When should I perform a low-level format?

GV2NIX · 05-26-04, 06:45 PM

Under what circumstances is it beneficial to do a low-level format? I've done it a few times just for kicks, but I'm not too sure when it is necessary. I know Windows NT tends to stick around even after a full format, so maybe that's when I should use it? I'm running Windows XP Pro though... Any ideas?

cack01 · 05-26-04, 06:51 PM

The only time its needed is when you want to be very cautious with your data. There is no performance gain that I can think of.

GV2NIX · 05-26-04, 07:34 PM

So unless I'm concerned with residual data not being covered over after a normal format, a low-level format will ensure that everything that used to be on the drive is indeed gone for good?

JigPu · 05-26-04, 07:51 PM

Pretty much. There are a few tools that MAY be able to get it off, but really you'd need to get ahold of somebody with high-tech and costly equipment to get it off.

Only time I'd say you "need" to zero the drive other than for security is possibly if a virus hits and takes over the boot sector. I wouldn't take any chances with it surving somehow and just kill everything off.

JigPu

GV2NIX · 05-27-04, 09:28 PM

I guess I'll just low-level format from now on. I mean, it's can't hurt right?

mtnbikerjerry · 05-27-04, 10:39 PM

There are times that you could low level format or that you would want to.

1.) A serious virus hit your machine. (Not in a physical sense) :P

2.) If you have a ton of financial data, and do not want the NSA or some American intelligence agency or the IRS scavenging your thrown away HD for all your records for your Visa, Mastercard and Discover credit cards as well as all that money you lent to Bill Gates and did not report. haha just kidding there.

3.) Them bits get scrambled up some time even to the point if you did a regular reformat while installing a new operating system, that the install could not go through.

4.) wtf?

5.) Your HD manufacturer should provide a list of low level tools for your HD. Each HD has its own set and repair utilities as well. Check them out.

webfanatic · 05-28-04, 07:49 AM

If you want to wipe your data completely so that it really cannot be restored by any means you should better use a tool that writes absolutely random data to the drive many times, for example DBAN (http://dban.sourceforge.net/).

MisterEd · 05-28-04, 08:20 AM

Low-Level Formatting
IDE & SCSI HARD DRIVES
DRIVE TYPES & WHY LOW-LEVEL FORMAT
http://www.ameriwebs.net/groupworks/george/llf.htm

Sjaak · 05-28-04, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtnbikerjerry

2.) If you have a ton of financial data, and do not want the NSA or some American intelligence agency or the IRS scavenging your thrown away HD for all your records for your Visa, Mastercard and Discover credit cards as well as all that money you lent to Bill Gates and did not report. haha just kidding there.

Hehe, in that case i would trust only my hammer and anvil

MisterEd · 05-28-04, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sjaak

Hehe, in that case i would trust only my hammer and anvil

Not good enough. I would rather trust a furnace to melt that bad-boy down.

I used to work with classified hard drives. They used to destroy drives by physical means. Now they only trust melting them in a furnace.

shadowdr · 05-28-04, 08:46 PM

Another great tool is Eraser 5.7 .It will erase a file or folder completely with different options for how many times it writes 0's over the information.Very usefully for getting rid of folders that remain after the program has already been uninstalled.It also installs itself with your right click options so you can just right click and thoroughly erase.It will write 0's almost as fast as your Atto score so it is pretty quick.If used wisely you might never have to do another low level again.

Disputant · 05-29-04, 02:26 AM

The only time I have ever done low level formats is when M$ is causing bad sectors on the disk. Low Level usually fixes then for me, unless of course the bad sectors are actually physical damage, then I buy a new disk.

GV2NIX · 05-30-04, 05:28 PM

Hey, thanks for all the advice! Nice article by the way MisterEd. I guess there's not too much of a reason for me to low-level format. I don't have too much sensitive data on my drives and I don't plan on throwing any away yet. I think I'll just keep low-level formatting just to make me feel good, haha! Anyways, thanks a lot, I appreciate all the info!

