Slit Edge Waterblock

Anyone agree this may be the best commercial block ?
looks great...
http://becooling.safeshopper.com/6/191.htm?499

lol Here come the commercial clones at least they BeCooling waited a while before they put out a WW clone, unlike some companies

I'm gonna say the white water still prob has it beat, but I would like to see how it fairs in a BillA water block test

its still new, we gotta wait for some people to try it out first.
It has a very nice design, but the micro channels, are not that small. Plus it only has 2 barbs, unlike lwwr with 3 which improves it.
For $55, i wouldn't really complain though...
amd/p4 holes is a nice feature too.. Can't wait for the reviews

Humm it may does a very good job cooling the P4
well, wait the results...

it actually looks kinda decent, and not at all a LRWW clone.... not even close. if you think thats a clone of the LRWW, then a tc-4 is a clone of a maze1

Jon

I have to rant at all these WB makers claiming things like this (directly from the becooling site):

"This is one of the highest (if not best) performing blocks currently on the market for AMD and P4 cpus."

Please SHOW me some data to prove how it performs. It looks like it would be no better than a TC-4.

Looks decent, especially for peltiers.

JFettig said:

it actually looks kinda decent, and not at all a LRWW clone.... not even close. if you think thats a clone of the LRWW, then a tc-4 is a clone of a maze1

Jon

Click to expand...

Not even close?! and a tc-4 is an improvement on design over a maze1, I don't see any improvement in the Be block

Korndog said:

its still new, we gotta wait for some people to try it out first.
It has a very nice design, but the micro channels, are not that small. Plus it only has 2 barbs, unlike lwwr with 3 which improves it.
For $55, i wouldn't really complain though...
amd/p4 holes is a nice feature too.. Can't wait for the reviews

Click to expand...

I was going to say that a center barb could just be added, but the two existing barbs are so close to each other...

JML said:

Not even close?! and a tc-4 is an improvement on design over a maze1, I don't see any improvement in the Be block

Click to expand...

It has slits across the die... they are not relatively close to the size of the WW's - the size difference has a huge effect on surface area over the die.

It does not have any die area impingement from a third central inlet barb... No velocity of water forcefully hitting the above die area. That is also another very important feature of the WW. The importance of die area impingment velocity to performance has been shown by BillA.

Perhaps to many it would seem like a clone at first glance but the slight variations it has change the crucial features of the WW.

Overbrazil said:

Anyone agree this may be the best commercial block ?
looks great...
http://becooling.safeshopper.com/6/191.htm?499

Click to expand...

It is important to have a solid understanding of what makes a block work in order to compare it to another block. Similar looks alone obviously do not qualify - I noted two VERY important differences above.

For example, these are Cathars words:

• High water velocity can be even more important than high water volume, even if it means making the block somewhat restrictive by some standards.
• The bulk of the heat does not spread laterally very far from a CPU die, so there is little point in attempting to cool the edges.
• Total surface area directly above the CPU die is very important, to a point.
• Water forcibly striking the area directly above the CPU die is very important.
• The copper base-plate should only be thick enough to transfer heat as quickly as possible to a larger surface area where it can be dissipated.

Click to expand...

Source: http://www.overclockers.com/articles692/

Now grade this waterblock to these standards, which the designer of the Whitewater block deems MOST IMPORTANT...













Whatdya get?

I would say it might fit one if it's lucky, perhaps if we were generous maybe it fits 2 of those qualities. It no longer seems similar to me.

If this block performs any better than your average block I would be surprised. I wager that it won't perform like a $55 block.

More input:

Originally posted by NeoMoses - on the Whitewater
Central Jet Impingement blocks like this work so well because of the massive convection coefficient directly above the CPU die. (among other reasons.)

Click to expand...

This was originally posted by Cathar on how you could improve the Whitewater design, note that this slit fin block goes in the other direction from how he wanted to improve the WW:

The trick here is to make the block finer, in all aspects. Pretty much shrink it down in all dimensions. I'm working on this with 0.5mm and 0.4mm channels trying to find a balance of pressure-drop, fin height, machine time, structural integrity, etc, etc. The finer the block, the thinner the base-plate can be, which means the lower the thermal gradient through the copper. 0.4mm (or 0.396mm for the imperial guys using 1/64" slitter saws) is getting pretty close to pushing the limits of affordable, reliable, and repeatable methods in conventional machining. In fact, 0.4mm wide channels may already be too fine for the pumps that people use. As the channel width is dropped, the fin width and fin height must also be dropped, which makes the resultant block ever so more restrictive. I'll be taking about 20% off the nozzle width, and am getting a custom mill bit made up to machine it into the proper nozzle shape in an attempt to boost water velocity without increasing the pressure-drop across the nozzle.

