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Old 04-26-11, 01:12 PM   #21
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I agree with nzaneb on this topic. I perform little upgrades here and there throughout each of my PCs lifetime. I may upgrade the CPU here and there as well, but it comes time to make a major jump...I save up and go big for the latest features. This usually entails a new motherboard to go with my new tech CPU. I expect this to happen and prepare for it.
As do I. I just didn't feel like the jump from the Q9xxx series to the i5 series was that major jump, and also didn't feel like the i5 to 2500k series was a major jump either (though it was certainly bigger). Q9xxx to 2500k? That's a major jump, and worth a new board.

I would be disappointed if Intel got into a habit of releasing a new socket for every chipset, that's all. I don't think I'm being unreasonable. The Core2 die shrink didn't require a new socket, and neither should the Sandy Bridge die shrink in my opinion. There's probably some good reason for it, but it makes me a little more hesitant to adopt the latest and greatest.

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Old 04-26-11, 01:21 PM   #22
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The point is not having to swap motherboards all the time. After getting a P5K, I haven't needed a new motherboard for years. I was able to put a low end Core2Duo in, then I was able to upgrade to a Q9400 later, which represented a big leap forward. I could have kept upgrading motherboards, gotten an X58 or a P45 or whatever, but I haven't needed to and it's been very low maintenance.

I don't want to buy a 2600K or whatever, and then have to get a new board with all the SAME features (USB 3.0 -> USB 3.0, SATA III -> SATA III, etc.) just to support a process shrink.
I definitely understand what you're saying. When you bought your P5K though, it was already capable of running a 45nm CPU (P35 was not released until 2007), so even if you didn't buy a 45nm CPU to go with it, they were already available at the time. Very similar to 1366, released with 45nm Quad's, and ended with 32nm Hex... all on one socket.

Aside from benching, I'm not worried about the latest and greatest either. See my edit below
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I would hate to see the 478 system I'm currently on, try and run a 8 core CPU, lol. It's bad enough that I have to rub it just the right way to get it to come on in the morning, and give it 20 minutes before it realizes that it is actually supposed to be doing something when I type or click

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Old 04-26-11, 01:26 PM   #23
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775 started with 90nm cpus, the P4 prescotts.
Then it got 65nm P4s.
Then there was a "new" power layout for core2 stuff.
Then 65nm c2.
Then 45nm c2.

And you could run all of those on a P35 board without a board or socket change, good old days

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Old 04-26-11, 01:27 PM   #24
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Man, I read this COMPLETELY the wrong way at first...
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It's bad enough that I have to rub it just the right way to get it to come on in the morning, and give it 20 minutes before it realizes that it is actually supposed to be doing something

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Old 04-26-11, 01:30 PM   #25
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775 started with 90nm cpus, the P4 prescotts.
Then it got 65nm P4s.
Then there was a "new" power layout for core2 stuff.
Then 65nm c2.
Then 45nm c2.

Ah yes, bob you are correct, lol. I forgot the 90nm stuff completely(for good reason too). The point remains though, you're still looking at a chipset upgrade (new motherboard) in order to run a 45nm quad.

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Man, I read this COMPLETELY the wrong way at first...
Hey now! My work computer maybe considered old, but I'm not "that" much of an old man, lol

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Old 04-26-11, 01:33 PM   #26
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Many people seem to think that lga775 had an enormous lifespan, it did not.
The issue here isn't whether 775 had an enormous lifespan. It's whether or not we ought to be happy that the effective lifespan of more modern sockets is dramatically less than we got used to during 775s reign. Personally, I find the reduced cpu manufacturing and update support we see with 1156 as annoying, even if I never owned a 1156 based system. If they will do it for 1156, why not 1155 and so on down the line....

The reason is, of course, I don't want to buy a new motherboard every year just to support a new CPU, because, as johan has said, often there are no updates beyond a new socket. In my situation this adds an extra layer of frustration, because while Sata 3 and USB 3 are nice upgrades, the performance benefit they give is trivial compared to going from one generation of CPU to the next.

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LGA775 was released in 2006 for 65nm CPU's. A year later they changed the chipset to allow support for the new 45nm CPU's (requiring you to change motherboards should you want to run a new CPU).
Quite flatly, this is false, or at least not true for all motherboards. I purchased an early Asus P5B along with a 65nm E6400, which ran and served me well until I upgraded to a 45nm Q8300 early in '10. So, according to your (corrected) timeline, 775 had two years active support, at which point X58 was released in Nov 08. 1156 came along in Sept 09. 1155 in Jan 2011.

