[aja]

Dear Microsoft.

You have been my not-so-loyal friend for many years. I feel the time has come to say goodbye and good riddance!

I have decided that the best way for me to finally get rid of you is to work through the linux from scratch books so that I can forget about you and your faithful BSOD.

Is this way over my head? Of course! I have no idea what I am doing. I have always liked your fancy buttons and the comfort of knowing that I know nothing about you!(out of sight out of mind) But I need someone I can trust, someone I can ask to change, someone like Linux. Yes it is true that all I have ever done is load Ubuntu and set up my ADSL connection, but it opened my eyes and scraped off the cataracts you caused!

What was an affair with another operating system has evolved into a lifestyle choice.

This is probably going to be the steepest learning curve I have ever had to undertake. I might even not actually end up with anything functional, but at least I will learn about the kernal and compiling etc, something that you hide from me.

I wonder how long it would take to get rid of you? A few months? I don't care. I just want to be free again....

Ill send you a post card from the dark side, and don't expect me to come to your funeral

[Shelnutt2]

Please for give me for not staying in character but since I'm about to leave...might also want to check out gentoo if your going to do a source based linux.

[EmAn]

HAHA that is so very funny at 7:50 a.m.

im sorry but even though you guys have cookies i cant come to the dark side

or just move to the UK where the courts are forcing Microsoft to be open source!

[thideras]

OMG, perfect write-up

You'll have people behind you on this ordeal Aja!!

[CGR]

You know, I read all these complaints about BSOD's, but I cant help but think that the screens people get here are not necessarily XP's fault. I have used XP for years without a BSOD, when not OCing.

I OC my machines just like most on these forums, and yes I may get a BSOD while trying to find my stable speed, but once stable I never see them again.

SO, I am more inclined to think its user error causing the BSOD's a lot of the time.

If you OC, perhaps your system is not as stable as you think

My question to you aja is WHAT did you do to get the BSOD?

And lets NOT FORGET that Linux has its form of a BSOD as well.. Kernal Panic FTW!

[Misfit138]

Originally Posted by CGR

You know, I read all these complaints about BSOD's, but I cant help but think that the screens people get here are not necessarily XP's fault. I have used XP for years without a BSOD, when not OCing.............And lets NOT FORGET that Linux has its form of a BSOD as well.. Kernal Panic FTW!

QFT. All OS's have their annoyances. XP does a lot of things right, and is a great OS in a lot of ways.
One advantage to GNU/Linux is that it is very transparent; errors are logged and traceable, so things can be fixed usually, without the proverbial "Windows reinstall".
I must add though, that I didn't have nearly as many annoyances with Windows as with GNU/Linux, partially because there's not much to fiddle with, comparatively speaking.
With Windows, I used it as a solid, static platform to which I added software that I needed. GNU/Linux is different because it allows you to build from the ground up, and such customization invariably requires more maintenance and brings the potential for more breakage.
The 2 are quite different, even though they are used to do the same things.

[Enablingwolf]

I am a convert to Linux.

One thing I have found out. MS will always be a loose association to my computing. In a bad way? No, but personally. I will lean towards the Herd. I understand that we need tools for certain tasks.


As for the BSOD.... What are them things you talk about? I have to admit, They are rare, unless you have hardware issues. I have had more Kernel panics then the BSOD in the last.. oh.. 4 years. My bad though.

My machine: 99.9% GNU/Herd - 0.1% NTFS. (PITA for HW switch over)
Wifes machine: Used to be 100% GNU/Herd. Now it is 2x boot via GRUB. It is our simple gaming "older" machine running 2k( Xp was heavier then this, and I have legit copies<keys> of both.. and every one since forerever....) And yes, I crushed the network stack. When she needs files. She boots into Linux and moves the files over to the F32 drive. '98 does not support some of the hardware *angry* So 2K it was. I like Xp alot, but I want simple NTFS type gaming and none of the tom-foollery of the crap that is pushed!

