Ok, I know...same ole question...about BIM

JokerCM · Apr 30, 2005

I have seen a couple of posts on here about the BIM. This my first actual post though. But I have an acrylic case and not wishing to mod it out if I can avoid it. I have a P4 3GhZ, ASUS P5GDC-E M/B, 1Gig RAM and a ASUS 6600GT V/C. I am looking to go with water-cooling in my rig. I am not looking to overclock my system. I am looking to run dual BIM's only cooling the CPU. Currently I am running only the stocl OEM cooling fan. I am only gonna do the water-cooling in it because a few others in the area have acrylic cases and want to be different. Will the dual BIM's run cooler than the stock fan is my question. Any suggestions, ideas or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

JokerCM

Wireless-G · Apr 30, 2005

What is a BIM?

clocker2 · Apr 30, 2005

Black Ice Micro, I believe.

JokerCM · Apr 30, 2005

Yes, Black Ice Micro. Single 80mm fan radiator from Danger Den.

MVC · Apr 30, 2005

As long as you're only cooling the CPU you should come out ahead. If you do it, stick to 3/8" tubing/fittings and use the DDC pump.

voigts · Apr 30, 2005

Agreed. Dual BIMs with an MCP350 should definitely outperform air. Not to mention adding some dye to your water or blue VW coolant or something of the like will make it look sweet in an acrylic case.

r0frog · Apr 30, 2005

I'd say I'd run cooler than air... alot cooler actually... Friend of mine had similar CPU and he dropped 30 degrees... Though I think he may have applied the stock heatsink badly...

What are your current temps on the stock cooler? (Get that thing out of there... Acrylic = Style

)

adamwinn · Apr 30, 2005

JokerCM said:
I have seen a couple of posts on here about the BIM. This my first actual post though. But I have an acrylic case and not wishing to mod it out if I can avoid it. I have a P4 3GhZ, ASUS P5GDC-E M/B, 1Gig RAM and a ASUS 6600GT V/C. I am looking to go with water-cooling in my rig. I am not looking to overclock my system. I am looking to run dual BIM's only cooling the CPU. Currently I am running only the stocl OEM cooling fan. I am only gonna do the water-cooling in it because a few others in the area have acrylic cases and want to be different. Will the dual BIM's run cooler than the stock fan is my question. Any suggestions, ideas or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

JokerCM

I'd go with a single 120mm radiator - It will be more space efficient.
Surface Area--
BIM:
80mm*80mm = 6400mm^2 * 2 = 12,800mm^2

Single 120mm Radiator:
120mm*120mm = 14,400mm^2

MVC · Apr 30, 2005

adamwinn said:
I'd go with a single 120mm radiator - It will be more space efficient.
Surface Area--
BIM:
80mm*80mm = 6400mm^2 * 2 = 12,800mm^2

Single 120mm Radiator:
120mm*120mm = 14,400mm^2

It isn't just the surface area that matters here. A single BIM is rated for 236.6 KCals per hour so two of them would be rated at ~473.2. A single BIP is rated at 378 KCals per hour and a BIX is rated at 790 KCals. So, two BIMs would surpass a BIP but fall short of a BIX. However, I suspect that JokerCM is asking about the BIM because he doesn't have the space for either a BIP or BIX (or Thermochill 120.1, or another 120mm radiator).

It's generally pretty easy to find components that'll work better than others, but that doesn't mean they'll fit where you need them to.

JokerCM · Apr 30, 2005

I would have to do some major modding of my case. I currently have spots for 5 80mm fans that came stock in the case. And putting a 120 in would intail eith opening up one of the 80mm (probably on the top). And I wish to stay away from cutting up the acrylic if possible. Spent a fair amount of change on it and unlike metal cases I can't patch it back together. Just thought of somethign else. Anyone seen anything like a 120-80mm reducer. I will have to look around. But then again, space is a slight concern on the side and back or the case.

http://www2.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811166006

is the case I am using. And yes, planned on adding dye and a UV light to make if SHINE.

adamwinn · Apr 30, 2005

Regarding 120-80mm reducer, i've used several. its not worth it

basically the turbulance created negates all of the benefits of the higher airflow - though there are a few designs that minimize turbulance, they don't do a good job of eliminating the deadspot (which on a 120mm is most of the spot you'd be trying to cool on an 80mm radiator)

at most, i'd consider a 90mm-80mm reducer - but there are some really good 80mm fans out that'll end up costing less than a 90mm + reducer

MVC · Apr 30, 2005

JokerCM said:
...
Anyone seen anything like a 120-80mm reducer. I will have to look around. But then again, space is a slight concern on the side and back or the case.

