[White Rain]

Which would be the better preformer? Also I've heard that Nvidia driver support of SLI in new games is far superior to ATI's crossfire support, and that crossfire takes months after a game release to end up having driver support for it.

[Albuquerque]

Not really, and in fact ATI releases drivers monthly (plus hotfixes) while NVIDIA releases drivers -- uh, every now and then.

SLI may still perform better, but then you're also absolutely stuck with an NVIDIA chipset-based motherboard too. My personal opinion of NVIDIA chipsets is quite low, mostly due to my prior experiences with them. I went with CrossFire because I wanted a chipset that doesn't require massive amounts of tweaks to hit 550FSB, and didn't want to spend $330 either.

So... Expensive motherboard for SLI and Penryn support? Or cheap motherboard for CF and Penryn support? Made my decision pretty easy. But so my preference for ATI's video quality, and so did ATI's monthly driver releases versus NVIDIA's tri-annual method.

(I'm the previous owner of a 7900GT)

[White Rain]

BFG Tech BFGE88512GTSE GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP $316.00
BFG Tech BFGE88512GTSE GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP $316.00
ASUS P5N-T Deluxe LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 780i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard $260.00


Is there a configuration of the 3870x2 in crossfire on a MB that would outpreform this and be the same pricepoint? (going to be using e8400 and 2x2x4 of ram (8gigs via 2gb modules)

[TTP]

Originally Posted by White Rain

BFG Tech BFGE88512GTSE GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP $316.00
BFG Tech BFGE88512GTSE GeForce 8800GTS (G92) 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP $316.00
ASUS P5N-T Deluxe LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 780i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard $260.00


Is there a configuration of the 3870x2 in crossfire on a MB that would outpreform this and be the same pricepoint? (going to be using e8400 and 2x2x4 of ram (8gigs via 2gb modules)

3870X2 in crossfire configuration would make it an equivalent quad-fire setup. I don't think there's drivers out for that support yet.

But you can pick any Intel chipset motherboard to suit your taste. I'm looking at the new X48 chipset motherboard like Asus ROG Rampage.

[Shell]

To Albuquerque:
It's a bit different then that, ATi's CrossFire often yields greater performance then SLI, but it does not work as often with the newest titles, but ATi released new drivers quite often, so poor performance one week on a title that just came out will often mean better performance with every release.

To TTP:
X48 is moderately WORTHLESS(really, what's so special?), and ASUS ROG is no better then my P5E, it's just stuffed full of features that actually slow you down a bit.

Might as well leave the path to upgradeability open:
3870X2 = $449
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...3870X2&x=0&y=0
X38 mainboard: $200
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813128080
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...2E16813131219R
A bit slower and MUCH cheaper.

Just remember more gpus demands more CPU, a q6660 or e8400 are the only affordable options out there right now, 45nm quadcore would be loved.

[White Rain]

That will still end up being 200 some dollars more than the sli of the GTS g92, would end up having to cut prices elsewhere somehow if I decided to go this way, would it be that big of a preformance increase over the g92's in sli? As for overclocking if I do any at all I plan to do very little due to cooling constraints.

[Shell]

What? $892 for dual G92GTS(/w NF780i), while it's only $649 for the 3870X2(/w X38), that's $243 cheaper, meaning you get greater performance : price, performance-per-watt, and still have room to upgrade.

[TheCheat]

A single 3870 X2 was beat by only the 8800GT SLI setup in most of the tests I saw at anandtech.com

I would go with the ATI setup myself, but be warned that ATI doesnt have 100% support for the 3870X2 yet(without a driver patch, it recognizes the card as a single 3870 and someone has already mentioned the crossfire problem)-- ATI has stated that it will have all the bugs worked out for the X2 by late feb- early march.

[White Rain]

Originally Posted by Shell

What? $892 for dual G92GTS(/w NF780i), while it's only $649 for the 3870X2(/w X38), that's $243 cheaper, meaning you get greater performance : price, performance-per-watt, and still have room to upgrade.

Not cheaper for 2 3870x2's

I may not have been clear,

2 g90's vs 2 3870x2's - pro's cons and if the ati is better a motherboard and 2 of the cards that is comparable in price to what I have listed above because that's what I have available to spend on these items.

[Shell]

Originally Posted by White Rain

Not cheaper for 2 3870x2's

Ya but getting two right now would be pointless because they won't even work until the new CrossFire X drivers are completed.

And do you really need that?

[White Rain]

Well I'm going to have money now to buy a system that I won't have money to upgrade for prolly 4 years or so which by then I'd prolly get to buy a whole new one. Wanting it to be good enough to not have game lag at 1920x1080 or at least managable levels of it till it gets replaced, so I need overkill now so it will last long enough.
If driver issues won't be a problem on the long term for these and they put the g92 in sli to shame when 2 are together in crossfirex it would be the preferred choice if I can find them cheap enough and make the price cuts elsewhere in my system to accomidate the budget.

[ghost_recon88]

Originally Posted by White Rain

Well I'm going to have money now to buy a system that I won't have money to upgrade for prolly 4 years or so which by then I'd prolly get to buy a whole new one.

With the way the industry is going, the 3870x2 will be dated by the end of the year. It's impossible to really build a computer, and expect it to handle all the oncoming stuff for the next 4 years, let alone next 2.

