Watercooling temps - My tuniq 120 was better.

Cmzwirner · Jul 7, 2009

So i recently built a watercooling setup. I did plenty of research and revised by parts list until it fit my budget, and promised me pretty good performance.

I got:

System Specs:
Intel Q6600 @ 3.4 GHZ
Asus Rampage Formula X48
ATi Raedon 4870x2
4GB Mushkin Extreme 1066 RAM
All powered by a PC Power and Cooling 860w PSU

Cooling setup:
Swiftech MCP655 Inline 12V DC Pump
Swiftech MCR320 QP
Swiftech Apogee GTZ CPU Waterblock
Danger Den 4870x2 Full Coverage Block
Swiftech MCR220 QP
PVC Tubing

Now im wondering.. With this setup, why am i getting such horrible temps?

I have the loop going:

Pump>GPU>220 Rad>CPU>Rad>T-line>Pump.

Ambient temps are 12C..

I dont know whats wrong!

I have the MCR320 mounted in the front of my antec 1200, and my mcr 220 mounted where the exhaust fans were. I also have a fan on the side of the case blowing cold air into it to feed the 220.

Help?

Bobnova · Jul 7, 2009

First thing i'd do is try it with the sides of the case off, and with a big ole household fan aimed in that direction.

Spawn-Inc · Jul 7, 2009

what fans do you have on the rads?

have you tried reseating the water block? to much or little tim?

LabRat23 · Jul 7, 2009

I have almost the exact same watercooling setup and thats about the same temps I get with an E6850 with the fans barely turning for silent running. My first guess would be bad airflow to the radiator (which I have), or bad seating of the waterblock. It's not very hard to seat the wb improperly with the hoses torquing it over, especially if it is Home Depot tubing.

Edit:
Check for a kink in the tubing too. Sometimes it looks ok when you put it all together, but hours later one of the turns in the tube buckles and pinches off the flow.

Pics of your rig with the side open will help.

Cmzwirner · Jul 7, 2009

LabRat23 said:
I have almost the exact same watercooling setup and thats about the same temps I get with an E6850 with the fans barely turning for silent running. My first guess would be bad airflow to the radiator (which I have), or bad seating of the waterblock. It's not very hard to seat the wb improperly with the hoses torquing it over, especially if it is Home Depot tubing.

Edit:
Check for a kink in the tubing too. Sometimes it looks ok when you put it all together, but hours later one of the turns in the tube buckles and pinches off the flow.

Pics of your rig with the side open will help.

Its that exact setup, with an extra MCR220 rad mounted on the back. There is a slight kink going from the rad to the pump. But that shouldnt be causing the crazy temps. Thats my rig before i added the 22o rad.

On the MCR320, i have yate loon 47CFM fans, and on the 220 i have Scythe Kaze 50CFM fans.

I do not have a fan controller, so they may be running slower than their listed CFM, but i dont have room for a fan controller. Is there any way that i can set these things to their max RPM if they are running slow, without a drive bay fan controller?

Conumdrum · Jul 7, 2009

You got a Q6600 at 1.48 volts massive rads and say 33C on the cores (avg). Cool. So, what is your load temps? Idle means squat, nada, woohoo.

Fannage. If they are connected directly to a 12 VDC Molex, they ARE at max speed. The fans should be fine as is.

My I7 965 idles at 35C at 80F room temp. But I load at 57C after 30 min at 82F cuz my room heats up.

Room temp 52F? Wow, lucky freezin you.

Load er' up idle means nothing.

Wait, where is your radiators? You have clean airflow? Pics don't show much.

And the CPU inlet is on the port marked with a dot? Has to be there or temps suck.

Neuromancer · Jul 7, 2009

Benefit of WCing is in load temps. If you are getting 33C load, than WAHOO!!!

I expect with that setup you are still under 40C.

Gotta remember you are dumping all that GPU heat into the same line as the cpu so idle temps will be higher, and it will take a lot longer for idle temps to drop down than they would on air as well. (plus you are dumping pump heat into the loop as well so idle may not ever be what it could on air)

Cmzwirner · Jul 7, 2009

I always forget to post my load temps.

My load temps are: core 0: 48c Core 1: 51c Core 2: 40c Core 3: 40c

Ever since i first put this machine together, even with the tuniq tower, core 0 and 1 were always 10C-15C above core 2 and 3. By talking with people, i have pretty much concluded that i have a bad chip.