Click to expand...

agree 100% with you, I.M.O.G.
But, this block might be pretty good for P4, seeing that they have such a large heatspreader.
I bet with a little bit of hacking away at that block with a dremel to add more surface area.
i could probably do something like this within a few min. with a dremel and a thin cutting disk...

hope becooling does sue me for hacking the picture, lol

Becooling would probably be more likely to threaten suit against the forums... the reason some of the forum rules are so tight on certain subjects is because the forums have no money to combat any legal proceedings. A single court case could possibly destroy the forums, IMO.

As far as that picture goes, it is almost using pins instead of microchannels:

bigben2k said:

The microfins in WW help tremendously to spread the heat away from the baseplate: pins will not replace them for better performance.

Click to expand...

aww...
okey how about cutting colums in half?
1/32" instead maybe???
how large are the microfins on the LWWR, it doesn't say on cather's site..

I thought the forum wasn't responsible for what people put on it... becooling would sue me though, i'm a loyal customer

Korndog said:

aww...
okey how about cutting colums in half?
1/32" instead maybe???
how large are the microfins on the LWWR, it doesn't say on cather's site..

I thought the forum wasn't responsible for what people put on it... becooling would sue me though, i'm a loyal customer

Click to expand...

Well cutting 1/16" fins in half would not make 1/32" fins - but perhaps it would help anyways, there would be more surface area there. The bigger problem IMO is the lack of a central inlet. And I don't know what the base thickness is. Mind that I'm no expert at all, but these are just the things that the experts like Cathar and Neomoses and BillA seem to emphasize most IMO.

Looking on fin width... be back with an edit.

Think again on where the responsibility lies... And it doesn't even matter if anyone could win a case against the forums, it only matters if they can bring a case to court. I doubt we could/would foot the costs for a lawyer to even show up... Unless flounder volunteered.

EDIT:

Originally posted by Neomoses
The WW has 1mm wide fins and channels.

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You couldn't make those fins 1mm... they would have to be smaller yet... and then technical milling difficulties come into play. Methods and milling techniques have been discussed and developed to go narrower than 1mm, but it isn't easy.

1mm isn't that small
sure.. milling would be hard, but what about someone with hand tools and a lot of time on their hands?
a center inlet barb and thickness of the block do play a big part, but becooling hasn't supplied us with that information...
Has anyone ordered this block?? plan to??

I didn't originally intend to take this discussion so far, as it has completely overrun the thread, however in this case I do not mind at all because threads like these and salesmanship like that in the original link can terribly mislead people... False claims without any groundings.

I'm not familiar enough with metal working or milling equipment to say what it would take to split those 1/16" fins into two fins each... but very few people have the skill it would require to do it given any amount of time. If anyone is interested in looking into how difficult it is to make <1mm channels there are multiple threads on the forums that can be found by a search. I can say that I know Cathar and Neomoses have developed, with the help of others, reasonable means to mill channels considerably smaller than 1mm though.

All I was saying in regards to the inlet barb and baseblate thickness of the block was that just from looking at the picture, you can see that the differences from the WW are moves in the wrong direction. Unless this block were tested by JoeC or BillA, I would not expect anything near the performance claimed.

I hate false or unfounded manufacturer/salesman claims.

Aside from the obvious differences between the WW and the Be block, does anyone here honestly believe this block would exist if not for the micro channel craze that was started by the WW? It looks like nothing more than a simplified version to save on production costs.

They realize people will see this, go "golly, a microchannel block, it must be awesome!"; said person will see the relatively low price, and there's a sale.

Korndog said:

1mm isn't that small
sure.. milling would be hard, but what about someone with hand tools and a lot of time on their hands?

Click to expand...

All I can say is...try it.

Now I remember why this block looks so familiar. Jon Fettig made a block just like this a few month's ago. If anyone's work is being copied, it's Jon's.

Originally posted by JML
...does anyone here honestly believe this block would exist if not for the micro channel craze that was started by the WW?...

Click to expand...

Yes, I do. The only thing that took them so long was the fact that most people underestimate how difficult some things are to manufacture. I believe Cathar is again having this problem with his machinists. I've got a couple of ideas that I still have no clue how to manufacture. (with my current equipment...)