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Access Point or Bridge?

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Gizmo200118

Registered
Joined
Nov 6, 2002
Location
Green bay WI
If i wanted to connect to a Wireless router Would i need an access point or a bridge? I don't want to use an Nic because I need to use an out side antenna. So I want to connect my computer up to an Access point or a bridge with a Cat 5 cable. And then to the out side antenna. To my brothers router (D-link Di-524) which is connect to his 2 computers and soon to be DSL connection.

We tried using a router and a NIC but we need to get our antenna up higher to clear a building that is blocking our signal and I don't want to run a RF cable from the NIC to the antenna because I heard it will slow it down.

So what I am asking is Will i Need to buy a Access Point or a Bridge. And what are the differences. And what would be the best one to work with his D-link DI-524)
 

Ddruid_SMP

Member
Joined
May 18, 2003
Location
Missouri
Gizmo200118 said:
If i wanted to connect to a Wireless router Would i need an access point or a bridge? I don't want to use an Nic because I need to use an out side antenna. So I want to connect my computer up to an Access point or a bridge with a Cat 5 cable. And then to the out side antenna. To my brothers router (D-link Di-524) which is connect to his 2 computers and soon to be DSL connection.

We tried using a router and a NIC but we need to get our antenna up higher to clear a building that is blocking our signal and I don't want to run a RF cable from the NIC to the antenna because I heard it will slow it down.

One side must be in 'AP' mode, the other must be a client. If you have a wireless router on one side then you have fullfilled the AP portion of the requirement. There is no reason NOT to use the nic, RF cable does not slow it down, it does however attenuate the signal the longer the cable is. I recommend using nothing smaller than LMR400 for runs that are 20'-70'. LMR400 attenuates a 2.4ghz signal by 6db per 100'. You can overcome the loss in signal by using a higher gain antenna.

You never responded to your other question, what standard are you attempting to use? If you are trying the 'extreme/super g' equipment I doubt it will work at that speed Infact, I believe that you'll be lucky if it establishes at any higher than 18MB. Most of the 'extreme g' I have tested spams the entire spectrum and is highly susceptible to noise and it also requires an insane signal strength to establish a full 108Mb/s connection.

If you want to place the antenna and radio outside I recommend using the following equipment:

Antenna: 14dbi ROOTenna with a RP-TNC to SMA pigtail.
Radio: 200mw CB3 Bridge & POE Injector

With the 200mw (23dbm) radio (the majority on the market are 65-100mw) and the 14dbi antenna you will have an estimated 37db of transmit power.
 
OP
G

Gizmo200118

Registered
Joined
Nov 6, 2002
Location
Green bay WI
Ok I will Keep the Card and run a cable. It will be about 40-50 feet.

The router he has is this one ( http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=316 ) It is the Air Plus G 54 Mbps one.

The card that I have is ( http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=308 ) witch is the Air Plus G 54Mbps one also.

My brother just ordered an antenna off of e-bay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5104276209&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT ) It is a 2.4 GHz 12 dBi Omni directional antenna. It says it has a Integral N Type Female connection.

Will that pig tail that you suggested work for his router to the LMR 400 N male?

All so will that antenna work well for me or would you suggest something else? We are only about 600 feet apart but I would like the fastest connection that we can get with the equipment that we have.

Thank you very much for your help.


B.J.
 
Last edited:

Ddruid_SMP

Member
Joined
May 18, 2003
Location
Missouri
Gizmo200118 said:
The router he has is this one ( http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=316 ) It is the Air Plus G 54 Mbps one.

The card that I have is ( http://www.dlink.com/products/?pid=308 ) witch is the Air Plus G 54Mbps one also.

My brother just ordered an antenna off of e-bay (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5104276209&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT ) It is a 2.4 GHz 12 dBi Omni directional antenna. It says it has a Integral N Type Female connection.

Will that pig tail that you suggested work for his router to the LMR 400 N male?