I have been reading online, and it also seems that most of the q6600's that were made in q3 of 2007/q1 of 2008, are terrible overclockers. That would explain why i have to give thins thing 1.5 volts to even reach 3.6ghz, unstable. It could alos explain my heat problems.

Once the q9550's drop in price, im going to sell my q6600, and pick a q9550 up.

Wow. And im noticing a kink that i have never seen before. Thank god i have leftover 90 degree bends.

schmide · Jul 7, 2009

You may have some dead air spots because of those 3 fans sucking all the air out. It seems a bit unlikely because of all those fans, but you would be surprised. The tuniq 120 may have caused turbulence around your socket and made the area a bit cooler.

Often watercooling causes higher temps in the area around the socket due to the lack of air movement. This can lead to higher idle temps but who cares, as Conumdrum pointed out load temps are really all that matters.

About your fans. Most motherboards have some level of fan control, you could try hooking them up there and playing around with the bios settings. You could also point a fan down at your socket and see if your idle temps change.

schmide · Jul 7, 2009

Oh yeah. The way your picture shows it you have the 4870x2 before your CPU, that's a maximum of 130x2=260w heat before any liquid hits your CPU. (less at idle probably 60-100w) Video cards care less about heat? What are the temps of the 4870s?

Edit: I missed the blurb about the extra rad you slipped in there. OOPS disregard.

Conumdrum · Jul 7, 2009

No clamps...............Hmmmm

Neuromancer · Jul 7, 2009

Cmzwirner said:
I always forget to post my load temps.

My load temps are: core 0: 48c Core 1: 51c Core 2: 40c Core 3: 40c

Ever since i first put this machine together, even with the tuniq tower, core 0 and 1 were always 10C-15C above core 2 and 3. By talking with people, i have pretty much concluded that i have a bad chip.

I have been reading online, and it also seems that most of the q6600's that were made in q3 of 2007/q1 of 2008, are terrible overclockers. That would explain why i have to give thins thing 1.5 volts to even reach 3.6ghz, unstable. It could alos explain my heat problems.

Once the q9550's drop in price, im going to sell my q6600, and pick a q9550 up.

Wow. And im noticing a kink that i have never seen before. Thank god i have leftover 90 degree bends.

Okay got in a big row about this elsewhere... People do not trust software voltage temps... why do they trust software temperature temps?

Bizarre to me. (what makes it crazy is when people post idle temps in the 20s... in most cases because average room temp is 72F, which in C is 22... in the winter I understand it.. its chilled air... but... thats not true idle...)

Does all software do it? OR just the one you like? Important.

If all software reports it off by that much, even OEM chips get 1 yr warranty I would send it back.

schmide said:
Oh yeah. The way your picture shows it you have the 4870x2 before your CPU, that's a maximum of 130x2=260w heat before any liquid hits your CPU. (less at idle probably 60-100w) Video cards care less about heat? What are the temps of the 4870s?

Edit: I missed the blurb about the extra rad you slipped in there. OOPS disregard.

1) I do not know the flow/dissipation ratio even if I did I could not calculate it without the formula, but I imagine that with that high a flow (he has a hi flow pump I think) placement does not matter, since the liquid is treated as a continuous unit. (IE long time to heat up/cool off)

2) All chips are different. Stepping manufacture date, hell the silicon might have a defect in it... yes some oc better than others in a week or a batch. What is 1.5 might be 1.35 on another....

schmide · Jul 7, 2009

Neur0mancer said:
1) I do not know the flow/dissipation ratio even if I did I could not calculate it without the formula, but I imagine that with that high a flow (he has a hi flow pump I think) placement does not matter, since the liquid is treated as a continuous unit. (IE long time to heat up/cool off)

I can't remember where I read it but a typical maximum temperature delta, hottest to coolest water temperature in a loop, was like 2c. You could consider a 4870x2 equal to 2 high end CPUs. Regardless, the fact that the OP has a rad between the 4870x2 and the CPU, made any point I was arguing moot.

His idle temps weren't that bad so I was looking for something that would explain a few degree differential.

Edit:

Neur0mancer said:
If all software reports it off by that much, even OEM chips get 1 yr warranty I would send it back.

WTH you can't send back a chip because it doesn't report temperatures exactly. After you overclocked it and bumped up the voltage, you voided your warranty anyways.

jdf_warrior · Jul 7, 2009

His 4.0ghz load temps are about the same as my 3.6ghz idle temps (on air), and he's complaining.. I oughta slap you

MIAHALLEN · Jul 7, 2009

Temps look fine to me too

hokiealumnus · Jul 7, 2009

Cmzwirner said:
I always forget to post my load temps.

