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Another one (SSD) bites the dust.

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HankB

Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Location
Beautiful Sunny Winfield
Maybe.

In another thread, someone posted "friends don't let friends buy Seagate." I don't buy their 'mid range' HDDs after experiencing high failure rates on their 2TB drives. I'm inclined to add SSDs to the crap list as well.

About 4 years ago I bought a Seagate 240GB SSD. It was cheap at the time. ;) Most recently it was used in my wife's laptop. I ssh in periodically and update Debian packages and then exhort her to reboot. (Which she doesn't, but that's a subject for another day.)

I was greeted by a prompt "you have email."I installed `mutt` so I could read it. It said that the system drive was failing. When I examined the SMART data I found.
Code:
SMART Attributes Data Structure revision number: 0
Vendor Specific SMART Attributes with Thresholds:
ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME          FLAG     VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE      UPDATED  WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE
  1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate     0x000e   001   001   006    Old_age   Always   FAILING_NOW 34364
  5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   036    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
  9 Power_On_Hours          0x0032   080   080   000    Old_age   Always       -       18263
 12 Power_Cycle_Count       0x0032   100   100   020    Old_age   Always       -       2297
171 Unknown_Attribute       0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
172 Unknown_Attribute       0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
181 Program_Fail_Cnt_Total  0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
182 Erase_Fail_Count_Total  0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   028   000   000    Old_age   Always       -       28 (Min/Max 12/58)
201 Unknown_SSD_Attribute   0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
204 Soft_ECC_Correction     0x0032   100   097   000    Old_age   Always       -       4
231 Temperature_Celsius     0x0013   076   076   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       25
234 Unknown_Attribute       0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       335215
241 Total_LBAs_Written      0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       6847
242 Total_LBAs_Read         0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       1542
250 Read_Error_Retry_Rate   0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       66371

SMART Error Log not supported

SMART Self-test Log not supported

Selective Self-tests/Logging not supported
I ran a long self test on it but it looks like the firmware does not log the result. Perhaps I should have booted Windows, installed Seatools and tested with that. Maybe I can test the drive in a USB enclosure.

Not wishing to interrupt SWMBO's ability to read email, check her running stats or browse Facebook, Pinterest, Instagram etc. I performed an image copy to a slightly larger Crucial MX100. I was happy to see that both Windows and Linux booted w/out any issues. I suppose I should check to see if Win10 authenticated.

And incidentally, I'm still happy with Acer laptops. 3 screws to get to the drive and RAM. 4 screws on the drive caddy (mostly rubber bumpers.) And I discovered it has a USB C port in addition to 2x USB 3.0 and 1X USB 2.0 ports. That came in handy when I wanted to plug in a USB drive with some notes on it and the other ports were filled with Linux Boot USB, replacement SSD and mouse. I suppose I could have lived w/out the mouse for a few minutes, but I didn't have to! And the hinges or housing around them have not broken unlike the recent Lenovos that I have owned.

The 'another one' refers to the second (IIRC) SSD I bought, a Crucial M4, which has also given up the ghost. It is recognized when connected but reports lots of errors. As far as the Seagate goes, I'm not convinced it is going bad. There seems to be sufficient 'slop' in the definition of SMART stats and it would not surprise me if Seagate had got this one wrong (or if smartmontools had the interpretation wrong.) I suppose I should deploy it in a non-critical application and watch to see what it does.
 

don256us

Uber Folding Senior
Joined
Jul 17, 2003
Dang. I have yet to lose an SSD. I run 'em 24/7 too.
 
Last edited:
OP
HankB

HankB

Member
Joined
Jan 27, 2011
Location
Beautiful Sunny Winfield
I wonder what the write count was on these drive that failed.
For the Seagate drive it's right there in the SMART data
Code:
241 Total_LBAs_Written      0x0032   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       6847
Doesn't seem like a lot.
SMART fore the M4 is
Code:
SMART Attributes Data Structure revision number: 16
Vendor Specific SMART Attributes with Thresholds:
ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME          FLAG     VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE      UPDATED  WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE
  1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate     0x002f   100   100   050    Pre-fail  Always       -       13
  5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   100   100   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       8192
  9 Power_On_Hours          0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       27352
 12 Power_Cycle_Count       0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       1382
170 Grown_Failing_Block_Ct  0x0033   100   100   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       2
171 Program_Fail_Count      0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0
172 Erase_Fail_Count        0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0
173 Wear_Leveling_Count     0x0033   098   098   010    Pre-fail  Always       -       63
174 Unexpect_Power_Loss_Ct  0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       79
181 Non4k_Aligned_Access    0x0022   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       13 0 13
183 SATA_Iface_Downshift    0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0
184 End-to-End_Error        0x0033   100   100   050    Pre-fail  Always       -       0
187 Reported_Uncorrect      0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       89
188 Command_Timeout         0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0
189 Factory_Bad_Block_Ct    0x000e   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       131
194 Temperature_Celsius     0x0022   100   100   000    Old_age   Always       -       0
195 Hardware_ECC_Recovered  0x003a   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       12898
196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       2
197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0
198 Offline_Uncorrectable   0x0030   100   100   001    Old_age   Offline      -       0
199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count    0x0032   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       38
202 Perc_Rated_Life_Used    0x0018   098   098   001    Old_age   Offline      -       2
206 Write_Error_Rate        0x000e   100   100   001    Old_age   Always       -       0

