i was thinking of buying this monitor http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/t...9-9688113?v=glance&s=electronics&vi=tech-data at costco on black friday. Is it worth it for gaming or will it be way blury compared to my crt running at 60hrz
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25ms Lcd good enough for gaming?
- Thread starter Nukemall
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- Aug 23, 2003
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You don't need to be worried about the 60Hz thing. 60Hz on a TFT looks quite different to 60Hz on a CRT. You don't have to worry about bluriness.
Also, I think 25ms should be fast enough for gaming.
EDIT: How wrong was I to say that! ^^^
thanks for pointing that out acesea!
But, it is best to ask for some more opinions before spending your money on a new monitor, as I haven't heard of that brand before. But I'm no expert on the screens front, so best thing would be to ask for some input from the experts in the screens section. The screens section of the forums is here: http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=97
I'm sure there are plenty of experts there that can give you excellent advice.
Also, I think 25ms should be fast enough for gaming.
EDIT: How wrong was I to say that! ^^^
thanks for pointing that out acesea!But, it is best to ask for some more opinions before spending your money on a new monitor, as I haven't heard of that brand before. But I'm no expert on the screens front, so best thing would be to ask for some input from the experts in the screens section. The screens section of the forums is here: http://forum.oc-forums.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=97
I'm sure there are plenty of experts there that can give you excellent advice.
Last edited:
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As shiyan mentioned, the refresh rate spec that a crt goes by (ie 60hz) has no correlation to the 60hz specified on lcds. Reason being is that lcds pixels are always on, or off for that matter, displaying colors. They are never refreshed or rescanned as they are on crts.
Next thing regarding the response time of 25ms, me personally, id say no, its too slow. Let me elaborate on this, it is a known fact that most manufacturers arent very truthfull reporting accurate specifications dealing with contrast and response time. Furthermore, its difficult to test these specs as the guidelines themselves are not defined all too clearly. For example, is the response time from black to white to black? If so, then that result will definately vary if other colors are chosen, and so on, etc. Some other manufacturers on the other hand may be conservative with there specs, and the monitor may seem to perform better than it looks on paper. There are plenty of reviews on the net when the author would state that when putting two different monitors next to each other, ie hypothetically a 25ms and 35ms monitor, occasionally the supposed slower monitor would blur less. This just goes to show how unaccurate these specs are.
So what I am aiming at, is either before purchasing the monitor, read a lot of user comments or reviews on it from credible sources. Otherwise go to a store, and spend sometime playing games on it.
What I can tell you for SURE is that ghosting *will* be prevalent on 25ms monitor, no doubt about that. Question is, depending on your expecations, you will decide how much is too much. Ive got a 16ms 17" panel, the one produced by AU Opt... something or other,(fyi there are a lot of companies using this exact panel) and in windows its clear that I dont have the response time of a crt. Say when moving windows around, the text inside the window blurs a bit but it is definately still legible, other than that, i really have to try to look out for the blur to notice it. Ive done the same on some slower response time lcds, and when moving windows around, or for example scrolling a internet page in internet explorer, you cant make any sense of the text. In games, there might have been perhaps just a couple times that I actually noticed even any blur, so thats a real good thing. I have friends who own nice sony and other crt tubes and they really enjoy playing games on my lcd.
Hope this helps you out.
P.s. I KNOW there will be others posting that they have a 25ms lcd and they can play games without a problem. All I can say is, when you get a chance, grab a peak at 16ms, or 20ms lcds, especially those that will be coming out very soon and THEN tell me if you still cant tell a difference
Next thing regarding the response time of 25ms, me personally, id say no, its too slow. Let me elaborate on this, it is a known fact that most manufacturers arent very truthfull reporting accurate specifications dealing with contrast and response time. Furthermore, its difficult to test these specs as the guidelines themselves are not defined all too clearly. For example, is the response time from black to white to black? If so, then that result will definately vary if other colors are chosen, and so on, etc. Some other manufacturers on the other hand may be conservative with there specs, and the monitor may seem to perform better than it looks on paper. There are plenty of reviews on the net when the author would state that when putting two different monitors next to each other, ie hypothetically a 25ms and 35ms monitor, occasionally the supposed slower monitor would blur less. This just goes to show how unaccurate these specs are.
So what I am aiming at, is either before purchasing the monitor, read a lot of user comments or reviews on it from credible sources. Otherwise go to a store, and spend sometime playing games on it.
What I can tell you for SURE is that ghosting *will* be prevalent on 25ms monitor, no doubt about that. Question is, depending on your expecations, you will decide how much is too much. Ive got a 16ms 17" panel, the one produced by AU Opt... something or other,(fyi there are a lot of companies using this exact panel) and in windows its clear that I dont have the response time of a crt. Say when moving windows around, the text inside the window blurs a bit but it is definately still legible, other than that, i really have to try to look out for the blur to notice it. Ive done the same on some slower response time lcds, and when moving windows around, or for example scrolling a internet page in internet explorer, you cant make any sense of the text. In games, there might have been perhaps just a couple times that I actually noticed even any blur, so thats a real good thing. I have friends who own nice sony and other crt tubes and they really enjoy playing games on my lcd.
Hope this helps you out.
P.s. I KNOW there will be others posting that they have a 25ms lcd and they can play games without a problem. All I can say is, when you get a chance, grab a peak at 16ms, or 20ms lcds, especially those that will be coming out very soon and THEN tell me if you still cant tell a difference
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2001
I have cheap Kogi from best buy, some say it's 40ms others 20ms others 16ms.
I don't really know
but anyways, it does good. Every once in awhile I notice a little glitch but it's so brief. Color also looks alot better on lcds, when u get a lcd you will be like why in the world was i doing with that crt.
