[Overclockers.com]

Architecture, specifications, and design highlights for the AMD Radeon HD 6850 and Radeon HD 6870 - this is what everyone has been waiting for. While many sites are publishing exhaustive dissertations spanning many pages, we're looking to quickly bring out the essentials of what you need to know. The time for guesswork regarding AMD's 6000 series graphics cards has come to an end and benchmarks are publishing at many sites as you read this. In theabsence of solid facts alongside a plethora of supposed "leaks", the buildup to the release of the AMD 6000 series was fed from a consistent diet of ...

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[ratbuddy]

Hmm, let's hope the OC review includes an overclocked 460 vs OC'd 68XX cards. Haven't seen any reviews do that yet...

[hokiealumnus]

Unfortunately not. If I had one, I'd compare them...but I don't. Got one you want to send me temporarily?

[ratbuddy]

Originally Posted by hokiealumnus

Unfortunately not. If I had one, I'd compare them...but I don't. Got one you want to send me temporarily?

Just the one I'm using, I'm sure Brolloks or one of the other cardaholics does though

[Marshmallow64]

From what I am seeing they are performing worse than the 470. Strange numbering system.

[EarthDog]

Whats the point of reviewing it like that (460 vs 6870 or even 6850)? From the already published reviews, it spanks it across the board. The only difference would be overclocking headroom (which I believe what you may be getting at) and the 6870 being clocked so high, it may not have much headroom. A better comparison, b/c of performance and pricing (now) would be the 470 and overclock those?

[MattNo5ss]

It looks like the 6870 and the GTX460 1GB have almost the EXACT same specs, except for the stock clocks. so, I would bet you have to get the GTX460 1GB to the same clocks as the 6870 for them to be roughly equal in performance. Which I doubt could happen, especially once the 6870 is OCed. This assumption is based on the specs, not actual benchmarks though...

Code:

HD6870

Max Power Draw:         151 W
Noise Level:            Moderate
Framebuffer:            1024 MB
Memory Type:            GDDR5
Memory Bus Type:        64x4 (256 bit)
DirectX Compliance:     11.0
OpenGL Compliance:      3.2
PS/VS Version:          5.0/5.0
Process:                40 nm
Fragment Pipelines:     1120
Vertex Pipelines:       0
Texture Units:          56
Raster Operators        32

GTX460 1GB

Max Power Draw:        160 W
Noise Level:           Quiet
Framebuffer:           1024 MB
Memory Type:           GDDR5
Memory Bus Type:       64x4 (256 bit)
DirectX Compliance:    11.0
OpenGL Compliance:     3.2
PS/VS Version:         5.0/5.0
Process:               40 nm
Fragment Pipelines:    336
Vertex Pipelines:      336
Texture Units:         56
Raster Operators       32

"At the same clocks" Comparison

HD6870                                           GTX460 1GB

Core Clock:           900 MHz                    900 MHz        
Memory Clock:         2100 MHz (4200 DDR)        2100 MHz (4200 DDR)
Memory Bandwidth:     134.4 GB/sec               134.4 GB/sec
Shader Operations:    1008000 MOperations/sec    302400 MOperations/sec
Pixel Fill Rate:      28800 MPixels/sec          28800 MPixels/sec
Texture Fill Rate:    50400 MTexels/sec          50400 MTexels/sec
Vertex Operations:    0 MVertices/sec            75600  MVertices/sec

[Nathan54AB]

Am I the only one whose noticed that specs on the 6850/6870 are actually lower than that of the 5850/5870?

[I.M.O.G.]

Well, thats the optimizations and part of the whole shebang with "doing more with less".

Some specs are higher, but ya, a lot of the performance comes from some design optimizations of the architecture.

[doz]

Originally Posted by Nathan54AB

Am I the only one whose noticed that specs on the 6850/6870 are actually lower than that of the 5850/5870?

Because the 6850/6870 are the successors to the 5750/5770. There is going to be a 6950/6970 that will replace the current 5850/5870.

In other words, if you are looking to buy a 5850, you should just get the 6870 as they are about the same price but better performance/newer card. Same w/ 5770, just buy a 6850 (which will edge out the 5770 as the 6850 is more onpar w/ a 5830).

[deathman20]

And to wait and see what the full size cores will do, I can't wait. If the shaders are really powering it that much we'd see roughly a 42% increase in oomph. Might just have to wait and see how the new ones fair before jumping on this... safer then sorry besides its not like I said I was going to get a 5850 earlier this year and still sitting on my GTX285.

[Nathan54AB]

Originally Posted by doz

Because the 6850/6870 are the successors to the 5750/5770. There is going to be a 6950/6970 that will replace the current 5850/5870.

