isnt overclocking/bios modding stealing?

isnt overclocking a cpu/cpu stealing? and modding a cd-rw bios to burn faster stealing? turning a non raid card to raid stealing?
whats the difference between this and making *backups* of all my software (assuming i dont share it tho)? i am getting stuff for free, am i not? isnt this the same/similiar to getting software for free(which i dont condone doing)?
i would like your input on this.
by the way, i'm an overclocker/modder too. not a cracker. only thing i crack are nuts.

IMHO its not stealing at all. dunno bout hole raid card thing but others is basically taking a risk by voiding warranty and getting the full extent of your product (CPU, CDRW ). Factory mainly sells stuff at safe limits where it will operate normal 100percent of time, but overclocking the user takes chance and goes for full extent of product where it may not be perfectly stabe 24/7 and require additional parts (water cooling) that factory wouldnt provide. . ANYWAYs when we buy it, its our product to technically do whatever with as long as legal, and it doesnt say anywheres that modding a product is illegal. Like modding a car to go faster isnt stealing a ferrari.......

I don't think it's stealing... when you buy software, music, etc you are not buying it, rather buying a liscense to use it. When you buy hardware, you are actually buying it.

GotNoRice - I don't think it's stealing... when you buy software, music, etc you are not buying it, rather buying a liscense to use it. When you buy hardware, you are actually buying it.

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you hit it on the head but the fun part is the same Q about DSS you buy the hardware but you have to pay to get the key to the infomation their sending to you already?!?!

you bought the hardware, you can do with it as you please.

but i cant reverse engineer it tho, can i? and i can copy it. assmuing i have the stuff to make it.

well.. AMD reverse engineered the pentium cpus.. so why not?

the-one1 said:

isnt overclocking a cpu/cpu stealing? and modding a cd-rw bios to burn faster stealing? turning a non raid card to raid stealing?
whats the difference between this and making *backups* of all my software (assuming i dont share it tho)? i am getting stuff for free, am i not? isnt this the same/similiar to getting software for free(which i dont condone doing)?
i would like your input on this.
by the way, i'm an overclocker/modder too. not a cracker. only thing i crack are nuts.

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When you buy the hardware then it should be yours to mod as you please.

Its only stealing when it breaks due to the mods and you try to return it for warranty!

My .02
Al

I totally agree. And here's why.

The car analogy is a good one. Say you take your little Honda Civic with a smallish 4 cyl engine, you install a turbocharger, headers, a new chip, performance plugs, etc. Have you stolen anything? No, you just did a little modification to make your Civic a little faster, a little more powerful.

The guys at the Honda dealership probably would have prefered for you to buy the more expensive, more powerful car to begin with. But you definately havent stolen anything from them.

And I totally agree with Maximouse. If you break your hardware, it's your fault. Overclocking and modification (almost always) voids any and all warranties. Trying to return a "defective" product to the seller for a refund that you broke *is* stealing.

Modding hardware is different from making "backups" of software. When you buy software, you're not really buying the actual code on the CD...you're buying the right to use that software. Almost all software I have ever used includes an end-user license agreement (that you have to agree to before installing/using the software). In most cases, this agreement says exactly what sort of backups you are allowed to make. If this agreement says "yeah, make all the copies you want, pass 'em out to your buddies" then you can. But, it usually doesn't say that

Pirating/copying software *is* stealing. As I said, when you buy software, you're not buying the actual software, you're buying the right to use it. If you make copies of the software to give out, you are stealing the right to use the software, and giving it to someone else.

But reverse engineering is actualy illegal if the hardware you are reversing is unique and patented, Such as the Sony walkman ( I beleive most companies have to or used to have to pay a royalty) Also the CD was developed by Philips and companies had to pay royalties ( I could be wrong here with the above examples) But my father developed a test unit for testing curcuit boards that would tell you where a fault was he copyrighted this as it was totaly unique to the market, It is now used in alot of manufacturing plants and my fathers company makes alot of maney from it!

You can reverse engineer all you want if you arent planning to sell your invention..
Say you had a power supply and wanted to make another- so you took it apart to see how it was made and built a copy. Thats not stealing. However, if you were to make 1000 copies and sell it under your own brand name it would.

nealric said:

You can reverse engineer all you want if you arent planning to sell your invention..
Say you had a power supply and wanted to make another- so you took it apart to see how it was made and built a copy. Thats not stealing. However, if you were to make 1000 copies and sell it under your own brand name it would.

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Reverse engineering is not illegal per se. Many companies reverse engineer competitors' products to try to determine if their competitors are infringing their patents. It is however, usually quite an expensive proposition, so that helps reign in the amount of it that actually occurs.

Where you normally run into issues with reverse engineering is with software. Since you don't own it (i.e., you have only licensed it), you are only allowed to do what the license allows. And if you look at most any software license for commercial software, you will a prohibition of reverse engineering/ decompiling.

EDIT: btw, with respect to reverse engineering something and making one for your own use, that is prohibited, too, if the invention is patented. A patent owner/holder has the right to prohibit others from making and using an invention as well as selling it.

Copying a CD isn't illegal (much) or immoral, distributing it is (whether you charge for it or not).
Releasing 2 identical drives at different prices is immoral as far as I'm concerned, akin to price fixing if you ask me.

overclocking and modding is NOT stealing...it is like cutting your case and putting a window in it...should you have bought the case WITH the window in it...did you steal because you changed what you had? what about painting YOUR house...it didn't come that color...but it suits you more...why are you stealing your house...come on...you are getting more for what you paid for and that is it

Reverse engineering is not illegal per se.

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It is if any part of the product is patented (which is usually the case)

if I buy a brand new car and it goes 75miles per hour and I tune it up so it will do 125 miles per hour am I stealling something?

I think this thread should probably be moved to the "debates" forum, if any mods are paying attention.

Although, it really isn't much of a debate, as I believe most everyone that sees this will be in agreement

Yeah, you buy a product. Your processor is no longer amd's. Your cd burner is no longer Lite-On's. What are you stealing? You're merely tweaking it.

In equivalence, software can be tweaked. You just can't make duplicates of it.

ahh yo guys one question how about modding and then sell it like for example when those store guys unlocked the p2 and tricked ppl to buy it like buying the cpu from intel for 100 bucks and it only runs at 350mhz and then u unlock it to 450 and sell it for like 400 bucks? is that illegal

when those store guys unlocked the p2 and tricked ppl to buy it like buying the cpu from intel for 100 bucks and it only runs at 350mhz and then u unlock it to 450 and sell it for like 400 bucks? is that illegal

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I believe it is.

If it isn't, it should be. It's certainly immoral.