You have to use what works for you. As does the kernel you choose. It may be one distro or a pick or Windows,

I treid to kill MS off my machines. I found out. My wife LOVES gaming. So MS will always have some place on our HD's/ No one says we have to have a network with it.

[ihrsetrdr]

I've had my share of bsods with Windows, and several kernel panics in Linux; that end of the user experience is not so much of an issue with me. I strongly resent the activation thing, and the whole mindset that the software purchase you made doesn't really "belong" to you, even though you paid for it. Of course, it goes without saying that piracy is not only illegal but immoral as well. I don't know what the solution is, for software developers that are trying to protect their intellectual 'rights', but for me as a consumer...I choose to use software that does not have those kinds of issues.

[Captain Newbie]

Originally Posted by CGR

And lets NOT FORGET that Linux has its form of a BSOD as well.. Kernal Panic FTW!

Yes, but a panic() excluding "couldn't mount root FS" is somewhat rare these days...you'll get an oops/BUG/WARNING, but not necessarily a panic. I'd say that for >=95% of PC hardware Linux operates flawlessly.

[aja]

Originally Posted by Shelnutt2

Please for give me for not staying in character but since I'm about to leave...might also want to check out gentoo if your going to do a source based linux.

I will look into that, thanks for the tip! I have seen you post about it a few times before

Originally Posted by EmAn

HAHA that is so very funny at 7:50 a.m.

im sorry but even though you guys have cookies i cant come to the dark side

or just move to the UK where the courts are forcing Microsoft to be open source!

No come, linux is calling you

Originally Posted by thideras

OMG, perfect write-up

You'll have people behind you on this ordeal Aja!!

Thank you! I think I am going to need the support LOL

Originally Posted by CGR

You know, I read all these complaints about BSOD's, but I cant help but think that the screens people get here are not necessarily XP's fault. I have used XP for years without a BSOD, when not OCing.

I OC my machines just like most on these forums, and yes I may get a BSOD while trying to find my stable speed, but once stable I never see them again.

SO, I am more inclined to think its user error causing the BSOD's a lot of the time.

If you OC, perhaps your system is not as stable as you think

My question to you aja is WHAT did you do to get the BSOD?

And lets NOT FORGET that Linux has its form of a BSOD as well.. Kernal Panic FTW!

You are misunderstanding my post and my situation. I was using the term BSOD to refer to what windows meant to me, what I identify it with. For me:

Windows=BSOD; start button; BSOD
Linux=confusing; free; customizable
Mac=one-button mouse; cool laptop keyboard design; too damn expensive

In any case, it is not an issue of "well if I get one more BSOD..."

BSOD!

"fine, no more Windows for me..."

It is so much more than that. It has to do with the fact that the latest and greatest Microsoft has to offer no longer appeals to me. When I was using Windows 98se I couldn't wait for this rumoured XP thing to arrive. Now that I am using XP, I dread the day I have to start using Vista. This is not from what I heard, but from my personal experience with the operating systems.

I have been using PC's for a long time. I grew up with DOS. In my honest opinion it was (and in a perfect world still is) the perfect operating system. I watched as Windows evolved further and further away from the structured command line into something that I find illogical and counterintuative to use. I taught myself how to use every operating system up until Vista. Now I have had enough. It seems that other than gaming or running specific programs, the daily tasks of emails, surfing, research, typing, programming etc are so much more convienient to me in the linux world. I have a very limited experience with Linux, but I knew more about it in 15 minutes than I did after my first few hours with Vista(And I am a windows-only user, and I am a PC tech!).

This is a personal choice, like choosing your next make of car. I will always have windows around, for CAD design and games etc. But I would also like to learn something new.

