Notices

Overclockers Forums > Hardware > Motherboards > AMD Motherboards
AMD Motherboards
Forum Jump

My mobo's mojo's KO'd?

Post Reply New Thread Subscribe Search this Thread
 
 
Thread Tools
Old 10-11-01, 08:50 PM Thread Starter   #1
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Unhappy My mobo's mojo's KO'd?


Ok, I could use some help on this one.

I've been having trouble getting a reasonable overclock on my
Duron 750. It's an AKCA stepping, so I should be getting
somewhere in the neighborhood of 1 gig out of it according to the
charts. Thus far I can't reliably get beyond 940. Now before you
start telling me to check my cooling. I'm just talking about
getting the thing to boot. Cooling shouldn't be a significant
issue in this case. In general, as I increase the CPU speed
either by increasing the multiplier of the fsb, the first failure
I get is a two tone video card failure. If I increase beyond that
I get a repeating long beep indicating a ram failure. But if I
increase a bit more I just get a black screen, no beeps at all.
The drives spin up and the mobo led lights up, but nothing appears
on the screen.

Now there are several odd things to throw in to the mix.

First, sometimes I can get the machine to boot at a certain speed,
run the machine stably for several hours, but as soon as I try to
reboot, it won't boot at all. By not booting at all, I mean I
don't even get to the POST, I either get a video card not found beep, or i just get a black screen. When this happens I can sometimes get past it by turning the machine off at the PSU. That is, in certain configurations if I do a standard reboot, it won't boot; if I do a reset, it won't boot; but if I shut the power off at the PSU, turn it back on, and then boot the computer, it boots fine. Sometimes even this procedure won't coax a reboot and I just have to clear the CMOS and start over.

Second, I can sometimes coax a higher speed from the cpu by
fiddling with the video card. The odd thing here is that the best
speed is often obtained by having the card only half seated. Also
it seems to be better if I end the fiddling by applying a slight
outward force on the card. Might I have a bad AGP socket? How would I verify this?

Third, as long as I don't push the bus over 140, the computer either runs stably or not at all. Below 140 if I can get it to boot, then it will run stably for days. So it's an all or nothing thing. Above 140 fsb it will sometimes boot but run a bit unstably. The KT266 chipset isn't known for it's fondness of high fsb, so this isn't too surprising. But it strikes me as odd that below 140 it's all or nothing. I would have expected instability to creep up gradually (as it does above 140).

Fourth, if I'm running stably at 900 or more and I mess with the motherboard (take off the heatsink for instance) it will stop booting until I reseat everything again. Once I even had to reseat the extra USB ports to get it to boot.

I've only got a 250watt PSU (brand is ENHANCE), but I get these same results even with all the drives and extra fans disconnected. Also my 5v rail *never* drops below 4.92, most of the time it sits at 4.95 on a full load. I've checked by running MBM on a 1 sec interval for several days of folding. In fact it's been running on full load for three days now and MBM shows a low voltage of 4.95. But it does sometimes dip to 4.92.

I've successfully run the CPU at 1006 for several hours. (This
required finding just the right combination and then several
attempts at juggling the Video Card just right.) At that point I decided to reboot just to check for consistency. It wouldn't
reboot when I tried and I didn't have the time to futz with it
right then. So the CPU seems capable of higher speeds.

I've tried using a different Video Card with similar results. I
didn't spend a lot of time, but just switching cards didn't make
things better. However, the card I switched with was an Asus
V7100 MX, very similar to my normal card.

I've got generic ddr. It's actually Micron sold as generic. I'm
guessing that it's not nearly as good as Crucial. I've reseated it
multiple times, just to make sure there wasn't a problem that way.

I've tried upping the vcore and ddr voltage to the max the mobo
allows without a mod (1.85 and 2.7 respectively) This helps some, but not a lot.

For the record my full load cpu temp is running about 116F (47C), but as I've said, I'm pretty sure this isn't a temp problem because it's not even getting to POST.

Well, that's all I can think of at the moment. Any ideas or
questions?

At this point I'm inclined to think that the motherboard is
faulty. But I'd like some opinions before I go the RMA route only
to be told that the mobo is fine and I need to pay shipping. In addition to the stuff in my sig, I've got a cdr, an ancient cdrom, a Linksys NIC, and 256meg of ddr.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Overclockers Approved
Which motherboard should you buy? Get the final word here. Check out the latest Overclockers reviews:
ASRock Z77 OC Formula Motherboard Review

ASRock teamed up with overclocker Nick Shih to make a high-end overclocking-based, yet functional for all users, motherboard named the Z77 OC Formula. It appears they have achieved it. Read More.

