[redwraith94]

Am I to understand this right? I was reading a thread that suggested propane for use in a phase change system as the working fluid. Has anyone actually done this and did I understand it right?

[sandman001]

You understolod it right, I put a bit of propane in my R22 system, it brought down the temps a bit.

[Aphex_Tom_9]

Propane is R290, and yes it is very commonly used in homemade phase systems, as you dont need a special liscence to obtain it.

[redwraith94]

Wow, I didn't know that, still, I wouldn't put it any where near my system.

[f00t]

popane is pretty safe to use as long as you be careful. it can be used with all oils and is extremely cheap.

[sandman001]

Originally Posted by f00t

popane is pretty safe to use as long as you be careful. it can be used with all oils and is extremely cheap.

And doesn't really catch on fire that easily.

You shouldn't have any oxygen in your system anyway, and it needs oxygen to burn.

[GunnerMan]

Yeah I wa thinking about that...what if I am playing a game and the explosions get a little to real, but as I understand a quite small amount is used...

[f00t]

you just ned enought propane to charge the system and tune it to your load. you can get about 10-15 charges out of a bbq propane cannister depending on the size of your dd

[stockhatch]

I use it

[Zork]

I used it in my first few systems I built.. Worked great and If i was the only one that used my computer or if I was a single bachelor, I would still be using it.. I know the odds are very very low, and I mean extremely low for the compressor to possibly cause a spark, and although there shouldnt be any air in the system, no one knows my luck like me.... I just couldnt live with my self if someone in my house got hurt... But if you are carefull, pulll a good vacumm and use common sense its just as safe as the other refrigerants, possibly safer considering it doesnt deplete the ozone and isnt poisionous like some of the other gases...

[matttheniceguy]

I'm pretty sure you compressor could spark all it wanted to inside and there would be no problems . The only thing that would worry me about a system using propane would be a sudden leak, causing the entire system to discharge in a metter of a few seconds. If this happened in a relatively small room you could end up with a propane concentration actually high enough for an explosion.

That said, I wouldn't be overly concerned about running a propane system in my house. I'm sure it's still a thousand times safer than driving.

[redwraith94]

Limits of inflamibility of propane, in air!: Lower 2.12%, Upper 9.35% This means that propane has to be between those two numbers to ignite with a spark, if it is less or more (uniformly mixed though) then it won't ignite at all. But my minifridge is charged with 12 oz of coolant, if that was propane than that would equal ~6 cubic feet of propane @ stp this would be enough to make a 300 cubic foot room (at most) combust, when uniformly mixed. My living room is 10' x 20' x 8' = 1600 cubic feet. So I think I am safe, but I am still too concerned to use it at all.

Also the military uses something called a F.A.E. fuel-air-explosive (I think that is the right acronym) it uses a big 'ol tank of propane, opens a valve, waits for the propane to rush out and mix with the ambient air, then ignites it. They use them for 'slight overpressure' say, drop 'em in a row, to take out a minefield, or something like that. F.A.E.'s have about four times more power than conventional high explosives for the same weight, i.e. P.E.T.N., R.D.X., H.M.X. etc. because they do not store their own oxygen. I just felt like ranting a little.

[-aDaM^]

I have a BIG Tank of Freeon in my garage I bet you phasechange guys would like to get your hands on it

[matttheniceguy]

Exactly what refrigerant is "Freeon"? Or is that just what it is called? Most of us don't have reclaiming equipment or anything like that so our gases have to be ones we can just release anyway.

[redwraith94]

Originally Posted by matttheniceguy

Exactly what refrigerant is "Freeon"? Or is that just what it is called? Most of us don't have reclaiming equipment or anything like that so our gases have to be ones we can just release anyway.

It is a methane molecule (CH4 - one carbon surrounded by 4 Hydrogens) that has two hydrogen atoms repalced by Fluorine atoms, and two replaced by Chlorine atoms so CF2Cl2 - C F2 Cl2\

Originally Posted by -aDaM^

I have a BIG Tank of Freeon in my garage I bet you phasechange guys would like to get your hands on it

how much?

[man_utd]

l ~6 cubic feet of propane @ stp

If your room is at standard temp, why bother with DD phase change?

It is a methane molecule (CH4 - one carbon surrounded by 4 Hydrogens) that has two hydrogen atoms repalced by Fluorine atoms, and two replaced by Chlorine atoms so CF2Cl2 - C F2 Cl2\

Not quite. Freon is a brand name owned by DuPont. Mostly refers to CFCs or in blanket terms refrigerants.

[redwraith94]

Originally Posted by man_utd

If your room is at standard temp, why bother with DD phase change?



Not quite. Freon is a brand name owned by DuPont. Mostly refers to CFCs or in blanket terms refrigerants.

Ha Ha! good point!

And no. the Freon that I was referring to is the original 'Freon 12' which can also be technically called just 'Freon' or Methane-dichloro-difluoro, and, yes the trade name 'Freon' is owned by dupont.

[blackjackel]

I might be getting just a TAD bit off topic....

Now that i know propane is the killer-cheap way to do it...

What would be the super-expensive, almost impossible, hard way to do it?

And by that, i mean, what is the absolute best refridgerant? LOWEST temps...etc.

Also, whats the best-bang-for-your-buck type refridgerant that performs better than propane and is a REALLY good performer?