Overclockers

Rotarian_SC · 08-03-05, 10:34 PM

I live in a small dorm room, and my options are basically to have either a 12" TV or just buy a TV tuner card to watch TV on my computer which has a 19" LCD flat screen. I don't really watch TV and use my computer at the same time anyways, and if I needed to do electronic work while watching TV I could always use my laptop. Since I have all of my PCI slots filled up already, I would need one that is external and plugs in via firewire or USB or something. I would prefer that it have it's own power source as well, considering I'm running a lot on my current PSU already.

So my questions are, should I go with the small TV or with the TV tuner card? Also, could you reccomend any TV tuner cards that fit the guidelines I'm looking for. I don't want to get too high on the price, but I don't want a bad card.

Know Nuttin · 08-03-05, 10:56 PM

I'd go with the TV Tuner. Look at the ATI TV-Wonder USB 2.0. Avoid the MSI Vox.

http://www.ati.com/products/tvwonderusb20/

Rotarian_SC · 08-03-05, 11:04 PM

That looks pretty nice, but how easy is it to change the channels without a remote, is having a remote for it very useful?

Rotarian_SC · 08-06-05, 10:34 PM

I have two other cards I'm looking at:

Hauppauge
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116624

AVerMedia
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815100002

What interface delivers the best picture quality, and is there really a difference between the two interfaces?

kayson · 08-06-05, 10:40 PM

You probably won't notice a difference between picture quality between cards. In my experience, its the software that makes the difference. I have an ATI TV Wonder Pro, and the software that came with it sucks. I ended up getting intervideo windvr. Picture quality is great. I play halo 2 on my 19" lcd and its perfect. I would get the ATI usb card. As for a remote, I'd say it depends on how close you are to your keyboard. If you're gonna be at your desk (which I am when I use the card), using the keyboard shortcuts isnt a problem. If you're farther away, I'd definitely get a remote.

dicecca112 · 08-06-05, 10:40 PM

well from I have been reading the Avermedia is more functional, and delivers better image quality due to its Progressive scan and 3D Motion De-Interlace. I am going to buy the Tvbox9 later next week, so feel free to PM me as you have been with any more questions. I'll try to do a mini review as well.

But the Avermedia does not allow for recording, the hauppauge does, but I question the image quality, of the hauppauge, because it lacks much if any onboard memory.

But I still say that you should ditch one PCI card if you can and get the one in my sig 75$ and incredible image quality, remote and all. But if you can't I'd say go with the Avermedia Product, it looks promising.

Rotarian_SC · 08-06-05, 11:18 PM

http://www.mustangmods.com/data/10014/dscn0428_01.jpg

Well, I might have room in one of my PCI slots, but it would be a tight fit and is not much as you can see. I would also imagine that a TV tuner would consume a decent deal of power, and I'm close to stretching it as it is (unless you volunteer to send me your old OCZ 520W

). Otherwise I would go with a PCI one. Right now my options for ditching would either be a graphics card or my sound card, so I really don't want to ditch one.

I will be at my desk, so I guess a remote won't really matter. I won't really be using this at all for gaming, so I'm not caring much about signal lag, more just about picture quality and preferably something with good sound. The ability to record is a nice plus, but not really integral.

Edit: On the AVerMedia it lists audio output as either headphones or speaker. I assume it can be plugged into my audio line in for my soundcard and work through my computer speakers, right? Because that's the only way I have for listening to the TV.

dicecca112 · 08-07-05, 11:48 AM

the Sapphire Theatrix would be my choice for you, I have it now. I'm assuming that the spot that the unused PCI card is USB or some other sort like Firewire or Midi ports, so I would say remove those. The PCI card uses 5W, that's not a lot. The Blue Storm can handle that. When I figure out your watts used I only come to 362W, you have plenty of head room.

With the Avermedia, when your using the computer it plugs into the computer and uses its audio. When not in use you need an external speaker system, and the unit supplies the sound. Remote is a good feature, and its a plus with the Avermedia because its Infrared, so Line of Sight isn't an issue, as it is with the Sapphire card, which is needs Line of Sight.

Rotarian_SC · 08-07-05, 12:25 PM

Yeah that's a midi/usb port that I don't use too much. Well with what's not listed in my sig I have a Audigy 2 ZS Platinum, a keyboard, a dvd burner drive, and a dvd rom drive that also use power, but I would bet with all of that on still it doesn't come out near 500W. I guess the only thing to worry about down there would be heat then, but I would imagine that probably wouldn't be too much of a problem.

