appreciate your (modern) hardware

FudgeNuggets · Jun 29, 2006

Man, you just don't realize how bad previous gen stuff looks until you start playing retro games. I thought aside from Fight Night Round 3 that the 360s graphics weren't that great, even in HD until I went on my quest to beat all my old games that I left half-finished and went back to playing some Xbox1 games and Playstation 2 games as well as PS1 games and N64 games. I just never really realized how BAD an PS2 or Xbox1 game looks compared to a 360 or how TERRIBLE a PS1 or N64 game looks compared to a Xbox1, GameCube, PS2 or Dreamcast game. I'm sure the same goes for PC games but I was just astounded when last week I beat Conker's BFD on the N64, beat Dukes of Hazzard Return of the General Lee on the PS2 and started where I left off at on Dukes of Hazzard (Daisy Dukes it out) on the PS1 how TERRIBLE each generation compared to it's successor. There is an ENORMOUS difference between the PS1, N64, Saturn Generation and the GameCube, PS2, Deamcast, Xbox1 generation.. (If you can't tell, I'm a BIG Dukes of Hazzard fan, I've even met Ben Jones aka Cooter a few times)

soulfly1448 · Jun 29, 2006

Yeah, I tried to play Final Fantasy 7 the other day... Had to stop. Couldn't put up with the awful polygon work. I can remember when it first came out and it was the coolest looking RPG evar!

Elif Tymes · Jun 29, 2006

Hehe, Yep. I know the feeling

MEMex · Jun 29, 2006

/agree

We are all spoiled now

The one game that bothers me when I go back to play is Zelda for N64. I just drives me insane for some reason... as if the resolution is way to low or something hehe

twoeyes · Jun 29, 2006

they dont bother me to much, i just think of it as the games art style, tbh new games dont look that great eaither, they just look unrealistic in a different way. IMO games like Z:OOT have great graphical longevity because of the awesome artistic style display in making the game, the animations, the characters bouncing around (the lon lon ranch gun running, etc) is all very cartoonish and fun to watch.

sike · Jun 29, 2006

Art styles that don't try to be ultra-realistic help a lot, but even for instance LOZ:The Wind Waker looks kind of un-sharp, especially in the distance.

It's true we still put up with a lot of unrealistic graphics today. I wonder how long it will be until games quit looking textured altogether?

twoeyes · Jun 30, 2006

Quite a bit longer i'd think

unfortunatly at this point it wouldnt matter if NVIDIA/ATI released a 3Ghz GPU with 2GB of onboard GDDR4, at this point artists still dont have the tools and skills required to make a perfectly photorealistic scenes when they have unlimited polygon counts that rendering (or a theoritical GPU) allows for (granted your render time will be monstrous). Technologies such as HDR are heading in the right direction (as soon as we get lighting perfected we'll have a much better overall rendering quality, that wont depend on the artist) but there are other developments that need to take place.

A good example would be a paintbrush, even if you have the most high tech amazing paintbrush in the world leonardo da vinci will outdo you every time.

mage_x · Jun 30, 2006

I played through Zelda: The Ocarina of Time for N64 the other day and thought the graphics were still pretty good

Maviryk · Jun 30, 2006

Screw good graphics.

I'm tired of all this bragging about how good graphics are. They may matter, but in the grand scheme of things. Graphics can't make a poor game good, they make a good game better.

I still like NES Zelda and Mario.

Aidenswarrior · Jun 30, 2006

Maviryk said:
Screw good graphics.

I'm tired of all this bragging about how good graphics are. They may matter, but in the grand scheme of things. Graphics can't make a poor game good, they make a good game better.

I still like NES Zelda and Mario.

seriously. I play dreamcast and my emulators on it all the time. Who cares about graphics? If the gameplay rules and it has ****ty graphics then who gives a ****?

Papier · Jun 30, 2006

One thing I really hate is how people assume that the more polygons a game pushes, the better the graphics will be. In my opinion, it's not how much it is, but how they use it that counts.

A good example is Doom 3. I really think it's an awesome engine, but overall they did bad because you COULDN'T SEE ANYTHING! This is why Half-Life 2 had critical acclaim because, even though imo the character models sucked, it used its graphics to enhance the feel of the game pretty well.

I'm really tired of seeing the same old warehouse with the same old crates, except it has normal mapping and parralax mapping. Instead, I want to see more "artistic" approach where it just awesome pieces of work.

/rant mode over

Ya, I agree with you about old game graphics. I bought C&C first decade and played through all the games. I couldn't believe what I thought was awesome back then now sucks graphic-wise. But nothing can replace the mammoth tank though.

blueswitch · Jun 30, 2006

I don't really care about graphics as much as how fun a game is. I play retro all the time, I was alittle shocked though at how fuzzie Ocarnia of Time was last time I hooked it up, I thought man this is almost bad for my vision...and it's one of my favorie games of all time...probably top 3 or 4. Although maybe that my TV is HD now it might make it look worse...since Ocarnia was definatly meant for interlaced TV's and it's resolution is probably low...by the time my TV converts it too progressive and bumps it too HD...there's probably alot of interpolation happening. I notice the older the game the more moire pattern I can see.

RedDragonXXX · Jun 30, 2006

Maviryk said:
Screw good graphics.

I'm tired of all this bragging about how good graphics are. They may matter, but in the grand scheme of things. Graphics can't make a poor game good, they make a good game better.