I wouldn't bother. Assuming you were planning on using the BIMs on the 80mm mounting holes on the front and back of the case, just use good 80mm fans in pull configurations on both, making sure that the fans are sealed up against the radiators, and the radiators up against the acrylic, and it'll work fine. The "dead spot" has very little effect in pull configurations where you can seal the fan to the radiator and basically create a small vacuum to pull air through it.

Right now, I'm thinking front, back and top as intakes and the two side fans as exhausts--which should be just about right in balancing pressure in the case so you avoid dust problems... but I'm curious to hear other suggestions.

JokerCM · Apr 30, 2005

Thanks for the input. I will keep this thread updated when I get further in the project. I think I will just go with the 2 BIMs and a couple of good fans. Any suggestions on a good 80mm fan ? Noice is a minor issue. But not major. Currently I am running 5 Altec Green LED fans.

MVC · Apr 30, 2005

JokerCM said:
Thanks for the input. I will keep this thread updated when I get further in the project. I think I will just go with the 2 BIMs and a couple of good fans. Any suggestions on a good 80mm fan ? Noice is a minor issue. But not major. Currently I am running 5 Altec Green LED fans.

Delta 38mm tri-blades for the radiators--high speed if you're going to put them on a controller or undervolt them, the low speed ones if they'll get a straight 12v. If you must have LEDs, I've had real good luck with the aluminum Evercools, which come with blue or "rainbow" LEDs.

adamwinn · May 2, 2005

mvc, i thought that would be the case, with the deadspot not making a big deal in pull configurations, but after some testing my own expectations were wrong

i did it a while ago with an 80mm thermalright hsf on a xp 2400+. I used a 60cfm 80mm thermaltake fan in pull configuration, then put on a 110cfm 120mm beast of a fan, on a 80-120mm acrylic adapter that makes as good, if not better seal than the 80mm fan does- used a fan controller to vary the voltage on both fans to try out different fan speeds, and the 80mm beat the 120mm hands down until the 80mm was down to the 40cfm range.
i still don't know why but when i put my hand around the 120mm it didn't seem to be pulling very effectivly, i'm not sure if the resistance was too high for it (shouldn't have been considering the motor on that thing) or it was just the angle that the air had to travel (because of the funnel shape of the adapter) relative to the pitch of the blades.

Phextwin · May 2, 2005

MVC said:
It isn't just the surface area that matters here. A single BIM is rated for 236.6 KCals per hour so two of them would be rated at ~473.2. A single BIP is rated at 378 KCals per hour and a BIX is rated at 790 KCals

Those ratings are useless.

Heat flux is a product of several things (some for a radiator):

dt, Coolant flow, air flow, surface area, conductivity (to name a few).

I could make a 'radiator' specified for 1GW out of a peice of copper pipe - but without specifying the conditions of the testing the rating is essentialy useless.

Read this excellent article by Bill Adams for much more indepth explanation of radiator testing & ratings

Re The thread:

IMHO 120 or a pair of 80's is the bare minimum rad wise for WC, any less and the gains are not sufficient to justify the cost.

ls7corvete · May 2, 2005

I dont see the point of WCing if your gonna use 80mms.

I guess people do this for bragging rights? Or maybe they are confused and think its better than some good air cooling solution?

http://www2.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835109118

Air cooling+120.......

Man I keep steering ppl away from water cooling, its getting tiresome.

JokerCM · May 3, 2005

All I want to do to my system is to make it look nice in the acrylic case. And water cooling with UV dye in it would look really nice I feel. I am nott looking to brag...hey look, I have water-cooling...I am also not looking to over-clock my rig. I am just looking for a nice visually appealing set-up. Sure, I very well would save lots of money and get the save temps if I went with a high end air-cooled system. Well, I guess in a way you could call it "bragging", in a way. I am just the kind of person that is not happy having anything close to anyone else, and there are atleast two other systems in the area with acrylic cases. Only big difference is I have green fans and they both have blue...kind of the reason I went with green. Just looking for a way to be diffenent is all.

ls7corvete · May 3, 2005

Its all your choice, dont ask me about astetics, you would laugh if you saw in my case. :beer:

IMHO there are some very nice looking HSFs out ther I just want to make sure you will not be dissappointed with water cooling, I see to many "I am going back to air cooling threads" Or "whats wrong with my water cooling setup, my 55db fan and HS got these temps!!"

Braggins seems foolish though, once its in most people just go "whats water cooling?" it gets old....

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