How's the software been on your ATi, because the common complaint against them seems to be their bad drivers and lack of software support.

dicecca112 · 08-07-05, 05:41 PM

Drivers wise its fine. Software wise its not as good as the Hauppauge cards. Its Cyberlink PowerCinema. It supports full screen, and adjustable windows size. There is no TV Guide like software, but other than that its fine. Just not the best group of options

aeiou · 08-07-05, 07:13 PM

If you can afford it, what ever card you get get beyond tv. It is some great software- it makes you pc very nearly as good as a tivo. There is a trial version so you can see if you like it first.

i have a compro tv tuner that I am very happy with. it was cheap and it has an anolog cable tuner, fm tuner, as well as composite and svideo conections that I use for my gamecube and ps2.

NaNoBLaZe01 · 08-07-05, 07:25 PM

sorry to step in but, will the tuners descramble your cable or do i still need to put the box on it?

aeiou · 08-07-05, 07:56 PM

If it is digital, you still need the box in most cases, but for analog you should be fine assuming you have access to the channels anyways.

NaNoBLaZe01 · 08-07-05, 08:40 PM

I live in NYC, and out of all the channels, only the local, public access, and 3 other channels are descrambled WITHOUT a box. This ****es me off, considering my parents pay for the channels.

I would like to be able to watch TV on my computer, but I doubt my parents would rent another cable box just for that. My question is... Can any TV tuner/software be able to descramble these analog channels? My parents do pay for them, I just don't want them to rent a box from TWC. Trying to save some money here... I think it is legal to buy your own cable box, too. So, I don't think this would be illegal in anyway.

To make a "long" story short, Is there any type of software analog descramblers out there?

dicecca112 · 08-07-05, 09:10 PM

no that would be called a black box which is highly illegal

kayson · 08-07-05, 09:49 PM

You could always buy a splitter and split the cable going from your parents' box to their tv. Then you run the second cable to your tv/pc.

aeiou · 08-07-05, 10:32 PM

Yeah, but you could only have one channel at a time that way, couldn't you?

Rotarian_SC · 08-08-05, 03:12 PM

I'll have digital cable, so will all of these tuners be able to use digital cable instead of analog? Right now it seems I'm leaning towards and external solution, and probably either the Hauppauge or ATi + BeyondTV.

Here they are--Hauppauge:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116624

ATI + BeyondTV
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116311

Both options cost about the same, but one thing I just want to make sure. The ATI does work well on nVidia cards, right?

aeiou · 08-08-05, 03:53 PM

They will use digital cable, but you will have to use a digital cable box, I believe.

Yes, the ati will work fine with an nvidia video card.

dicecca112 · 08-08-05, 04:44 PM

not neccesarily, my dorm has digital cable, and we don't use a box.

aeiou · 08-08-05, 05:16 PM

really? I wasn't aware that they were able to. I thought that they were all analog tuners.
Does it need to say explicitly digital tuner?

dicecca112 · 08-08-05, 05:56 PM

nope, I used my Hauppauge 250 and it worked fine.

aeiou · 08-08-05, 06:14 PM

interesting, I wonder if it works with sattelite, too.

Lifthanger · 08-08-05, 06:45 PM

hauppauge's nova series cards take the digital satellite signal without a receiver.
they only have one input connector and that one is like the input on a receiver.

Rotarian_SC · 08-08-05, 06:59 PM

So if I do have digital cable for my dorm, and do have a box it will surely work, right? Will it work on either of my final two cards without a box?

Captain Slug · 08-08-05, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeiou

interesting, I wonder if it works with sattelite, too.

No, Satellite signals are completely deifferent and have to be decoded and filtered by the receiver.
If you want to watch satellite television on your computer you will need a receiver, a TV tuner (Preferably with S-Video input), and a means of controlling the channel changing through the receiver. Normally this is done with IR output, but most DirecTV receiver can be controlled with a serial cable and http://www.dtvcontrol.com

Only satellite TV services outside of the United States offer broadcasting modes compatible with specialized stand-alone TV tuner cards, which are not available as external devices.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifthanger

hauppauge's nova series cards take the digital satellite signal without a receiver.
they only have one input connector and that one is like the input on a receiver.

For European satellite services that use DVB. Dish and DirecTV do not use the DVB standard.

Lifthanger · 08-08-05, 08:24 PM

thanks for this explanation Captain Slug.
I didn't want to confuse anyone - sorry for that.
A friend of mine is using DVB TV with a hauppauge card here in Germany.