Get it at NewEgg for $239.99
ASUS Maximus V Formula Motherboard

The Maximus V Formula is part of the ROG (Republic of Gamers) series of motherboards, which in itself brings a high level of expectation. It's a no brainer, Overclockers Approved! Read more.

Get it at NewEgg for $279.99
Old 10-11-01, 10:02 PM Thread Starter   #2
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
I know this was a long one. But I'm hoping someone has the patience to get through it and give me some feedback. So, BUMP.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 07:50 AM Thread Starter   #3
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
One more bump for the morning crew, then I guess I'll have to do the short version.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 09:37 AM   #4
[OC]Lucifer
Member

 
[OC]Lucifer's Avatar 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Brainerd, Minnesota USA

 
Wink Could it be...


Im more of a newbie than you are, so bear with me if my suggestion is way off... but.. What is your AGP running at? Maybe at the speed you are trying to run, you are running your agp card beyond its max speed. Just a thought.
Lucifer

__________________
Phenom II x4 955 @ 3.7, 4gb OCZ ddr3 1333 @ 1800, Asus m4a785td-v evo, Geforce GTS 250, Intel 40G SSD, RaptorX 150gb 10k rpm, Custom test bench case, Sony DVD-R, Corsair 750W
[OC]Lucifer is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 09:39 AM   #5
[OC]Lucifer
Member

 
[OC]Lucifer's Avatar 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Brainerd, Minnesota USA

 
Wink By the by...


To test if your AGP is bad or not, try putting in a 3d PCI card of some sort and running a game. If it pukes, the problem is somewhere else.

__________________
Phenom II x4 955 @ 3.7, 4gb OCZ ddr3 1333 @ 1800, Asus m4a785td-v evo, Geforce GTS 250, Intel 40G SSD, RaptorX 150gb 10k rpm, Custom test bench case, Sony DVD-R, Corsair 750W
[OC]Lucifer is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 10:09 AM Thread Starter   #6
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Unfortunately I don't have a PCI video card handy. But this behavior happens even when my fsb speeds are 100 and 133, so at that point my AGP should be within specs unless my mobo is bad.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 11:05 AM   #7
[OC]Lucifer
Member

 
[OC]Lucifer's Avatar 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Brainerd, Minnesota USA

 
Talking Could be..


Sounds like a bad AGP slot then. Id try RMAing the board.

__________________
Phenom II x4 955 @ 3.7, 4gb OCZ ddr3 1333 @ 1800, Asus m4a785td-v evo, Geforce GTS 250, Intel 40G SSD, RaptorX 150gb 10k rpm, Custom test bench case, Sony DVD-R, Corsair 750W
[OC]Lucifer is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 12:02 PM Thread Starter   #8
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
That's my thought at this stage. I like your idea about trying a PCI card to verify. I think best buy may have some cheap ones. ANd they have a great return policy.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 03:11 PM Thread Starter   #9
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Argh!

Well it's not the AGP slot. I just tried it with an ATI Xpert 128 in the PCI slot and got the same results. I did get a couple of different beeps though. Here's what happened.

Put in the ATI, start moving the multiplier up with a 133 bus speed. At 7x I get the "can't find video card" beep. So I power it down with the PSU button, reboot and everything works fine. I move it to 7.5x and then I get the ram error beep.

So I cut back to 100 fsb. At 9x I get the can't find video card error, followed by a hi-lo sound with a bit of a buzz to it. (I've heard that one before.) But I can get past that by using the power button on the PSU to cut the power. At 9.5x I get the video error followed by a fast repeating dee-dee-dee-dee sound. Just one short beep right after the other forever. (I've never heard that beep pattern when using the AGP card.) I can't get past that with the power button trick.

So without changin setting I swap the PCI card for the AGP. Now I get the video error beep followed by the hi-lo buzz. Still can't get past it.

Ok, so now I'm back with the AGP sitting at my nice safe 6.5x133=869 mhz.

The next two weakest links are my ddr and my psu. Anybody have a clue what's wrong?

nihili

So I leave all the setting alone and p

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 04:19 PM   #10
Doctor
Senior Member

 
Doctor's Avatar 

Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Cow-Hampshire, USA -->"Live Free or Die"<

10 Year Badge
 
Question ?????