Prisoner1138 · 05-31-04, 03:54 AM

Uhhh, since when does microsoft(that "m$" crap is so lame) cause bad sectors? Since ms-dos 2.0 I've never, ever had an ms product just cause bad sectors on a hard drive.

Disputant · 05-31-04, 04:16 AM

No need to flame Prisoner, there is an explanation behind my logic.

Many of the "bad sectors" these days are due to data rather than physical damage. One of the ways this can happen is through irregular placement of data on the drive. Managing my data is my operating system's job, and I do use mostly Microsoft products for the work that I do. Perhaps I should have worded my thoughts differently, but it is late.

For bad sectors caused by data errors, I think the process is called defect mapping where bad sectors are replaced with good ones. I can't remember for sure, someone can correct me.

MisterEd · 05-31-04, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GV2NIX

Hey, thanks for all the advice! Nice article by the way MisterEd. I guess there's not too much of a reason for me to low-level format. I don't have too much sensitive data on my drives and I don't plan on throwing any away yet. I think I'll just keep low-level formatting just to make me feel good, haha! Anyways, thanks a lot, I appreciate all the info!

Just a few hours ago I was forced to do a low-level format. For a second time I tried to do an install of Fedora Core 2 linux. It has a bug that can corrupt the partition tables of your hard drives. After messing up the partitions of my first twe drive a couple weeks ago I only tried it again because of posted workarounds that were supposed to fix this. No harm was done to my first drive this time but my second drives' partition table was trashed. I tried to recover with Norton's Disk Doctor but it only made matters worse. When it finished it said that it could not fix the problem and a low-level format was required. Nothing I tried made the drive usable. I finally pulled out Western Digital's Data Lifeguard for Windows and did a low-level format. That fixed the drive and allowed me to repartition and format it again.

Prisoner1138 · 05-31-04, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Disputant

No need to flame Prisoner, there is an explanation behind my logic.

Many of the "bad sectors" these days are due to data rather than physical damage. One of the ways this can happen is through irregular placement of data on the drive. Managing my data is my operating system's job, and I do use mostly Microsoft products for the work that I do. Perhaps I should have worded my thoughts differently, but it is late.

For bad sectors caused by data errors, I think the process is called defect mapping where bad sectors are replaced with good ones. I can't remember for sure, someone can correct me.

yes, managing data is the operating systems job. but it doesnt mean that the os is at fault if it happens. turning off your computer while it's writing to the hard drive can cause bad sectors(and i'm not talking about the drive spinning down causing the head to scratch the platters) and that definitely isn't the fault of the os. and even if it's bad data, that still isn't really a bad sector anyway, as it can be fixed. a bad sector is a permanently damaged portion of a drive platter that is mapped in a lowlevel format so it isnt used and cause data corruption.

MisterEd · 05-31-04, 06:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prisoner1138

yes, managing data is the operating systems job. but it doesnt mean that the os is at fault if it happens. turning off your computer while it's writing to the hard drive can cause bad sectors(and i'm not talking about the drive spinning down causing the head to scratch the platters) and that definitely isn't the fault of the os. and even if it's bad data, that still isn't really a bad sector anyway, as it can be fixed. a bad sector is a permanently damaged portion of a drive platter that is mapped in a lowlevel format so it isnt used and cause data corruption.

When one does get these bad sectors then it many time means that the drive is failing. If one is will to use this drive for awhile and live with this then doing a low-level format has an advantage. With the bad sectors seen by Fdisk, Format, and Scandisk these program will take it seems like forever to run. This is because of all the retries when the bad sectors are accessed. If one runs a low-level format program and puts any bad sectors in the "bad block table" then Fdisk, Format, and Scandisk will never see them again and run much more quickly.

Prisoner1138 · 05-31-04, 10:33 AM

If the "bad sectors" aren't physical, it physically has nothing to do with the hd, and doesn't mean your drive is failing. It means that something screwed up when writing to the hd. I'm well aware of what bad sectors actually are and said what a low level format does. So why are you quoting and replying to me?

newbienerd · 06-01-04, 02:31 AM

LOL!!! you guys are funny! Dumb question WARNING! what is a low-level format?? is that just like doing a format with a boot disk after fdisk? can someone please give me a full detailed explanation of what exactly a low level format is. and if that is the case... is there a high level format??? and what is the definition of it??? thanks!

i love this forum!

