i875 vs i865

Vio1 · Apr 23, 2003

Whats the difference between the two? Is the i865 known as Springdale? Whats the i875 known as?
Which is better, and why?

Maxvla · Apr 23, 2003

875 = canterwood

i haven't seen any reviews on the 865PE yet but according to the specs and feature lists the 865 looks to be just as good as the 875 but about 1/3 -1/2 less money.

the only thing i can find on the differences is that the 875 supports ECC ram and has more pins. thats it.

FIZZ3 · Apr 23, 2003

The most important difference isn't the ECC memory support, of course.

The i875 chipset is made with top-bin northbridge chips that allow a reduction of two clocks, here:

This latency reduction is unavailable even as an overclocking option with i865 boards.

Furthermore, one might speculate that the top-bin i875 boards will be able to pull off higher FSB numbers than the lower binned i865 boards. This possible boon may not always pay off in full, in situations where memory can't keep up the full FSB speed for example.

Taken together, the Canterwood boards should have a slight performance edge both in stock operation as in overclocking potential.

Whether these differences between the two chipsets are worth the extra money is another debate.

Maxvla · Apr 23, 2003

how do you bin chips with different numbers of pins?

FIZZ3 · Apr 23, 2003

Maxvla said:
how do you bin chips with different numbers of pins?

There are various ways, altough I don't have certainty about how it is done. I could imagine a separate fabrication process for the two, to different quality standards, or a uniform one with a test + bin cycle before the pins are placed on the chips.

Maxvla · Apr 23, 2003

FIZZ3 said:
There are various ways, altough I don't have certainty about how it is done. I could imagine a separate fabrication process for the two, to different quality standards, or a uniform one with a test + bin cycle before the pins are placed on the chips.

but aren't the chips designed around the pin layout?

FIZZ3 · Apr 23, 2003

Maxvla said:
but aren't the chips designed around the pin layout?

Then option #1 may apply, or otherwise some pin-outs are not used on the one with the lower pin count, who knows...

This is what Anandtech said:

The gist of PAT is that in order to differentiate the 875P from the 865, Intel began speed binning the chipsets and selected the top performing MCHs to be 875P parts with everything else that still qualified ended up being branded as an 865. The benefit of this approach is that Intel can be a bit more aggressive with the memory controller while still ensuring reliable operation. It turns out that these high speed bins are able to shave off, at most, two clocks off every memory access which ends up improving overall performance by a few percent.

Maxvla · Apr 23, 2003

hmm even if its true its not worth the extra 70-100 dollars.

FIZZ3 · Apr 23, 2003

Maxvla said:
hmm even if its true its not worth the extra 70-100 dollars.

Hahahaha i845 vs i850E all over again!

Seriously though, I'm not going to invest in any of these boards until all timing issues are cleared up. I want to see all ram timings available and set to the fastest setting at 433Mhz minimum, maybe 466 for better OC headroom... both on a board as on the modules @ 2.5v. Let's see a little perfection here.

Also puzzled by some companies' drive connection schemes... using add-on devices through the PCI bus etc... hmmz.

Wired_Monk · Apr 23, 2003

Maxvla said:
hmm even if its true its not worth the extra 70-100 dollars.

The price difference between the 875P and 865PE chipsets is not 70-100 dollars. You’re comparing the price of motherboards that have differences far beyond the chipset. The 875P with raid costs $54, while the 865PE with raid costs $40. Knock 4 bucks off both chipsets for lack of raid support. So the price difference between the chipsets is about $14.

Most 875P motherboards will likely come with all the bells and whistles since it’s a higher end chipset. Manufacturers will eventually produce a no-frills 875P boards that will be within $20 of a comparable 865PE boards.

JDLT1 · Apr 23, 2003

Thats true Wired_Monk can be seen now on some motherboards ie gigabites low end 875p and then look at the 865pe from msi!

JDLT1

jdmcnudgent · Apr 23, 2003

Wired_Monk said:
The price difference between the 875P and 865PE chipsets is not 70-100 dollars. You’re comparing the price of motherboards that have differences far beyond the chipset. The 875P with raid costs $54, while the 865PE with raid costs $40. Knock 4 bucks off both chipsets for lack of raid support. So the price difference between the chipsets is about $14.

Most 875P motherboards will likely come with all the bells and whistles since it’s a higher end chipset. Manufacturers will eventually produce a no-frills 875P boards that will be within $20 of a comparable 865PE boards.

may be true, but you wont see the boards without the raid.

kslim · Apr 23, 2003

FIZZ3 said:
Seriously though, I'm not going to invest in any of these boards until all timing issues are cleared up. I want to see all ram timings available and set to the fastest setting at 433Mhz minimum, maybe 466 for better OC headroom... both on a board as on the modules @ 2.5v. Let's see a little perfection here.

Isnt OC popular 845PE boards alrady achieving 466Mhz ? Mine does.

Maxvla · Apr 23, 2003

Wired_Monk said:
The price difference between the 875P and 865PE chipsets is not 70-100 dollars. You’re comparing the price of motherboards that have differences far beyond the chipset. The 875P with raid costs $54, while the 865PE with raid costs $40. Knock 4 bucks off both chipsets for lack of raid support. So the price difference between the chipsets is about $14.

Most 875P motherboards will likely come with all the bells and whistles since it’s a higher end chipset. Manufacturers will eventually produce a no-frills 875P boards that will be within $20 of a comparable 865PE boards.

what are you talking about?

the MSI 865PE NEO2-LS at 119 dollars has every option that the nicer canterwood boards do except raid (SATA only i might add on the 875P) and some of those are well over 200 dollars. i think the Asus is about 250 last i checked.

Vio1 · Apr 23, 2003

Ive seen some reviews and the canterwoods only slightly out perform the springdale...

Does anyone know of what comes next from Intel? I mean, whats the next major change in cpu's going to be? when? Cause I was thinking, if the new stuff will work on a canterwood, then I would get that mobo, otherwise, if im gonna have to buy a new mobo for the new cpu's (whenever they may come out), then Id rather spend less on a mobo now.. and get the springdale.

Maxvla · Apr 24, 2003

the early prescotts will work in the 478 so you are safe for the rest of the year.

the later prescots and the tejas will be a LGA package which is totally different than what we are used to.

Vio1 · Apr 24, 2003

what are prescots?(how do they differ) What speed will they start at?

Vio1 · Apr 24, 2003

oh, side question... Do you need a certain amount of posts before you can put up a poll? If so, how many?

JDLT1 · Apr 24, 2003

I still say the msi MSI 875P NEO LSR is 160 and the 865pe is 120 so 40 bucks diff in the msi side!

JDLT1

Maxvla · Apr 24, 2003

JDLT1 said:
I still say the msi MSI 875P NEO LSR is 160 and the 865pe is 120 so 40bucks in the msi side!

JDLT1

ok we'll go with your number..

why pay 40 bucks for nothing?

i875 vs i865

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