(As a direct answer to your question, I have experienced many BSOD's that were software related on stock clocked machines. I am not the type to overclock, get a BSOD, then go around badmouthing Microsoft. The non-overclock related BSOD's have been due to bad initial installs, corrupt system files and system hangs etc. I have experienced BSOD's on several PC's(I maintain a call center), using identical equipment. After a re-install it goes away, so it is not hardware related. Ghosts in the machines, maybe? I don't know. In any case, I want more than Microsoft can offer, in terms of being able to utilize what my computer is capable of)

Originally Posted by Misfit138

QFT. All OS's have their annoyances. XP does a lot of things right, and is a great OS in a lot of ways.
One advantage to GNU/Linux is that it is very transparent; errors are logged and traceable, so things can be fixed usually, without the proverbial "Windows reinstall".
I must add though, that I didn't have nearly as many annoyances with Windows as with GNU/Linux, partially because there's not much to fiddle with, comparatively speaking.
With Windows, I used it as a solid, static platform to which I added software that I needed. GNU/Linux is different because it allows you to build from the ground up, and such customization invariably requires more maintenance and brings the potential for more breakage.
The 2 are quite different, even though they are used to do the same things.

I guess you will know what I mean when I say that I couldn't be happier with my XP Pro x64, it is just that I want something more.

Originally Posted by Enablingwolf

I am a convert to Linux.

One thing I have found out. MS will always be a loose association to my computing. In a bad way? No, but personally. I will lean towards the Herd. I understand that we need tools for certain tasks.


As for the BSOD.... What are them things you talk about? I have to admit, They are rare, unless you have hardware issues. I have had more Kernel panics then the BSOD in the last.. oh.. 4 years. My bad though.

My machine: 99.9% GNU/Herd - 0.1% NTFS. (PITA for HW switch over)
Wifes machine: Used to be 100% GNU/Herd. Now it is 2x boot via GRUB. It is our simple gaming "older" machine running 2k( Xp was heavier then this, and I have legit copies<keys> of both.. and every one since forerever....) And yes, I crushed the network stack. When she needs files. She boots into Linux and moves the files over to the F32 drive. '98 does not support some of the hardware *angry* So 2K it was. I like Xp alot, but I want simple NTFS type gaming and none of the tom-foollery of the crap that is pushed!

You have to use what works for you. As does the kernel you choose. It may be one distro or a pick or Windows,

I treid to kill MS off my machines. I found out. My wife LOVES gaming. So MS will always have some place on our HD's/ No one says we have to have a network with it.

As I mentioned above, I will always have Windows around, I cannot do certain things without it. But I want to have the operating system behave exactly how I want it to behave.

Originally Posted by ihrsetrdr

I've had my share of bsods with Windows, and several kernel panics in Linux; that end of the user experience is not so much of an issue with me. I strongly resent the activation thing, and the whole mindset that the software purchase you made doesn't really "belong" to you, even though you paid for it. Of course, it goes without saying that piracy is not only illegal but immoral as well. I don't know what the solution is, for software developers that are trying to protect their intellectual 'rights', but for me as a consumer...I choose to use software that does not have those kinds of issues.

I love the fact that you can install Ubuntu (or equivalent) and switch it on. Yep thats right, just switch it on

No phoning and typing in stupidly long CD-keys. No stolen activations. No lost CD-keys. No lost CD's. No accidental deactivations. No "is your software genuine..." check. No "you have activated too many times"

Just switch it on

[aja]

Originally Posted by Captain Newbie

Yes, but a panic() excluding "couldn't mount root FS" is somewhat rare these days...you'll get an oops/BUG/WARNING, but not necessarily a panic. I'd say that for >=95% of PC hardware Linux operates flawlessly.

Uh, I think my brain just had a BSOD reading that. What did I get myself into? hehe

[Blankfile]

Respect man, welcome to the dark side

Made the move myself before starting university (so, like 4 months ago), and i don't regret it by an iota. 95% of my daily computing is done on Ubuntu, the other 5% behing some games...

No more pain. No more hassle. No more dumbed down interface with friendly, talking piece of hardware trying to help you out. Definitively not an atom of DRM. Couldn't be happier... unless <EDIT> there was a way to correctly emulate DirectX9-10 via either Wine or Cedega or some other application, in order to allow support for the gaming community, which is a big chunk of computer users who (usually) couldn't care less about which OS they run, as long as the games work. </EDIT>, now THAT would be pure bliss

Back to the topic, if you need any help in order to complete the move, i guess everyone here will lend a hand, me first.