I still like NES Zelda and Mario.

I hear people keep saying that, but I don't remember one high quality game that had good graphics and turned out to be bad :shrug:

Just to name few:

FarCry
HL2
Doom3
Halo and Halo2
MGS series
FN3
GRAW
F.E.A.R.
Resident Evil series on GC
...

If game developers put allot of production value in a game, naturally it's going to look good and guess what, it will most likely play good as well.

Same goes if you flip things around. Poor production value will produce poor game. It may be fun to pick up and play, but once you really start playing it fades out quickly.

Zelda and Mario had good graphics back in their day so you can't really compare it to what's out today.

Tell me that this doesn't look like fun to play:

updawg · Jun 30, 2006

Its kind of odd that you named only FPS games, there is a world of games outside of high end graphics and shooter games. I played super smash brothers and bond last night on n64, these are awesome games without top notch graphics. I do agree they put more effort into these games and they are generally good but I like a variety of games.

RedDragonXXX · Jun 30, 2006

updawg said:
Its kind of odd that you named only FPS games, there is a world of games outside of high end graphics and shooter games. I played super smash brothers and bond last night on n64, these are awesome games without top notch graphics. I do agree they put more effort into these games and they are generally good but I like a variety of games.

MGS
FN3
GRAW on Xbox360
Resident Evil

None of those above are FPS's.

I could name others like GT series, which is a racing game, FF series has always looked impressive and new ones on PS3 just look amazing...

Again both the games that you named were good looking back in their day. Like I said, it's all about the production value and generally if game has good graphics it will turn out to be a great game.

Papier · Jun 30, 2006

RedDragonXXX said:
MGS
FN3
GRAW on Xbox360
Resident Evil

None of those above are FPS's.

I could name others like GT series, which is a racing game, FF series has always looked impressive and new ones on PS3 just look amazing...

Again both the games that you named were good looking back in their day. Like I said, it's all about the production value and generally if game has good graphics it will turn out to be a great game.

I think you're mixing immersion quality with fun. When we play games, we want to feel immersed in it. Graphics helps alot in this aspect. Immersion helps alot with the game having a good feel and overall fun.

If a game is all about graphics and nothing else, then it's not going to be fun. Although graphics helps out in a slightest bit, it's always about the synergy, about making all aspects working well together. If you don't have good gameplay, fun, good sound, and other stuff, it's going to come out like crap.

This is how some of the old RPG's are still fun even after years. I still play xenogears once in a while because it's alot of fun, good music, storyline, but it has crappy graphics. I acknowledge the bad graphics, but it's still a fun game and I enjoy it.

biglonstud · Jun 30, 2006

I have noticed that the older NES, SNES, N64 games dont look nearly as good as the current Gen (GC, XBox360, and PS2). But they are still alot of fun, they no longer have that "wow they look amazing" effect(all games will probably lose that effect eventually).

But they are alot of fun! The old Super Mario Kart is still a ton of fun, and Zelda OOT is still alot of fun. Graphics wise, compared to current Gen(or next Gen), they dont look so cool. But the graphics are part of the old "Retroness" of the game(Retroness... hmm...). And I agree, it is part of the old art style.

Oh, and I think the old Retro games, with low resolutions look, and play great on protable systems!

But, yeah, its dissapointing to go back and play 007 Goldeneye expecting to be WOWed by the graphics, but be dissapointed with the way it looks, after playing Half Life 2, Oblivion, Fear, and Resident Evil 4.

FudgeNuggets · Jun 30, 2006

blueswitch said:
I don't really care about graphics as much as how fun a game is. I play retro all the time, I was alittle shocked though at how fuzzie Ocarnia of Time was last time I hooked it up I thought man this is almost bad for my vision...and it's one of my favorie games of all time...probably top 3 or 4. Although maybe that my TV is HD now it might make it look worse...since Ocarnia was definatly meant for interlaced TV's and it's resolution is probably low...by the time my TV converts it too progressive and bumps it too HD...there's probably alot of interpolation happening. I notice the older the game the more moire pattern I can see.

Funny you mentioned that I thought I was going to go blind straining my eyes to play Conker but, I played Zelda OoT on my N64 and it looked pretty bad, but I ALSO have it on the Free Zelda disc that came with my GameCube and it didn't look bad at all on that. I guess the GC hardware cleans up the graphics quite a bit. Both were played with an S-video hookup on a standard def tube TV. The only thing I have hooked up to the HD is the 360.

lemings · Jun 30, 2006

RedDragonXXX said:
I hear people keep saying that, but I don't remember one high quality game that had good graphics and turned out to be bad

Just to name few:

FarCry
HL2
Doom3
Halo and Halo2
MGS series
FN3
GRAW
F.E.A.R.
Resident Evil series on GC
...

If game developers put allot of production value in a game, naturally it's going to look good and guess what, it will most likely play good as well.

Same goes if you flip things around. Poor production value will produce poor game. It may be fun to pick up and play, but once you really start playing it fades out quickly.

Zelda and Mario had good graphics back in their day so you can't really compare it to what's out today.

Tell me that this doesn't look like fun to play:

That doesn't look like fun to play because its going to kill my system

RedDragonXXX · Jun 30, 2006

lemings said:
That doesn't look like fun to play because its going to kill my system

It will kill everyone's system right now cause the hardware that it's supposed to run on it's not even released at the moment.

appreciate your (modern) hardware

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