JCLW · 08-08-05, 09:54 PM

Digital cable starts above ch 125 (or whatever it is now). Even on a digital cable feed you can still get the first 125 channels with an analogue receiver (hope that made sense - it's late).

If you don't want to record video onto your TV why not consider one of these: http://www.viewsonic.com/pdf/us_eng/...N5mar04low.pdf
or: http://www.viewsonic.com/pdf/us_eng/...isionN6.r2.pdf

(review: http://www.thetechlounge.com/review....sion_n6&page=1)

Then you can watch TV even if your computer is off.

It includes composite, S-video, and component video inputs so you can hook up your Playstations and set-top DVD players too. And a remote.

And you don't have to run the (IMHO) crappy buggy software that comes with TV tuner cards.

Captain Slug · 08-08-05, 09:59 PM

Almost forgot about the option JCLW just introduced. There's a variety of "VGA Box" solutions available that allow you to easily swap between different inputs for displaying on any VGA monitor. Think of it like a KVM for you Computer, XBox, Cable, etc.
They're also (on average) cheaper than external tuner devices.

Rotarian_SC · 08-08-05, 10:21 PM

Well, I would prefer the option to record video to my computer, I won't be using it to play any sort of consoles, and I can't really watch TV with my computer off because I would like sound, which must come through my sound card and speaker system. Plus, I heard they stopped producing the N5 and only made the N4 and N6 now.

So how do I tell which recievers have digital support? Most don't indicate it.

08-03-05, 10:34 PM	#1
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	External TV Tuner Card I live in a small dorm room, and my options are basically to have either a 12" TV or just buy a TV tuner card to watch TV on my computer which has a 19" LCD flat screen. I don't really watch TV and use my computer at the same time anyways, and if I needed to do electronic work while watching TV I could always use my laptop. Since I have all of my PCI slots filled up already, I would need one that is external and plugs in via firewire or USB or something. I would prefer that it have it's own power source as well, considering I'm running a lot on my current PSU already. So my questions are, should I go with the small TV or with the TV tuner card? Also, could you reccomend any TV tuner cards that fit the guidelines I'm looking for. I don't want to get too high on the price, but I don't want a bad card.

08-03-05, 10:56 PM	#2
Know Nuttin Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Ontario, Canada	I'd go with the TV Tuner. Look at the ATI TV-Wonder USB 2.0. Avoid the MSI Vox. http://www.ati.com/products/tvwonderusb20/ __________________ AMD X4 620, Gigabyte GA-MA785GM-US2H, OCZ Platinum Rev 2 PC2-6400, Coolermaster Hyper212+, Seagate 7200.11 500GB, Lenovo X61s, L7500 C2D, 4GB, 64GB Supertalent ME.

08-06-05, 10:40 PM	#5
kayson Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: USA	You probably won't notice a difference between picture quality between cards. In my experience, its the software that makes the difference. I have an ATI TV Wonder Pro, and the software that came with it sucks. I ended up getting intervideo windvr. Picture quality is great. I play halo 2 on my 19" lcd and its perfect. I would get the ATI usb card. As for a remote, I'd say it depends on how close you are to your keyboard. If you're gonna be at your desk (which I am when I use the card), using the keyboard shortcuts isnt a problem. If you're farther away, I'd definitely get a remote. __________________ Build Journal (Project Silver) Intel Core i7-980X Asus P6X58D Premium Corsair Dominator 3x2GB DDR3-1600 Asus ATI Radeon HD 5770 Corsair HX850 PSU Intel X25-M G2 80GB Thermalright Venomous X \|\| 2x 120mm Panaflo \|\| Arctic Silver V Lian-Li PC-A77FA \|\| Vantec Nexus Fan Controller Heatware

08-06-05, 10:40 PM	#6
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	well from I have been reading the Avermedia is more functional, and delivers better image quality due to its Progressive scan and 3D Motion De-Interlace. I am going to buy the Tvbox9 later next week, so feel free to PM me as you have been with any more questions. I'll try to do a mini review as well. But the Avermedia does not allow for recording, the hauppauge does, but I question the image quality, of the hauppauge, because it lacks much if any onboard memory. But I still say that you should ditch one PCI card if you can and get the one in my sig 75$ and incredible image quality, remote and all. But if you can't I'd say go with the Avermedia Product, it looks promising. Last edited by dicecca112; 08-06-05 at 10:50 PM.