Hi nihili,

I will have to say that it sounds either video/ AGP related, or possibly in the bios. Can you get it to boot consistantly with the bios with default settings, ie, after a CMOS clear? have you tried setting the AGP to 1X, and no fast-writes? Are you using the S907 bios? The earlier bios's have a default memory timing of 1T, which will mess with all but the best memory at higher FSB speeds.

Oh, and one more thing, Once I was having major video card problems, only to find that there was a piece of shipping "popcorn" in the AGP slot preventing the board from making consistant contact. When the board was warm, all was OK, but at first, cold boot, it was finicky.

Lemme no,

Doctor
Doctor is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 04:40 PM Thread Starter   #11
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
It boots fine after a bios setting at the defaults and all the way up to just under 900mhz. I only change the vcore, multiplier, fsb, and ram voltage. The kicker seems to be the mhz of the processor, it doesn't care about the fsb. It's just as happy at 6x150 as it is at 9x100, at least as far as booting goes. I do get a bit of instability running up at fsb of 150, but it boots like a champ.

I've tried two different AGP cards and one PCI video card all with the same results. I was thinking video also until the PCI card did the same thing. One problem with the video theory is that should depend primarily on the fsb rather than on the total mhz of the processor.

The two pieces of information that seem important to me, but that i can't make sense of are 1) that it is primarily dependent on the mhz, and 2) that at least initially I can get past the problem by power cycling the PSU. It would probably be helpful if I could track down those extra beeps that it's making.

I'm using the 20e bios (newer than the 907), fast writes disabled, I've tried a 1x AGP, my memory is at 2T (though it worked fine at 1T efore i upgrade the bios).

Hmmm, I like the popcorn theory. This is my first diy computer, is there a chance that I somehow have a bit of ground through the stand offs that's causing problems at boot? I think I'll tear the sucker apart and put it back together. It cant hurt.

Thanks for the input. All ideas and questions welcome.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 04:45 PM Thread Starter   #12
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Hmmm, one other tidbit I just remembered. If I fool around with the heatsink, adjusting the duct and that sort of thing, it often won't boot right after. I have to reseat a bunch of things to get it to boot even at the defaults. One time I had to reseat the extra USB ports. Hmmmmm, solder void on the socket?

*gets out the tools*



nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 04:49 PM   #13
Doctor
Senior Member

 
Doctor's Avatar 

Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Cow-Hampshire, USA -->"Live Free or Die"<

10 Year Badge
 
Post Beep-Beep.......


MY AK31 will do the same thing if I REALLY crank it up to the point of no-POST. I have to unplug it, and reboot.

Anyway, here's some "beep" codes for you. Our mobo's have the "Phoenix" bios, which was bought by Award, I believe:

BIOS Beep Sound core list

AWARD BIOS
Beep Sound Message
1 short(Beep) System booting is normally.
2 short(Beep) CMOS setting error
1 long - 1 short(Beep) DRAM ERROR
1 long - 2 short(Beep) Display card or monitor connected error
1 long - 3 short(Beep) Keyboard Error
1 long - 9 short(Beep) ROM Error
Long(Beep) continuous DRAM hasn't inset correctly.
Short(Beep) continuous POWER supply has problem.

AMI BIOS
1 short(Beep) DRAM Flash Error
2 short(Beep) DRAM ECC Check Error
3 short(Beep) DRAM Detect Fail
5 short(Beep) CPU Error
6 short(Beep) Keyboard Error
8 short(Beep) Display card memory Error
9 short(Beep) ROM Error
1 long - 3 short(Beep) DRAM Damage
1 long - 8 short(Beep) Display card or monitor connected error


Lemme no how you make out!

Doctor
Doctor is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 04:57 PM Thread Starter   #14
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Thanks for the codes. The one I normally get is the video card error. I also often get the long repeating beep dram error. I got the short repeating beep which looks like a PSU problem only when I used the PCI video card. I also get a beep that isn't on the list. Right after the video error (long short short) I get a high-low sounds that's a little buzzy. I remember seeing somewhere about a hi-lo siren that meant some kind of error. Any idea what that might be?

nihili

One other idea. I notice that the video beep says it's either card or monitor problem. I'm using an old apple 17 inch that requires an adapter to get the right connector. Could *that* be the problem? I'll try a different monitor after I get this thing put back together.

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 05:03 PM   #15
Doctor
Senior Member

 
Doctor's Avatar 

Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Cow-Hampshire, USA -->"Live Free or Die"<

10 Year Badge
 
Question


An Apple monitor on a Windoze machine?????


Oooooooooooh, now your playing with fire!