All so will that antenna work well for me or would you suggest something else? We are only about 600 feet apart but I would like the fastest connection that we can get with the equipment that we have.

Thank you very much for your help.
B.J.
I appologize for taking so long to respond, it is my busy season and I had a tower hit by lightning..

Both the card & router have reverse polarity SMA (RP-SMA) style connectors. Most LMR cable you buy premade will be N-MALE, so to go from the router to the LMR cable you'll need a RP-SMA to N-Female pigtail or adapter like these: Adapter Pigtail

Since you already have radio's, I wouldn't use the rootenna. You'll want something with a semi-broad beamwidth, so nothing above 19dbi/30deg something like This 19dbi panel or this grid. Both can be purchased with the correct N type fitting you need. The omni you bought is Vertically polarized, but it has a fairly flat beam pattern due to the high gain. The 3deg downtilt will help, but dont get it too high above the recieving end.

You *MAY* be able to hit a 54Mb/s link with some light obstruction, but with a -68db recieve sensitivity it will be tough to do with a building in the way..

Again, I can't stress enough that it is impossible for any of us to tell wether it will work or not without seeing it first hand, 600ft is not far and *SHOULD* be fairly easy to do..

*PS. I don't work for wisp-router, they are just a supplier we use and he tends to have pretty good prices. Fab-corp, and electrocomm are both good supplier as well.
 
OP
G

Gizmo200118

Registered
Joined
Nov 6, 2002
Location
Green bay WI
Ok I am glad that you recommend that grid antenna because I just ordered it earlier today.

I didn't want to get a panel one for fear of wind taking it.

We are going to attempt to get the antennas above the building that is in the way. It is just a little bit above my apartment.

Will this still be legal with the FCC and how hight can I put my antenna. I heard that I could only go so far above the highest thing on my property I will only have to go about 5-10 feet above my roof line.

We also bought 4 25' lengths of LMR400 with N-male ends. 2 for each house. We are going to put one of these Surge Protectors
to connect the two 25' wires. It will be out side. Will this thing help if the antenna got hit buy lightning?

Also I will have my tv antenna on the same pole but lower down on it. Would I have to have something like that for it also or would the one for the network antenna work for both since that is the one that should get hit first.

Thanks again!

B.J.
 

Ddruid_SMP

Member
Joined
May 18, 2003
Location
Missouri
The primary difference between the panel & grid is that the panels have a better front to back ratio. This means that it does not pickup signal from the rear as well as the front, grids on the other hand have a low fbr and will pickup noise from behind them.

FCC Will not care about how high you put the antenna, your landlord on the otherhand probably will. As far as transmit power, both sides are legal. The side with the omni is limited to 36db eirp because it is considered point to multipoint and it broadcasts in all directions. The other side is limited to 48db because it is a point to point link and the beam is focused. With the equipment you posted you will have an estimated: 12dbi(omni gain) + 15dbm(tx power) - 1db(cable loss) - 2db (connector loss) - 2db(lightning protector loss) = 22db eirp on the omni side. For the other side it looks like: 19dbi(ant. gain) + 15dbm(tx power) - 1db(cable) - 2db(connectors) - 2db(suppressor) = 29db eirp. These are just estimates based on average losses.

The protector will help, but it must be grounded to do any good. You will need an additional protector for the tv antenna.

Be sure to seal the connectors any water will kill the signal, I use butyl tape, but a good silicone works just as well.
 
OP
G

Gizmo200118

Registered
Joined
Nov 6, 2002
Location
Green bay WI
Ok i got the stuff the other day. Got everything up and running and we are connected at 54Mbps with a 100% signal strength and a Link Quality always in the 90s. I love it. I just wanted to thank you for your help.

Thanks Again

B.J.
 

Ddruid_SMP

Member
Joined
May 18, 2003
Location
Missouri
Congrats!
It sounds like a pretty solid link, I never have trusted those percentage numbers though, at least not with a Db conversion for the percentage.