In other words, if you are looking to buy a 5850, you should just get the 6870 as they are about the same price but better performance/newer card. Same w/ 5770, just buy a 6950 (which will edge out the 5770 as the 6950 is more onpar w/ a 5830).

This isn't making sense. 3870 < 4870 < 5870 right? Ok, so why isn't 5870 < 6870? Also, isn't the 5850 more powerful than the 5770? If that's the case, why would the 5770 be close to a 6950 and 5850 be close to 6870?

Well, thats the optimizations and part of the whole shebang with "doing more with less".

Some specs are higher, but ya, a lot of the performance comes from some design optimizations of the architecture.

That makes more sense. So a 6870 will probably outclass a 5870?

[ratbuddy]

Originally Posted by EarthDog

Whats the point of reviewing it like that (460 vs 6870 or even 6850)? From the already published reviews, it spanks it across the board. The only difference would be overclocking headroom (which I believe what you may be getting at) and the 6870 being clocked so high, it may not have much headroom.

That's exactly what I'm getting at. Last I looked, only one review published results for 6870 OCing and it was pretty dismal, 954 core vs 900 stock IIRC. If they're all clocking that bad, suddenly a $170ish 460 1GB doesn't look so bad considering they pretty much all do at least 850 vs 675 stock. Anand included an EVGA FTW version (850mhz core) in their review and it beats or matches the 6870 and GTX 470 in most (all?) games.

That's the real story most reviews are missing. Nvidia for whatever reason released the 460 pretty much underclocked by default. Throw in a full 384 shader version (bet the GF104 yields are good enough to do it today, if they wanted) and clock it up to 750 or so by default and the game changes. Of course, they'd completely gut GTX 470 sales, and that wouldn't be good for business. I think we'll see such a card as soon as 470 stock is gone, probably priced to match the 6870.

For now, I'm wondering why so many reviewers aren't OCing the 6870s. Maybe it was one of the conditions to be sent an early card..

[I.M.O.G.]

Originally Posted by Nathan54AB

This isn't making sense. 3870 < 4870 < 5870 right? Ok, so why isn't 5870 < 6870? Also, isn't the 5850 more powerful than the 5770? If that's the case, why would the 5770 be close to a 6950 and 5850 be close to 6870?

Check again, I pm'd him and he mentioned he got his numbers mixed up. It's corrected now - just a friday and a long day of work, it tends to do that to people.

That makes more sense. So a 6870 will probably outclass a 5870?

Depends what you are looking at. For the most part, its going to trade punches.

[hokiealumnus]

Originally Posted by ratbuddy

For now, I'm wondering why so many reviewers aren't OCing the 6870s. Maybe it was one of the conditions to be sent an early card..

Not as far as I know. We were supposed to have one pre-release, but there were extenuating circumstances that led to some not getting them on time. Ours is reported as on the way and there is no such restriction applied.

[CharlieCS]

There are plenty of overclocked reviews.You really haven't looked at many besides guru3d it seems. Issues with some websites is that AMD used different VRM this time Chill instead of Volterra and software like MSI afterburner just doesn't support new voltage controller ,after it gets an update am sure 1GHz will be easy with some Vcore increase and these should reach 1GHz more consistently then say 5870 but 1050mhz is most I see these do 24/7 ,which is impressive considering it's still the same 40nm process.


Of course both 6850 and GTX460 have more headroom,but none of them will reach 6870 clocks And I expect a 850mhz gtx460 to consume more power as well.

[ratbuddy]

Originally Posted by CharlieCS

And I expect a 850mhz gtx460 to consume more power as well.

Not enough to require more power connectors. My stock 715mhz 460 is running 850 on 1.0v vs 0.987v stock and uses ~8 more watts at the wall than it does with stock clocks and volts.

[deathman20]

Originally Posted by ratbuddy

Not enough to require more power connectors. My stock 715mhz 460 is running 850 on 1.0v vs 0.987v stock and uses ~8 more watts at the wall than it does with stock clocks and volts.

8W? wow would of expected what 28W from a 18% increase in clock not a 5% increase (mind you off the base TDP of 160W)

[ratbuddy]

Originally Posted by deathman20

8W? wow would of expected what 28W from a 18% increase in clock not a 5% increase (mind you off the base TDP of 160W)

I would have thought it would be higher too, but playing a very demanding Crysis mod, I only see ~230 at the wall. It's about 222 watts with stock GPU clocks, and ~130 gaming on the IGP.

By comparison, my old GTX 280 showed 330 at the wall playing the same mod with everything else in the system the same.

Anyway

[Loo]

This is why I love my 5870... It still does not fall into middle class with performance. I'll stick with my old idea, get another one 5870 for CF and enjoy that for 2011.