My load temps are: core 0: 48c Core 1: 51c Core 2: 40c Core 3: 40c

Ever since i first put this machine together, even with the tuniq tower, core 0 and 1 were always 10C-15C above core 2 and 3. By talking with people, i have pretty much concluded that i have a bad chip.

I have been reading online, and it also seems that most of the q6600's that were made in q3 of 2007/q1 of 2008, are terrible overclockers. That would explain why i have to give thins thing 1.5 volts to even reach 3.6ghz, unstable. It could alos explain my heat problems.

Once the q9550's drop in price, im going to sell my q6600, and pick a q9550 up.

Wow. And im noticing a kink that i have never seen before. Thank god i have leftover 90 degree bends.

Ok, I'm very confused. If 3.6GHz, UNstable takes 1.5v...and you're running 4.0GHz, presumably stable...what Vcore are you running right now?

...and you're getting 40C load temps on two of your cores at 4GHz & 1.5v+ on a Q6600... Sure, uh-huh. What program are you using?

...and you claim that an air cooler (any air cooler) performs better?

I don't buy your load temps for one, especially at that Vcore. I also don't buy that any air cooler on the market could produce temps anywhere near where you're at with even 1.5v, much less more than that.

Please forgive the admittedly somewhat adversarial nature of this post; it's not my normal tone. You have just thrown me for a loop. Some of the things you are saying either do not jive with the rest of what you're saying, are produced by faulty software and/or are just plain not possible.

Lucy, you've got some 'splaining to do.

Cmzwirner · Jul 7, 2009

hokiealumnus said:
Ok, I'm very confused. If 3.6GHz, UNstable takes 1.5v...and you're running 4.0GHz, presumably stable...what Vcore are you running right now?

...and you're getting 40C load temps on two of your cores at 4GHz & 1.5v+ on a Q6600... Sure, uh-huh. What program are you using?

...and you claim that an air cooler (any air cooler) performs better?

I don't buy your load temps for one, especially at that Vcore. I also don't buy that any air cooler on the market could produce temps anywhere near where you're at with even 1.5v, much less more than that.

Please forgive the admittedly somewhat adversarial nature of this post; it's not my normal tone. You have just thrown me for a loop. Some of the things you are saying either do not jive with the rest of what you're saying, are produced by faulty software and/or are just plain not possible.

Lucy, you've got some 'splaining to do.

I read over my entire post, and nowhere did i say i was at 4.0.

My tuniq was keeping my idle temps at 12C-20C, and load temps at under 45C. But that was in the winter, in Maine. I think i might be overreacting a little bit. I expected way too much out of water cooling. But i am still very satisfied.

The one thing that is really aggrivating me, is my annoying non overclockable chip.

Time to sell it and get a new one.

@ Conumdrum: Clamps are everywhere now. Just got my package 3 days ago.

Automata · Jul 7, 2009

Cmzwirner said:
I read over my entire post, and nowhere did i say i was at 4.0.

Your very first post says 4.0.

Cmzwirner said:
I got:

System Specs:
Intel Q6600 @ 4.0 GHZ
Asus Rampage Formula X48
ATi Raedon 4870x2
4GB Mushkin Extreme 1066 RAM
All powered by a PC Power and Cooling 860w PSU

I'm assuming it was a typo?

darkcow · Jul 7, 2009

well, yea, in winter your temps will be significantly lower. Ambient temps mean a lot. Now I bet in the winter in the upcoming months your temps will be even lower. My winter load temps are below 40c. Summer its topping at about 65c. I'm in GA and it is hot as balls in my room right now... I'm not wearing a shirt and I'm sweating... The things I sacrifice for 3.6ghz... PS, there is no way that an air cooler can perform better than your current loop. What were your temps with the air cooler back in summer? In all honesty I think your temps are fine and actually great.

I would LOVE your temps... Look at mine...

Cmzwirner · Jul 7, 2009

Oops. I must have been zoning out when i typed that.

Im @ 3.35 on 1.55 volts with those temps.

And this is me an my computers first summer together. <3

Ill see next winter.

And in a few days im going to try lapping for even lower temps!

Ill do anything to keep this thing as cold as possible. Not because i want a max OC, just because i enjoy it.

Watercooling temps - My tuniq 120 was better.

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