05-26-04, 06:45 PM	Thread Starter #1
GV2NIX Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: New York, NY	When should I perform a low-level format? Under what circumstances is it beneficial to do a low-level format? I've done it a few times just for kicks, but I'm not too sure when it is necessary. I know Windows NT tends to stick around even after a full format, so maybe that's when I should use it? I'm running Windows XP Pro though... Any ideas? __________________ Processor: 939 Opteron 170 @ 2.7GHz (270x10) Vcore=1.425V Motherboard: DFI Lanparty UT nF4 SLI-DR Expert RAM: 2x 512 OCZ PC-4800 Dual Channel DDR EL Elite Edition CL2.5-3-4-9 1T Vdimm=2.8V Spindles: 1x Maxtor Atlas 10K IV 73.4GB; 1x Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 300GB; 1x Plextor 708A Video Card: ATi Radeon X1900XT 512MB PCIe Power Supply: FSP Group FX700-GLN 700W Case: Cooler Master PAC-T01 "Praetorian" Cooling: Storm G5 CPU Block; Maze4 GPU Block; Black Ice Micro II; MCP600; 1/2" ID Tygon 3603 My Heatware
	QUOTE Thanks

05-26-04, 06:51 PM	#2
cack01 Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: San diego or UC Davis	The only time its needed is when you want to be very cautious with your data. There is no performance gain that I can think of. __________________ LianLi PC70 Dual PIII 1.0@1.2 (7.5*160) on ABIT VP6 768 PC-133 Geforce 4 TI4200 310/580 Sound Blaster Audigy Platinum 2x 40 GB Seagate 5400 w/Striping 1x 80 GB Seagate 7200 24X Yamaha CD-RW Sony 520GS 21"
	QUOTE Thanks

05-26-04, 07:34 PM	Thread Starter #3
GV2NIX Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: New York, NY	So unless I'm concerned with residual data not being covered over after a normal format, a low-level format will ensure that everything that used to be on the drive is indeed gone for good? __________________ Processor: 939 Opteron 170 @ 2.7GHz (270x10) Vcore=1.425V Motherboard: DFI Lanparty UT nF4 SLI-DR Expert RAM: 2x 512 OCZ PC-4800 Dual Channel DDR EL Elite Edition CL2.5-3-4-9 1T Vdimm=2.8V Spindles: 1x Maxtor Atlas 10K IV 73.4GB; 1x Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 300GB; 1x Plextor 708A Video Card: ATi Radeon X1900XT 512MB PCIe Power Supply: FSP Group FX700-GLN 700W Case: Cooler Master PAC-T01 "Praetorian" Cooling: Storm G5 CPU Block; Maze4 GPU Block; Black Ice Micro II; MCP600; 1/2" ID Tygon 3603 My Heatware
	QUOTE Thanks

05-26-04, 07:51 PM	#4
JigPu Inactive Pokémon Moderator Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Vancouver, WA	Pretty much. There are a few tools that MAY be able to get it off, but really you'd need to get ahold of somebody with high-tech and costly equipment to get it off. Only time I'd say you "need" to zero the drive other than for security is possibly if a virus hits and takes over the boot sector. I wouldn't take any chances with it surving somehow and just kill everything off. JigPu __________________ .... ASRock Z68 Extreme3 Gen3 .... Intel Core i5 2500 ........................ 4 thread ...... 3300 MHz ......... -0.125 V 2x ASUS GTX 560 Ti ............................... 1 GiB ....... 830 MHz ...... 2004 MHz .... G.SKILL Sniper Low Voltage ............. 8 GiB ..... 1600 MHz ............ 1.25 V .... OCZ Vertex 3 ................................. 120 GB ............. nilfs2 ..... Arch Linux .... Kingwin LZP-550 .............................. 550 W ........ 94% Eff. ....... 80+ Plat .... Nocuta NH-D14 ................................ 20 dB ..... 0.35 C°/W ................ 7 V "In order to combat power supply concerns, Nvidia has declared that G80 will be the first graphics card in the world to run entirely off of the souls of dead babies. This will make running the G80 much cheaper for the average end user." "GeForce 8 Series." Wikipedia, The Free Encyclopedia. 7 Aug 2006, 20:59 UTC. Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. 8 Aug 2006.
	QUOTE Thanks