[Enablingwolf]

If DX10 comes to Linux. I move over to BSD.

[Blankfile]

Ow my bad, please allow me to rephrase my above statement:

If there was a way to correctly emulate DirectX9-10 via either Wine or Cedega or some other application, in order to allow support for the gaming community which is a big chunk of computer users who (usually) couldn't care less about which OS they run, as long as the games work.

I know that this would allow myself to get 100% rid of any m$ application, AND allow me to convert some friends who are deeply entangled into gaming.

Again, i get how easily my above statement could be misintepreted,and will therefore edit it, but didn't want to extrapolate on the subject since it's getting quite offtopic.

[splat]

this was entertaining, and if you really are going LFS on your first full install, more power to you. I got my first taste by running FreeBSD...but when I decided to kick Windows from being my fulltime desktop OS, i went Slackware. Then I got tired of managing packages by hand, so I went Gentoo. I've always wanted to do a LFS, but I've felt that Gentoo is as close to that as I really need to be.

but Kudos.

[CGR]

Well, I am fairly certain I will always have an MS OS for gaming.

Not that I dont use linux, my firewall is a slackware machine. If you truely want to learn linux forget all the other distros, use slackware... If you can use slackware all other distros are cake..

I just dont see linux ever being a graphics powerhouse like MAC OS or MS OS's.

It has its place, however to me not as an everyday desktop machine.
Ubuntu is proof of that. That drive partition program they have is AWFUL!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy cow it was bad.. Using fdisk is easier than that..

[Soichiro]

Originally Posted by CGR

It has its place, however to me not as an everyday desktop machine.
Ubuntu is proof of that. That drive partition program they have is AWFUL!!!!!!!!!!!

Holy cow it was bad.. Using fdisk is easier than that..

Yeah... and just how many "everyday desktop" users are going to need a drive partition program?

However, you're right that linux won't be suitable for all desktops to run all the time, not until either developers start making more programs for it or the emulators for Windows-based programs (including DX9/10) become better.

[Archer36]

Originally Posted by splat

this was entertaining, and if you really are going LFS on your first full install, more power to you. I got my first taste by running FreeBSD...but when I decided to kick Windows from being my fulltime desktop OS, i went Slackware. Then I got tired of managing packages by hand, so I went Gentoo. I've always wanted to do a LFS, but I've felt that Gentoo is as close to that as I really need to be.

but Kudos.

Yep I took one look at LFS, then took off screaming and running like a little girl

My first experience with linux was Red Hat 7, then the different Fedora's, then suse for a very short time. Now I have been running exclusively slackware on my laptop and servers. The package feature is nice, but the only time I used it during the install, I install 98% of software by building it. It just makes me feel more complete

[Misfit138]

Originally Posted by Archer36

Yep I took one look at LFS, then took off screaming and running like a little girl

My first experience with linux was Red Hat 7, then the different Fedora's, then suse for a very short time. Now I have been running exclusively slackware on my laptop and servers. The package feature is nice, but the only time I used it during the install, I install 98% of software by building it. It just makes me feel more complete

Archer, if you like Slack as much as I do, you might like Arch. Please give it a try some time if you haven't already.
http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners_Guide

Aja, if LFS becomes too much, or if you lose interest, Slack (as was mentioned) Arch, and CRUX are excellent alternatives. If you can get Slack or CRUX to do what you need, you will have gained a good solid nix knowledge base and shouldn't have a problem with any distro.
Arch has a very powerful package manager and source build system that makes it very easy to be spoiled.

[aja]

Originally Posted by Misfit138

Aja, if LFS becomes too much, or if you lose interest, Slack (as was mentioned) Arch, and CRUX are excellent alternatives. If you can get Slack or CRUX to do what you need, you will have gained a good solid nix knowledge base and shouldn't have a problem with any distro.

Thank you for the brilliant suggestion!!! This is exactly what I want to achieve