08-06-05, 11:18 PM	#7
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	http://www.mustangmods.com/data/10014/dscn0428_01.jpg Well, I might have room in one of my PCI slots, but it would be a tight fit and is not much as you can see. I would also imagine that a TV tuner would consume a decent deal of power, and I'm close to stretching it as it is (unless you volunteer to send me your old OCZ 520W ). Otherwise I would go with a PCI one. Right now my options for ditching would either be a graphics card or my sound card, so I really don't want to ditch one. I will be at my desk, so I guess a remote won't really matter. I won't really be using this at all for gaming, so I'm not caring much about signal lag, more just about picture quality and preferably something with good sound. The ability to record is a nice plus, but not really integral. Edit: On the AVerMedia it lists audio output as either headphones or speaker. I assume it can be plugged into my audio line in for my soundcard and work through my computer speakers, right? Because that's the only way I have for listening to the TV. Last edited by Rotarian_SC; 08-06-05 at 11:29 PM.

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08-03-05, 11:04 PM	#3
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	That looks pretty nice, but how easy is it to change the channels without a remote, is having a remote for it very useful?

08-06-05, 10:34 PM	#4
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	I have two other cards I'm looking at: Hauppauge http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116624 AVerMedia http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815100002 What interface delivers the best picture quality, and is there really a difference between the two interfaces?

08-07-05, 11:48 AM	#8
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	the Sapphire Theatrix would be my choice for you, I have it now. I'm assuming that the spot that the unused PCI card is USB or some other sort like Firewire or Midi ports, so I would say remove those. The PCI card uses 5W, that's not a lot. The Blue Storm can handle that. When I figure out your watts used I only come to 362W, you have plenty of head room. With the Avermedia, when your using the computer it plugs into the computer and uses its audio. When not in use you need an external speaker system, and the unit supplies the sound. Remote is a good feature, and its a plus with the Avermedia because its Infrared, so Line of Sight isn't an issue, as it is with the Sapphire card, which is needs Line of Sight.

08-07-05, 12:25 PM	#9
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	Yeah that's a midi/usb port that I don't use too much. Well with what's not listed in my sig I have a Audigy 2 ZS Platinum, a keyboard, a dvd burner drive, and a dvd rom drive that also use power, but I would bet with all of that on still it doesn't come out near 500W. I guess the only thing to worry about down there would be heat then, but I would imagine that probably wouldn't be too much of a problem. How's the software been on your ATi, because the common complaint against them seems to be their bad drivers and lack of software support.

08-07-05, 05:41 PM	#10
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	Drivers wise its fine. Software wise its not as good as the Hauppauge cards. Its Cyberlink PowerCinema. It supports full screen, and adjustable windows size. There is no TV Guide like software, but other than that its fine. Just not the best group of options

08-07-05, 07:13 PM	#11
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	If you can afford it, what ever card you get get beyond tv. It is some great software- it makes you pc very nearly as good as a tivo. There is a trial version so you can see if you like it first. i have a compro tv tuner that I am very happy with. it was cheap and it has an anolog cable tuner, fm tuner, as well as composite and svideo conections that I use for my gamecube and ps2.

08-07-05, 07:25 PM	#12
NaNoBLaZe01 Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: queens, NYC	sorry to step in but, will the tuners descramble your cable or do i still need to put the box on it? __________________ Gigabyte EX58-UD3R Intel Core i7 920 w/ Scythe Mugen 2 Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 4870 1GB OCZ Platinum 6GB DDR3-1600 [7-7-7-24] WD Raptor 74GB \| WD Caviar Black 1TB Sony Optiarc 7220S \| LITEON 52327S Corsair HX620W

08-07-05, 07:56 PM	#13
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	If it is digital, you still need the box in most cases, but for analog you should be fine assuming you have access to the channels anyways.

08-07-05, 08:40 PM	#14
NaNoBLaZe01 Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: queens, NYC	I live in NYC, and out of all the channels, only the local, public access, and 3 other channels are descrambled WITHOUT a box. This ****es me off, considering my parents pay for the channels. I would like to be able to watch TV on my computer, but I doubt my parents would rent another cable box just for that. My question is... Can any TV tuner/software be able to descramble these analog channels? My parents do pay for them, I just don't want them to rent a box from TWC. Trying to save some money here... I think it is legal to buy your own cable box, too. So, I don't think this would be illegal in anyway. To make a "long" story short, Is there any type of software analog descramblers out there? __________________ Gigabyte EX58-UD3R Intel Core i7 920 w/ Scythe Mugen 2 Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 4870 1GB OCZ Platinum 6GB DDR3-1600 [7-7-7-24] WD Raptor 74GB \| WD Caviar Black 1TB Sony Optiarc 7220S \| LITEON 52327S Corsair HX620W