05-27-04, 09:28 PM	Thread Starter #5
GV2NIX Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: New York, NY	I guess I'll just low-level format from now on. I mean, it's can't hurt right? __________________ Processor: 939 Opteron 170 @ 2.7GHz (270x10) Vcore=1.425V Motherboard: DFI Lanparty UT nF4 SLI-DR Expert RAM: 2x 512 OCZ PC-4800 Dual Channel DDR EL Elite Edition CL2.5-3-4-9 1T Vdimm=2.8V Spindles: 1x Maxtor Atlas 10K IV 73.4GB; 1x Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 300GB; 1x Plextor 708A Video Card: ATi Radeon X1900XT 512MB PCIe Power Supply: FSP Group FX700-GLN 700W Case: Cooler Master PAC-T01 "Praetorian" Cooling: Storm G5 CPU Block; Maze4 GPU Block; Black Ice Micro II; MCP600; 1/2" ID Tygon 3603 My Heatware
	QUOTE Thanks

When should I perform a low-level format?

Internet Services

Website Development

Tech Hardware

05-27-04, 10:39 PM	#6
mtnbikerjerry Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Aliso Viejo, California	There are times that you could low level format or that you would want to. 1.) A serious virus hit your machine. (Not in a physical sense) :P 2.) If you have a ton of financial data, and do not want the NSA or some American intelligence agency or the IRS scavenging your thrown away HD for all your records for your Visa, Mastercard and Discover credit cards as well as all that money you lent to Bill Gates and did not report. haha just kidding there. 3.) Them bits get scrambled up some time even to the point if you did a regular reformat while installing a new operating system, that the install could not go through. 4.) wtf? 5.) Your HD manufacturer should provide a list of low level tools for your HD. Each HD has its own set and repair utilities as well. Check them out.
	QUOTE Thanks

05-28-04, 07:49 AM	#7
webfanatic Registered Join Date: May 2004 Location: Munich, Germany	If you want to wipe your data completely so that it really cannot be restored by any means you should better use a tool that writes absolutely random data to the drive many times, for example DBAN (http://dban.sourceforge.net/).
	QUOTE Thanks

05-28-04, 08:20 AM	#8
MisterEd Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Alabama	Low-Level Formatting IDE & SCSI HARD DRIVES DRIVE TYPES & WHY LOW-LEVEL FORMAT http://www.ameriwebs.net/groupworks/george/llf.htm __________________ Gigabyte GA-990FXA-UD3 \| AMD FX-8350 \| Corsair H60 Cooler \| GSkill RipjawsX (2x2GB) \| ASUS GeForce GTX 560 \| WD Caviar Blue 1TB \| Seagate 750GB \| ASUS 24X DVD/RW\| Windows 7 Ultimate ASUS M4N82 Deluxe \| AMD Phenom II X4 960T \| Corsair XMS2(2x2GB) \| PNY GeForce GTS 250 (1GB) \| Seagate 300GB \| Memorex 20X DVD/RW \| Windows 7 Home Premium
	QUOTE Thanks

05-28-04, 08:46 PM	#11
shadowdr Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: nashville, tennesse U.S.A.	Another great tool is Eraser 5.7 .It will erase a file or folder completely with different options for how many times it writes 0's over the information.Very usefully for getting rid of folders that remain after the program has already been uninstalled.It also installs itself with your right click options so you can just right click and thoroughly erase.It will write 0's almost as fast as your Atto score so it is pretty quick.If used wisely you might never have to do another low level again. __________________ Asus M4A89TD Pro USB3 AMD Phenom II x4 975BE @4.1 2x2 gig Patriot 2x4 gig Ripjaws@ 8-8-8-24 2x 128 Crucial M4 SSD for OS and one for Programs 2x 640 WD Blacks for storage Rosewill Blackhawk case and Antec 750 New PS Corsair H100I cooling Asus Aluminum 6950 JVC 32 inch LCD TV Windows 7 Pro X64 Heat Last edited by shadowdr; 05-31-04 at 08:16 PM.
	QUOTE Thanks

