal where you get the Remote Control for free (in addition to the game controller), so I figured what the heck. Also got a 128 GB memory card, as this was only the 16 GB model. No issues with running out of memory yet.

The NVIDIA Shield TV is small. Here it is next to my hand:

This is a pretty impressive little device. Installed Plex and Kodi, and the picture quality is fantastic.

For the first "prototype" run, I connected it into my family room...and we watch the Lightning hockey game on Friday night (can't believe they almost blew a 4 to 0 game!) The picture and sound were flawless and very smooth. After streaming HD TV for over 3 hours, the Shield device was pretty cool - only slightly warm to the touch.

I had a "jitter" 2 times during the test run...these coincided with my stepson starting large downloads. I had to tweak my network priority settings to put the stream from the NextPVR client as the highest priority. Once this was done there was no more jitter! :thup:

Quite the impressive little device.

When you first power up the device, the main screen is cluttered:

It's very annoying to have it constantly suggesting YouTube videos. A bit of tweaking with the settings allows you to turn this off.

The remote that came with it is very small, functional, and feels nice in the hand. The voice recognition is spot on, and it looks locally for any sort of title that you have. However, it's cumbersome to use in Kodi...functional, but cumbersome (there is no keypad on it, so it's hard to change channels...other than up/down.)

I got my Logitech Harmony 650 remote working with the box. However, it's only slightly more functional than the NVIDIA remote...and the number keys don't work.

I ordered a FLIRC USB IR dongle:

http://www.amazon.com/FLIRC-FL-0902...&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00

This is supposed to make everything work with the Harmony 650 remote...I'll post my next update after I get the remote working.

JrClocker · May 26, 2016

I received my FLIRC IR USB dongle yesterday:

Set it up and paired it with my Harmony 650 IR remote:

After a bit of tweaking of the setup in the FLIRC tool, I now have one (yes ONE) remote that properly talks to the TV, Surround Sound, NVIDIA Shield, KODI App, Plex App, and HBO Go App on the NVIDIA shield!!!!!

---------------------------------------

Push the "Watch TV" button on the remote: (1) TV turns on, (2) Surround decoder amp switches to the NVIDIA shield input, (3) NVIDIA shield turns on. Remote buttons are setup to work with Kodi, Plex, & HBO Go...remote volume changes TV volume.

Push the "Watch a Movie" button the remote: (1) TV turns on, (2) Surround decoder amp turns on, (3) Surround decoder amp switches to the NVIDIA shield input, (4) NVIDIA shield turns on. Remote buttons are setup to work with Kodi, Plex, & HBO Go...remote volume changes surround amp volume.

Getting 1 remote to do everything may not seem like a big deal. However, getting a remote that does everything AND have full Kodi functionality WAS a big deal.

---------------------------------------

Everything is up and running. After a quick "user test" with my wife (not technically savy), I got the green light! I put the NVIDIA shield box into the family room (leaving the cable box for now). Doing the first extended BETA run with the system to make sure everything is working OK over time. Assuming this is successful, I'll be purchasing another NVIDIA Shield TV and setting up for the master bedroom.

---------------------------------------

Opinions:
-----------

(1) Kodi TV paired with NextPVR: ehhh - OK - I guess.
---> The Kodi app is not really what I would call stable. Every once in a while when I launch the Kodi app on the NVIDIA shield it decides not to launch. You have to exit out and try again.
---> Even with "database caching" turned on, you still have about a 15 to 20 second delay when you first launch Kodi before the program guide loads. Don't (and I mean don't) try to view the program guide if it's not loaded...Kodi will just hang.
---> Every once in a while when you try to change the channel, Kodi won't communicate properly with the NextPVR server and you'll get a "Tuner Not Available" error. To correct, you go to a different channel, and then go back to the channel...this works most times. Every once in a while, Kodi will crash and you have to load the app again (wait another 15 to 20 seconds for the guide to load).

(2) Plex: Solid
---> The NVIDIA Shield TV Plex interface is slightly different than the others, but it has grown on me and I like it the best
---> Not sure if I am getting full surround sound yet through Plex, through the Shield...it was too late last night to crank up the surround sound volume - hehe.

(3) HBO Go: Solid

(4) Amazon Prime Video: Amazon TV and Google TV do not like each other. The Amazon Prime TV app is not even available in the Google Play store. There were previous "work arounds" to get the Amazon Prime TV app running on the Shield, but these have been closed down.

Over the holiday weekend, I am going to spend the $60 to get the HDHomeRun DVR software. All of the experimenting I have done with the HDHomeRun free apps have been solid, but without DVR functionality. I'll play with this setup and see if it's more stable than Kodi/NextPVR. I have a couple of options to run the HDHomeRun DVR software:

(1) On a Windows PC
(2) On my QNAP NAS
(3) Directly on one of the NVIDIA shield boxes

More to come soon!

Whole House DVR Project...About to pull the trigger

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