Building a Winchester Rig (advice needed)

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

Well it seems like this is going to happen after all. Ill see what happens by weeks end. Here is what I have planned so far:

Gigabyte GA-K8NS Ultra-939 ($122)

AMD Athlon64 3200+ (Winchester) ($215)

Thermalright XP-90 ($40)

Any comments?

jpersinger · Oct 19, 2004

Where is the Gigabyte for $122?

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

sorry, I should link my sources. Its from www.eWiz.com. Link for it is HERE

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

Well ****.... all the Winchester CPUs are sold out at Monarch Computers....guess Ill just have to wait for the next batch :-/

hitechjb1 · Oct 19, 2004

I thought the Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP Ultra-939 is around $200. Maybe that one is different from a GA-K8NS.

How did you decide between the GA_K8NS and the MSI Neo2?

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

hitechjb1 said:
I thought the Gigabyte GA-K8NSNXP Ultra-939 is around $200. Maybe that one is different from a GA-K8NS.

How did you decide between the GA_K8NS and the MSI Neo2?

It is, Its not the XP version. This is the newer striped down version Giga-byte just released.

____

Why didnt I pick MSI? Simple... bad caps. This and I dont trust MSI and Epox. I have always gotten quality products from Gigabyte. However I am interested to hear what you think, or if you have any information on this mobo. ZZF just got them in and newegg doesnt quite yet

I havent ruled out MSI, I am just simply distrustful of it. That and the blue matches my 6800GT and my case

deception`` · Oct 19, 2004

1. Wait for the DFI s939, whenever it comes out. Your overclocking efforts will be much greater.

2. Grab the 90nm 3000+. These can be had for around $190 at newegg and tend to hit the same o/c wall as the 3200+. I know you probably want to make use of the 10x multi, but chances are you will be overclocking with a divider allowing for 300+ HTT speeds. Therefore, the 10x multi will be rendered useless.

3. I would suggest some better ram, preferrably with TCCD ICs, but of course that depends on your budget.

deception``

hitechjb1 · Oct 19, 2004

I don't have first hand experience with MSI Neo and Neo2, so not much to say other than from reading reviews and members' experience here.

I had heard capacitor issues. You have to make sure whether it is a thing of the past, ....

Many reviews have used the MSI Neo2 for testing 939 CPU and systems. Anandtech 939 roundup put the MSI Neo2 as frist choice.

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

deception`` said:
1. Wait for the DFI s939, whenever it comes out. Your overclocking efforts will be much greater.

2. Grab the 90nm 3000+. These can be had for around $190 at newegg and tend to hit the same o/c wall as the 3200+. I know you probably want to make use of the 10x multi, but chances are you will be overclocking with a divider allowing for 300+ HTT speeds. Therefore, the 10x multi will be rendered useless.

3. I would suggest some better ram, preferrably with TCCD ICs, but of course that depends on your budget.

deception``

1. Candymancan tells my DFI canceled that board, in attempts to focus on nForce4

2. I thought about doing that. But from what I hear from the XS people, AMD is aggressivly binning their 90nm CPUs. Im just trying to hedge my bets. Im trying to get to 2.6 with good latency, once I get TCCD

3. Once I have the money

For now it will be on Hynix. I know my RAM is good for a solid 260 as evidence by my NF7. If I get more than 2.6 I will be happy.

hitechjb1 said:
I don't have first hand experience with MSI Neo and Neo2, so not much to say other than from reading reviews and members' experience here.

I had heard capacitor issues. You have to make sure whether it is a thing of the past, ....

Many reviews have used the MSI Neo2 for testing 939 CPU and systems. Anandtech 939 roundup put the MSI Neo2 as frist choice.

Understood. I just have a preference for Gigabyte, much in the same way I favor Abit. Its purely based on brand. Thus I want to get info about it. I know plenty about the Neo2. I will absolutly get it if the giga is a dud.

hitechjb1 · Oct 19, 2004

Regarding to the CPU multiplier x9 vs x10, unless one knows what frequency the memory modules can be overclocked and plan accordingly, a x10 multiplier would have less memory frequency gap to fill. E.g. as shown from the following example, a x9 multiplier CPU at 2500 MHz, the memory can only run at 227 MHz and 277 MHz, and not in between with bios memory_FSB_ratio of 1:1, 5:6 and 2:3 which are the common setting for most motherbaord bios except DFI.

hitechjb1 said:
I don't think it is necessary to get a 90 nm 939 3500+, a 90 nm 939 3000+ or 3200+ is fine.

You can run the memory bus frequency slower than the HTT (or internal FSB setting) with minimal impact on memory performance,
for example, assume bios only has 1:1, 5:6, 2:3 memory_FSB_ratio
For 3000+, max multiplier = 9, memory_divider available = 9, 11,
For 3200+, max multiplier = 10, memory_divider available = 9, 10, 11, 12, 15

So if the CPU clock frequency is 2500 MHz,
you would get memory at 277 or 227 MHz with a 3000+ (x9 max),
you would get memory at 277, 250, 227, 208, 167 MHz with a 3200+ (x10 max).

As you can see, the 3200+ provides more flexible matching of memory frequency for given memory modules.

Relationship between CPU_memory_divider and CPU_multiplier, memory_FSB_ratio
How to determine memory bus frequency (post 60)

Memory bus frequency setting, SYNC/ASYNC mode

Osirus · Oct 19, 2004

Well I just built my first AMD A64 setup, I went with a A64 3000+ s939 winchester, and a MSI Neo2 Platinum.