05-29-04, 02:26 AM	#12
Disputant Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Chicago, IL	The only time I have ever done low level formats is when M$ is causing bad sectors on the disk. Low Level usually fixes then for me, unless of course the bad sectors are actually physical damage, then I buy a new disk. __________________ Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz Lian-Li PC61 ASUS Rampage Extreme 2x OCZ Reaper HPC 2GB Western Digital VelociRaptor 150GB 2x Western Digital Caviar Black 640GB EVGA GeForce GTX 260 Creative Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Klipsch Pro Media 4.1 CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W Power Supply
	QUOTE Thanks

05-30-04, 05:28 PM	Thread Starter #13
GV2NIX Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: New York, NY	Hey, thanks for all the advice! Nice article by the way MisterEd. I guess there's not too much of a reason for me to low-level format. I don't have too much sensitive data on my drives and I don't plan on throwing any away yet. I think I'll just keep low-level formatting just to make me feel good, haha! Anyways, thanks a lot, I appreciate all the info! __________________ Processor: 939 Opteron 170 @ 2.7GHz (270x10) Vcore=1.425V Motherboard: DFI Lanparty UT nF4 SLI-DR Expert RAM: 2x 512 OCZ PC-4800 Dual Channel DDR EL Elite Edition CL2.5-3-4-9 1T Vdimm=2.8V Spindles: 1x Maxtor Atlas 10K IV 73.4GB; 1x Seagate Barracuda 7200.8 300GB; 1x Plextor 708A Video Card: ATi Radeon X1900XT 512MB PCIe Power Supply: FSP Group FX700-GLN 700W Case: Cooler Master PAC-T01 "Praetorian" Cooling: Storm G5 CPU Block; Maze4 GPU Block; Black Ice Micro II; MCP600; 1/2" ID Tygon 3603 My Heatware
	QUOTE Thanks

05-31-04, 03:54 AM	#14
Prisoner1138 Member Join Date: Jul 2002	Uhhh, since when does microsoft(that "m$" crap is so lame) cause bad sectors? Since ms-dos 2.0 I've never, ever had an ms product just cause bad sectors on a hard drive.
	QUOTE Thanks

05-31-04, 04:16 AM	#15
Disputant Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Chicago, IL	No need to flame Prisoner, there is an explanation behind my logic. Many of the "bad sectors" these days are due to data rather than physical damage. One of the ways this can happen is through irregular placement of data on the drive. Managing my data is my operating system's job, and I do use mostly Microsoft products for the work that I do. Perhaps I should have worded my thoughts differently, but it is late. For bad sectors caused by data errors, I think the process is called defect mapping where bad sectors are replaced with good ones. I can't remember for sure, someone can correct me. __________________ Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz Lian-Li PC61 ASUS Rampage Extreme 2x OCZ Reaper HPC 2GB Western Digital VelociRaptor 150GB 2x Western Digital Caviar Black 640GB EVGA GeForce GTX 260 Creative Audigy 2 ZS Platinum Klipsch Pro Media 4.1 CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W Power Supply
	QUOTE Thanks

05-31-04, 10:33 AM	#19
Prisoner1138 Member Join Date: Jul 2002	If the "bad sectors" aren't physical, it physically has nothing to do with the hd, and doesn't mean your drive is failing. It means that something screwed up when writing to the hd. I'm well aware of what bad sectors actually are and said what a low level format does. So why are you quoting and replying to me?
	QUOTE Thanks

06-01-04, 02:31 AM	#20
newbienerd Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Lethbridge, AB	LOL!!! you guys are funny! Dumb question WARNING! what is a low-level format?? is that just like doing a format with a boot disk after fdisk? can someone please give me a full detailed explanation of what exactly a low level format is. and if that is the case... is there a high level format??? and what is the definition of it??? thanks! i love this forum!
	QUOTE Thanks

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search