SMART Error Log Version: 1
Warning: ATA error count 0 inconsistent with error log pointer 3

I'd draw attention to
Code:
202 Perc_Rated_Life_Used    0x0018   098   098   001    Old_age   Offline      -       2
2% used. :(

Self test log
Code:
SMART Self-test log structure revision number 1
Num  Test_Description    Status                  Remaining  LifeTime(hours)  LBA_of_first_error
# 1  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     27352         24594064
# 2  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26893         -
# 3  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26881         -
# 4  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26868         -
# 5  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26856         -
# 6  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26844         -
# 7  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26831         -
# 8  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26819         -
# 9  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26807         -
#10  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     26794         24594064
#11  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     26794         24594064
#12  Vendor (0xff)       Completed without error       00%     26787         -
#13  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     26774         24594064
#14  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     26773         24594064
#15  Short offline       Completed: read failure       30%     26772         24594064
#16  Extended offline    Completed: read failure       90%     26772         24594064
#17  Short offline       Completed: read failure       30%     26771         24594064
Pretty clear that there's an issue at LBA 24594064. I thought it should remap that sector but it doesn't. I checked for updated firmware but there isn't and of course it is out of warranty.


Back to the Seagate drive, I booted Win10 after transferring to the new drive to make sure it was working. (It was.) I installed Seatools and ran all of the tests. I'm underwhelmed with the results.
Code:
-------------- SeaTools for Windows v1.4.0.6 ---------------
9/20/2018 7:00:26 PM
Model Number: 2105
Serial Number: <obfuscated>
Firmware Revision: 0
SMART - Started 9/20/2018 7:00:26 PM
SMART - Pass 9/20/2018 7:00:31 PM
Short DST - Started 9/20/2018 7:01:08 PM
Short DST - Pass 9/20/2018 7:01:17 PM
Short Generic - Started 9/20/2018 7:01:52 PM
Short Generic - Pass 9/20/2018 7:02:45 PM
Long Generic - Started 9/20/2018 7:03:11 PM
Long Generic - Pass 9/20/2018 7:19:56 PM

It passes all tests, but I'm sure that Seatools are designed to avoid a warranty claim if at all possible. (
)

You can add "OCZ" SSDs to that statement. Are you using a swap partition? There's a lot of chatter about that, but I haven't read anything authoritative on the subject.
Yes. And there is old advice not to put swap on SSD that dates from the time when it was possible to wear out an SSD. I've monitored mine and they're all in the realm of <5% life used after years of use.
 

mirzavanyaa

New Member
Joined
Nov 7, 2018
I was wondering if the SSD provisioning from the factory is good enough to prevent slowdowns in write speed if the drive is full? I have a 500GB 850 EVO.
 

Woomack

Benching Team Leader
Joined
Jan 2, 2005
I haven't seen SMART errors on any SSD yet. All were or 100% fine or were dead. On my list of RMA is mostly Intel, Corsair, PQI and Crucial. Crucial probably because most my SSD were Crucial and I had at least one drive from each series. Intel for me has so far about 70% fail rate. Only from Optane series 3 out of 4 went to RMA in half year since purchase. Corsair and PQI 100%, every single SSD from them stopped working in 1-3 years. Not a single RMA on Samsung and Patriot so far. At work I had 2 RMA on Patriot and Sandisk in this year but looking at amount of drives it's still low % overall.
 

trents

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
HankB, I can't get my wife to reboot regularly either. And she's even got it on her google calendar so that it reminds her by email to do that once a week. She's always got 56 things open at once and several projects in the works unfinished so she doesn't like to have to close all those things down. One of these days . . .
 

petteyg359

Likes Popcorn
Joined
Jul 31, 2004
Assuming an "LBA" is a 512-byte sector, I have a thousand times more writes than your failed drives on every one of mine, and only 4 times the NAND (some 960GB-1TB drives; M500, M550, MX200). Think you may just have bad luck with drives :p Got a stack of the supposedly horrid Seagate 750GB spinning rust that were supposed to be ridiculously fail-y with firmware bugs years ago that are still working fine, too.
 

Woomack

Benching Team Leader
Joined
Jan 2, 2005
Most my drives have higher power-on counter than GB written :) ... Samsung 840 Pro 128GB after 5 years has still 100% life. Still, my experience with SSD is that they or work 100% fine or are not even visible.
Most SSD issues are rather bad luck or just problem with firmware.