08-07-05, 09:10 PM	#15
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	no that would be called a black box which is highly illegal

08-07-05, 09:49 PM	#16
kayson Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: USA	You could always buy a splitter and split the cable going from your parents' box to their tv. Then you run the second cable to your tv/pc. __________________ Build Journal (Project Silver) Intel Core i7-980X Asus P6X58D Premium Corsair Dominator 3x2GB DDR3-1600 Asus ATI Radeon HD 5770 Corsair HX850 PSU Intel X25-M G2 80GB Thermalright Venomous X \|\| 2x 120mm Panaflo \|\| Arctic Silver V Lian-Li PC-A77FA \|\| Vantec Nexus Fan Controller Heatware

08-07-05, 10:32 PM	#17
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	Yeah, but you could only have one channel at a time that way, couldn't you?

08-08-05, 03:12 PM	#18
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	I'll have digital cable, so will all of these tuners be able to use digital cable instead of analog? Right now it seems I'm leaning towards and external solution, and probably either the Hauppauge or ATi + BeyondTV. Here they are--Hauppauge: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116624 ATI + BeyondTV http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16815116311 Both options cost about the same, but one thing I just want to make sure. The ATI does work well on nVidia cards, right?

08-08-05, 03:53 PM	#19
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	They will use digital cable, but you will have to use a digital cable box, I believe. Yes, the ati will work fine with an nvidia video card.

08-08-05, 04:44 PM	#20
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	not neccesarily, my dorm has digital cable, and we don't use a box.

08-08-05, 05:16 PM	#21
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	really? I wasn't aware that they were able to. I thought that they were all analog tuners. Does it need to say explicitly digital tuner?

08-08-05, 05:56 PM	#22
dicecca112 Member Join Date: Feb 2004	nope, I used my Hauppauge 250 and it worked fine.

08-08-05, 06:14 PM	#23
aeiou Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Madison, WI	interesting, I wonder if it works with sattelite, too.

08-08-05, 06:45 PM	#24
Lifthanger Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Wöschbach LMAO	hauppauge's nova series cards take the digital satellite signal without a receiver. they only have one input connector and that one is like the input on a receiver. __________________ Gentoo AMD64 - Fluxbox

08-08-05, 06:59 PM	#25
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	So if I do have digital cable for my dorm, and do have a box it will surely work, right? Will it work on either of my final two cards without a box?

08-08-05, 08:24 PM	#27
Lifthanger Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Wöschbach LMAO	thanks for this explanation Captain Slug. I didn't want to confuse anyone - sorry for that. A friend of mine is using DVB TV with a hauppauge card here in Germany. __________________ Gentoo AMD64 - Fluxbox

08-08-05, 09:54 PM	#28
JCLW Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Back in Toronto	Digital cable starts above ch 125 (or whatever it is now). Even on a digital cable feed you can still get the first 125 channels with an analogue receiver (hope that made sense - it's late). If you don't want to record video onto your TV why not consider one of these: http://www.viewsonic.com/pdf/us_eng/...N5mar04low.pdf or: http://www.viewsonic.com/pdf/us_eng/...isionN6.r2.pdf (review: http://www.thetechlounge.com/review....sion_n6&page=1) Then you can watch TV even if your computer is off. It includes composite, S-video, and component video inputs so you can hook up your Playstations and set-top DVD players too. And a remote. And you don't have to run the (IMHO) crappy buggy software that comes with TV tuner cards. __________________ ♫♪ ☺ ♫♪

08-08-05, 09:59 PM	#29
Captain Slug Helpful Senior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Asteroid B-612	Almost forgot about the option JCLW just introduced. There's a variety of "VGA Box" solutions available that allow you to easily swap between different inputs for displaying on any VGA monitor. Think of it like a KVM for you Computer, XBox, Cable, etc. They're also (on average) cheaper than external tuner devices. __________________ \|\|[ Oni is a bot! ]-[ My Heatware]-[ Project: Metal Slug ]-[ In the event of an emergency, the nearest senior member may be used as a floatation device. ]\|\| \|\|[ OC Forums Apparel is now available through cafepress ]-[ If you want a particular item with a particular image just PM me ]\|\|

08-08-05, 10:21 PM	#30
Rotarian_SC Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Boston	Well, I would prefer the option to record video to my computer, I won't be using it to play any sort of consoles, and I can't really watch TV with my computer off because I would like sound, which must come through my sound card and speaker system. Plus, I heard they stopped producing the N5 and only made the N4 and N6 now. So how do I tell which recievers have digital support? Most don't indicate it.