That gives us three years between 775 and 1156; two systems that I would argue are more fairly comparable than would be 775 and 1136.

Now, how long do we have between the launches of 1156 and 1155, two highly comparable platforms? A year and a half. See what I'm getting at?

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Old 04-26-11, 01:42 PM   #27
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The bottom line here is as technology advances so does the need to issue upgraded equipment to accommodate these changes in features, look back over the last 20-30 years and you will see the exponential change trend in electronic hardware to host new applications etc, cellphone technology is probably the worst, I have had more cellphones the last two years than over the last 10

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Old 04-26-11, 01:46 PM   #28
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cellphone technology is probably the worst, I have had more cellphones the last two years than over the last 10
That's funny. I've had mine, the first I ever bought, for four years. I have a new one (exact same model) that I'll use once this one dies.

I've used it with SIM cards from the US, Greece, Russia, China, India, and Ethiopia with no problems.

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Old 04-26-11, 01:50 PM   #29
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Depends if you like upgrading to have the latest features, and I'm just a sucker for that, lol

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Old 04-26-11, 01:58 PM   #30
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or at least not true for all motherboards.
This is true. Not all motherboards were limited.


Ultimately, is the accelerating rate of technological advancement reducing the shelf life of components... yeah most definitely. Do I think it should slow down? No definitely not... I want quantum computing and holograms damn it! As manufacturing cost come down and platforms age, the component prices drop dramatically then, hover until discontinuation. Computers are more affordable now, than ever before. A new age requires new ways of thinking... Who wants to continue to do things the same way for a decade? I sure don't ... maybe it's just me. I'd rather see them push as far and as fast as possible.

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Old 04-26-11, 11:43 PM   #31
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Yes, but i think we are starting to see diminishing returns.

Let's imagine the new bulldozers/ivy bridges are capable of 5GHz. Apart from true number crunching software (CFD, FE etc) when is an 8-core 5GHz processor going to bottleneck your system? It will be years.

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Old 04-26-11, 11:58 PM   #32
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Yes, but i think we are starting to see diminishing returns.

Let's imagine the new bulldozers/ivy bridges are capable of 5GHz. Apart from true number crunching software (CFD, FE etc) when is an 8-core 5GHz processor going to bottleneck your system? It will be years.
We'll always find ways to use more crunching power.

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Old 04-27-11, 12:00 AM   #33
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Old 04-27-11, 12:45 AM   #34
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time to start upscaleing dvd's and running on a multiscreen super high res system, thats what these big video card setups are good for. Its the Main thing these large graphics cards are good at these days.

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Old 04-27-11, 01:19 AM   #35
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Old 05-02-11, 07:40 PM   #36
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Yes, but i think we are starting to see diminishing returns.

Let's imagine the new bulldozers/ivy bridges are capable of 5GHz. Apart from true number crunching software (CFD, FE etc) when is an 8-core 5GHz processor going to bottleneck your system? It will be years.
Well, that honestly depends on how well the software/programming community can scale with the hardware. Which in itself is quite hard to keep up as any type of advanced software (even games) can take several months to years to develop. But also who's to say that something in that world may not radically change the way things are done or how idea's are conceived into reality.

I mean really, who in any right mind can bitch about newer, faster hardware coming out. That statement above only feeds the idea of exponential development. Aside from the pride factor of not having the "new and shiny" thing anymore, what else gives? .. Nothing to be exact. What happens anytime something "late and great" hit's the market.. If not immediately, usually short to follow, are falling prices of the "almost late and still pretty great". When you purchase something, and you feel like you've done well for your $$, just because something else comes out shortly after, does that mean you've lost out?? You still got the performance you were so happy to have for the $$ at the time. So you've lost nothing, save maybe resell value. But let's face it.. that's the way with ANYTHING you buy.

just my .02

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Old 05-05-11, 12:13 AM   #37
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Apart from specialist applications, i can't imagine anything that will utilise 8 cores at 5 gig.

I think that soon we will be able to build computers that will last years rather than feeling the need to constantly upgrade.

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