My first time overclocking it, Im currently sitting at 2.4ghz. Ill go for 2.6 shortly, just want to learn more about AMD overclocking. I would recommend the 3000+, like stated above you will get the same results.

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

Very interesting for that information. But remember, getting the 3200+ is a meager $36 more. So I dont see it as a major issue.

deception`` · Oct 19, 2004

Sentential said:
1. Candymancan tells my DFI canceled that board, in attempts to focus on nForce4

2. I thought about doing that. But from what I hear from the XS people, AMD is aggressivly binning their 90nm CPUs. Im just trying to hedge my bets. Im trying to get to 2.6 with good latency, once I get TCCD

3. Once I have the money

1. That is false. The fact of the matter is that there have been a number of rumors concerning the NF3 s939 motherboard. Unless it comes out of the mouths of Angry Games or RGone you need not be concerned. Taken from DFI-Street (DFI's own Forums):

other companies might beat us to 939...just like we were probably the last company to go 754...but we waited and tweaked and fooled around with it and look what you have....the best overclocking/tweaking 754 board in the world

i'd hope everyone wants the same when it comes to 939...and we still believe about the 939 what we believed about 754...even if you buy another brand of board, as soon as ours come out and they are as good if not better than the 754....well...we know a lot of customers will buy one, or sell the other brand 939 to pick one of ours up.

THat might sound egomaniacal...but the same holds true for Abit and Asus etc...when you wait and wait for the 'uber' product, you sometimes buy something to tide you over just to get familiar, or to see what it can do...then you pick up the board you were waiting for and realize that it was worth the wait.

We want our current customers of NF2/NF3 to be happy and know we take care of them. We don't even talk much about 939 around here, nor the office...because thats not our focus. We know the 939 is gonna be good...but until our engineers say 'we got a really good test candidate', we spend most of our resources making sure our current line of boards are running smooth and customers are continuously impressed with their overclocking/tweaking.

2. You can still get good latency with TCCD. If you use a memory divider (which you most likely will) you can run the ram at a low mhz for low timings and still enjoy the benefits of high HTT. This is common for all A64 motherboards.

3. Just make sure you buy the right ram. If, for whatever reason, you may need some suggestions, drop me a pm.

deception``

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

I read your link, and there is nothing there to suggest that S939 will have an nforce3 canidate. I wish it were true, but sadly I think it is indeed canceled. Maybe Im blind helpe me out here lol

Sentential · Oct 19, 2004

<---- Link

deception`` · Oct 19, 2004

Sentential said:
I read your link, and there is nothing there to suggest that S939 will have an nforce3 canidate. I wish it were true, but sadly I think it is indeed canceled. Maybe Im blind helpe me out here lol

Yes, you are quite blind. :burn:

The quote and link I provided was from Angry Games, who happens to work for DFI. If the s939 Lanparty was cancelled, there would be a huge thread on dfi-street by now. Furthermore, the quote I provided you, which was dated 10/17/04 (only 2 days ago) basically said that DFI is committed to releasing the best overclocking s939 motherboard just like their s754 UT. Therefore, the company is in no rush to mass produce a motherboard that they feel will not perform to the needs of their consumers, the heavy overclockers and enthusiasts. There will be a board, but it's not available as of yet. If you are truly that interested in the NF3 Ultra D then I suggest you register at dfi-street and ask for yourself. I promise that you will recieve the same answer.

deception``

Sentential · Oct 20, 2004

It still dosent address if they canceled the Nforce3 Ultra motherboard. I am pretty sure they did. Which is quite saddening. Although I will ask.

@md0Cer · Oct 20, 2004

May I offer any suggestions for the fan that goes on that awsome heatsink or do have that covered?

Sentential · Oct 20, 2004

@md0Cer said:
May I offer any suggestions for the fan that goes on that awsome heatsink or do have that covered?

Well ive got an large arsonal of fans at my disposal, including 1 80mm Sunan Tornado, 1 80mm Smartfan2 and a couple Panflows.

Either way I would love to hear your suggestion. I am always open for critique

CandymanCan · Oct 20, 2004

No what i said at the end when we were talking Sen, was they Cancled the Nforce 3 for S939 and are Focasing on a NF4 S939, after that is out they will make the Nforce 3 S939.

Nforce 4 is the same chipset as NF3 it just has PCI-E on it while NF3 has AGP.

I got this info from a forum i forgot thier name cuss iwasj ust searchign stuff on google, the thread was pretty large like a few pages long and people e-mailed DFI and DFI said what isaid uptop it actually makes more sense 2, so the NF3 isnt cancled really it was sorta delayed until early next year because of the NF4 this is for S939.

Also i think its funny how DFI claims they are the best overclocking board in the world. He even said himself that thier looser timmings and stuff in the bios is what makes them oc better, wooptida. Its just like the DFI NF2 CPC disbaled 300fsb oo yea tro bad it runs like 285-290fsb. Its pretty stupide if you ask me. Its like my 6800gt flashed to ultra, it overclocks higher now but that be cause of the looser timmings, i actually get a slightly lower score overall @ 1180 on my mem with the ultra bios then 1140 with the GT bios.

Building a Winchester Rig (advice needed)

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