I play anything from first peron shooters to strategy.
I don't really know
but anyways, it does good. Every once in awhile I notice a little glitch but it's so brief. Color also looks alot better on lcds, when u get a lcd you will be like why in the world was i doing with that crt.
I play anything from first peron shooters to strategy.
Beg to differ here "25ms ghosting will be prevalent" is wrong, maybe on older LCD's that was true. I have a 19 Samsung 191T and it is statedto be 25 ms response and I do not have "prevalent ghosting" in fact I get minimal ghosting and ONLY in extremely busy screens in UT2003 and that is very minimal in fact you need to look for it.
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2003
bigredhog said:
It's not wrong. Whether or not you see it depends on your eyes. It's a fact that any 25ms panel will blur. However, it all depends on your level of preference and how much of it you can actually see. All 16ms/20ms panels blur to some extent also. Again its based on your own eyes and personal preference. Unless you play a lot of high speed fps games like ut2003, 25ms should be fine.
edit: I use a 25ms panel, and its perfect for me. For me the blurring is minimal; just like it is for bigredhog. In fact, I bought my samsung 172t after trying out the 191t and loving it.
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2001
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- Stokesdale, North Carolina
I have had my Viewsonic VX800 LCD (25ns) for over a month and I love it. It's great! I play a lot of UT2k3 and it plays it fine. Sure if you are only a full time gamer and do nothing else, maybe one would complain about it. But I honestly can't say it's a problem although if I wanted to be picky I could say I could faintly notice blurring once in awhile.(Isn't hardly any games that would blur a LCD any faster than UT2k3 either.)
I waited a long time before going LCD because of all these stories about LCDs blurring. Actually I was concerned about blurring even after I ordered my LCD, but I went ahead with the LCD because they offered so many more positives besides the one slight negative of game blurring. I just couldn't stand the harshness of crts on my eyes any longer. After a month on my Viewsonic I would NEVER ever go back to crts again!
I think it is closer to compare the reponse times of LCDs to the refresh rate frequency of crts from the standpoint that your LCD refresh rate has less in common with the crts refresh rate, but rather its' the response time that compares to the crts refresh rate. For example you know basically what happens when you run a crt with low refresh rates. It flickers. And regardless to what refresh rate you run your crt, your eyes will get tired from the combination of light and flickering.(yes it even effects your eyes at high refresh rates except not nearly as bad.) OTOH LCDs doesn't have a scanning gun, so their refresh rate does not refer to how many lines a scan gun does per second. However it does refer to how many times the LCD turns itself on and off in a second. The difference is there is no flicker because there were no lines drawn in the first place. In place of that is what we know as blurring, which is what takes places on LCDs because of the on/off speed relationship.
All in all the LCD is going to give the smoother or better image depending on what you are looking for in the first place. But I'll gladly trade just a little blurring in LCDs in place of sore tired eyes from crts any day. Plus LCDs weigh less and consume 2/3 less energy than crts. No radiation either. So LCDs may have their problem, but so to does crts......
Cheers,
Mike
I waited a long time before going LCD because of all these stories about LCDs blurring. Actually I was concerned about blurring even after I ordered my LCD, but I went ahead with the LCD because they offered so many more positives besides the one slight negative of game blurring. I just couldn't stand the harshness of crts on my eyes any longer. After a month on my Viewsonic I would NEVER ever go back to crts again!
I think it is closer to compare the reponse times of LCDs to the refresh rate frequency of crts from the standpoint that your LCD refresh rate has less in common with the crts refresh rate, but rather its' the response time that compares to the crts refresh rate. For example you know basically what happens when you run a crt with low refresh rates. It flickers. And regardless to what refresh rate you run your crt, your eyes will get tired from the combination of light and flickering.(yes it even effects your eyes at high refresh rates except not nearly as bad.) OTOH LCDs doesn't have a scanning gun, so their refresh rate does not refer to how many lines a scan gun does per second. However it does refer to how many times the LCD turns itself on and off in a second. The difference is there is no flicker because there were no lines drawn in the first place. In place of that is what we know as blurring, which is what takes places on LCDs because of the on/off speed relationship.
All in all the LCD is going to give the smoother or better image depending on what you are looking for in the first place. But I'll gladly trade just a little blurring in LCDs in place of sore tired eyes from crts any day. Plus LCDs weigh less and consume 2/3 less energy than crts. No radiation either. So LCDs may have their problem, but so to does crts......
Cheers,
Mike
Last edited:
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- Mar 28, 2001
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- Stokesdale, North Carolina
MuEagle05 said:
Should be fine. I've had no problems there either.
Cheers,
Mike
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2003
dvd's are fine. 25ms is about 43fps, while a dvd is 24fps. However, different colors have different response times (greys can be as high as 50-100ms). So even though I can't see a thing, I bet a hardcore reviewer could see some stuff in super fast scenes from the matrix and the like.
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SnComet2 said:
Yeah you about hit it square there.
The way I look at it though, is fast fps games like UT2k3 will push the refresh rates harder and faster than a DVD would. So if a game such as UT2k3 is acceptable on a LCD then DVDs would be also. OTOH if you look, there has been large sized LCD TVs out for awhile now. So they have to be acceptable to a lot of people also.
As for the hardcore reviewer being more critical, of course they are, but they would also be criticizing something that most people(I would say the average audience.) would not be bothered with, nor would notice, nor would be bothered by what little they did notice. All in all I think the hardcore reviewer lives in his own world. I do not take them, any reviewer's recommendations as gospel.
Cheers,
Mike