[White Rain]

Originally Posted by ghost_recon88

With the way the industry is going, the 3870x2 will be dated by the end of the year. It's impossible to really build a computer, and expect it to handle all the oncoming stuff for the next 4 years, let alone next 2.

My system as is I got 2 6800ultra's for sli when they first came out, and it has lasted me this long, trying to go for that again.

[Albuquerque]

Originally Posted by Shell

To Albuquerque:
It's a bit different then that, ATi's CrossFire often yields greater performance then SLI, but it does not work as often with the newest titles, but ATi released new drivers quite often, so poor performance one week on a title that just came out will often mean better performance with every release.

I'm not sure that I can agree; how well did the 7950GX2 do in this same regard? I have a few memories, and none of them were really that great. I'm not saying either one is worse, but I'm also really not agreeing that either one is better.

Originally Posted by ghost_recon88

With the way the industry is going, the 3870x2 will be dated by the end of the year. It's impossible to really build a computer, and expect it to handle all the oncoming stuff for the next 4 years, let alone next 2.

Indeed. A 7900GTX was top-of-the-line two years ago, but try playing Crysis at anything other than mostly-medium settings at any resolution. It's certainly possible, but only if you don't mind single-digit framerates. I know, because I owned one for about two years, and I played Crysis on it at 848x600 at mostly medium details because I couldn't get through the ice levels with any more than about 8FPS at any higher rez or setting. Even at all-medium details, my framerate was meh.

Or maybe you feel Crysis is too much of an expectation? Howabout Stalker with dynamic lighting enabled at 1680x1050? It worked, and it wasn't bad, but it wasn't always great either. Turning down a few options certainly helped, turning off dynamic lighting was by far the best option if you wanted everything else to stay at high.

A two year old system will not be anything like you are anticipating.

[TTP]

Originally Posted by Shell

To TTP:
X48 is moderately WORTHLESS(really, what's so special?), and ASUS ROG is no better then my P5E, it's just stuffed full of features that actually slow you down a bit.

Might as well leave the path to upgradeability open:
3870X2 = $449
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...3870X2&x=0&y=0
X38 mainboard: $200
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813128080
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...2E16813131219R
A bit slower and MUCH cheaper.

Just remember more gpus demands more CPU, a q6660 or e8400 are the only affordable options out there right now, 45nm quadcore would be loved.

Moderately worthless? Not to me. The ASUS ROG Rampage has a new layout that will give more room for crossfire. And improved BIOS configuration options. X48 offers 2 x16 PCIe 2.0 compliant slots and FSB1600 support.

Did you see anandtech's review? http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3208&p=1

Skip the commentary and check out the BIOS tweaking options

[Shell]

Originally Posted by TTP

Moderately worthless? Not to me. The ASUS ROG Rampage has a new layout that will give more room for crossfire. And improved BIOS configuration options. X48 offers 2 x16 PCIe 2.0 compliant slots and FSB1600 support.
Did you see anandtech's review? http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3208&p=1
Skip the commentary and check out the BIOS tweaking options

All of the extra money and it only has one feature I'd be willing to pay for, tRD tweaking...

If it did not have that I'd stick to my P5E, even if it were the same price... I'd just have to go through the trouble of taking out my mainboard, returning it, and getting the X48 RoG.

[Albuquerque]

Originally Posted by TTP

Moderately worthless? Not to me. The ASUS ROG Rampage has a new layout that will give more room for crossfire. And improved BIOS configuration options. X48 offers 2 x16 PCIe 2.0 compliant slots and FSB1600 support.

If you look, you'll discover that X38 has the exact same support.

Did you see anandtech's review? http://www.anandtech.com/mb/showdoc.aspx?i=3208&p=1

Skip the commentary and check out the BIOS tweaking options

My Gigabyte X38-DS4 has tRd tweak options as well.

[TTP]

Originally Posted by Albuquerque

If you look, you'll discover that X38 has the exact same support.


My Gigabyte X38-DS4 has tRd tweak options as well.

X38 has FSB support up to 1333. You can run it higher, but you'll likely need to up the MCH voltage. It also has more DDR3 features but that's moot until prices drop.

[Evilsizer]

X48 is nothing more then binned X38 MCH's. tring to say it doesnt support 1600fsb isnt right ... remember P965? it didnt at first offically support 1333fsb but later bios's added that support, just like with 975x based boards. P35 didnt offically support 1333fsb either but with later bios's got that support.

X38/X48 is only option for CF,X48 is more for bragging rights then anything else...

if you have been on the system this long then stick the money in the piggy bank and wait for Socket B at the end of 08. that platform will offer a better life span for cpu upgrades the nx38/x48 on LGA775. given the current plans to keep it for so long...

*edit*
forgot this...X38 doesnt need a MCH bump till around 500mhz fsb.

[Albuquerque]

Originally Posted by TTP

X38 has FSB support up to 1333. You can run it higher, but you'll likely need to up the MCH voltage. It also has more DDR3 features but that's moot until prices drop.

Tell that to my Gigabyte GA-X38-DS4. Right on the box "Supports FSB 1333/1600".

And as for voltage? Not even close. 100% stock MCH and CPU Vtt voltages = 550 FSB stable on my E6850. Only voltage I had to up was the DDR, and well, that's expected when running 800mhz modules at 1100Mhz. See the rig in my signature with the E8400 doing 4.3Ghz? Stock MCH voltage there too, with tRD of 7 and memory timings at 4-4-4-10.

No, X48 doesn't bring these features, they're already here.