Just kidding, my friend owns a monitor refurbishing company, and is constantly plugging, and unplugging monitors, LIVE from the same test computer. No problem. I'm not saying that maybe it could be a problem, in your case, but he does it all the time. It could be a bad adapter, as well?

Doctor
Doctor is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 05:19 PM Thread Starter   #16
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
More data.

I didn't have it completely apart yet, so I put the other monitor on with just the video card and keyboard attached. At 7.5x133 I got the video error beeps followed by the PSU error beeps (first time with an AGP card). So I tried it at 100 fsb. It was fine at 9x, but at 9.5x I get black screen. No beeps, just everything powers up and the monitor doesn't so much as flicker.

So now I'm thinking PSU? Should I run over to BestBuy and grab a 300W Antec that I noticed they have?

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 05:26 PM   #17
Doctor
Senior Member

 
Doctor's Avatar 

Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Cow-Hampshire, USA -->"Live Free or Die"<

10 Year Badge
 
Absolutly! You will always have your 250W one as a backup. I'm not saying that it will solve your problems, but if you can afford it, you can't go wrong. These AMD's like the juice, and Antec makes a fine one. I have the Antec-431. It runs a Geforce III, 5 other cards, a 1764mhz processor, and a VapoChill, without a burp.

You will always be able to use it in a future upgraded computer, and throw your old one into somthing you sell.........

Just my .02

Doctor
Doctor is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 06:22 PM Thread Starter   #18
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Well the tear down and rebuild didn't change anything. I'm now reliably getting the PSU error beeps at 9.5x100. So I'm guessing it's PSU. ANyway. BestBuy carries Antec so I'll go get one of those and try it. I can always return it if it doesn't fix it. I was sort of leaning towards the Enermax, but I get impatient when I get into something like this.

I'm off to BB. more later.

nihili

__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 06:33 PM   #19
shadowdr
Senior Member

 
shadowdr's Avatar 

Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: nashville, tennesse U.S.A.

10 Year Badge
 
seems you got a plan to go with,my first thought was psu or a metal shaving stuck somewhere it shouldnt be.i would check that out while your installing the psu and check out the atx connector with a magnifying glass as well as the ram slots.i have the spectec micron ram as well and i hate to say it runs as good as the crucial even though it is cl3 so i dont beleive that the ram is part of the problem.i have started using paper washers for the mounting studs as one member suggested for a no problem install.i am pretty sure you will find it is a power current problem,mebey even dust in the cpu socket.i will check back later to find out the problem.good luck

__________________
Asus M4A89TD Pro USB3
AMD Phenom II x4 975BE @4.1
2x2 gig Patriot 2x4 gig Ripjaws@ 8-8-8-24
2x 128 Crucial M4 SSD for OS and one for Programs
2x 640 WD Blacks for storage
Rosewill Blackhawk case and Antec 750 New PS
Corsair H100I cooling
XFX 290
JVC 32 inch LCD TV
Windows 7 Pro X64

Heat
shadowdr is offline   QUOTE Thanks
Old 10-12-01, 07:24 PM Thread Starter   #20
nihili
Inactive Doc Logic Philosophical Mod

 
nihili's Avatar 

Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Pocatello, ID

10 Year Badge
 
Ok, brand new Antec 300W psu, no change. It still won't post at 100x9.5. I get the long short short beep that means video problems, followed by the fast repeating beep which apparently means power supply. *sigh*

I already had the mother board out and went over the whole thing looking for void and other such stuffs. Didn't find anything. Next step sounds like it ought to be checking the socket for dust, though I have to admit that sounds like a long shot.

Other ideas?

nihili


__________________
"He who knows only his own side of the case, knows little of that"
- John Stuart Mill On Liberty -


Dell Precision M90

Q6600 / Abit IX38QuadGT / EVGA 8800GTS(G92)512
nihili is offline   QUOTE Thanks

Post Reply New Thread Subscribe


Overclockers Forums > Hardware > Motherboards > AMD Motherboards
AMD Motherboards
Forum Jump

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Mobile Skin
All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:06 AM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
You can add these icons by updating your profile information to include your Heatware ID, Benching Profile ID or your Folding/SETI profile ID. Edit your profile!
X

Welcome to Overclockers.com

Create your username to jump into the discussion!

New members like you have made this the best community on the Internet since 1998!


(4 digit year)

Why Join Us?

  • Share experience
  • Max out your hardware
  • Best forum members anywhere
  • Customized forum experience

Already a member?