Help with CORSAIR VENGEANCE LPX 16GB DDR4 4600MHz C19

[Xdrqgol]

Hi guys,

I have browsed the forum for the past days but could not find a review of the model mentioned in the title...if it was reviewed, it would be awesome if I can get a link to it *thanks in advance*

If not, well the following is my 'problem':

I run i9 9900k
Asus Strix Z390-I Gaming
Corsair 16GB (2x8GB) VENGEANCE LPX 16GB DDR4 4600MHz C19

Checked the motherboard memory support list and the RAM is there. Loaded XMP1 or XMP2, it doesn't boot at 4600mhz. I can only make the system boot if I change from 4600mhz to 4500mhz.

I was wondering if anyone had these around here and what were the results of tweaking them? I am looking at better timings, as currently I am running [ 19-26-46 ]


Also new around here so , any advice would be appreciated.

P.S. I tried some manual tweaking but so far, it is a tedious job with this RAM modules...

 

[EarthDog]

Damn... why did you get that RAM in the first place? It really yields no gains and only helps to suck the money out of the wallet.

Anyhoo, What is it setting for System Agent voltage at 45/4600? DRAM voltage?

Much over 4000 and you are relying on a good board and a good IMC on the CPU to run those speeds. Your CPU just might not be up to it without some major changes.

If I was in your shoes, I would return that kit and get something more appropriate for daily use (4000 or less).

 

[Xdrqgol]

Thanks for the quick reply, didn't expect it.

Short story, the RAM I got was a gift so I cannot return to the store or anything...

My CPU can do 5.1Ghz 24h in Prime95 / 1.3v NO AVX. - pretty good I would say.
- Delided and Direct Die - around 60C max.


I keep VSSO and VCCIO at 1.225v
DRAM voltage is at 1.5v for 4600mhz - once you load the XMP profile this is what it goes for.

I would love to make these daily drivers

 

[EarthDog]

You can sell them.

I'd imagine without AVX, that seems about right. A solid chip. Great temps on that scary direct die situation! Sweet!!!!! (though its clocks have nothing to do with your memory IMC and how good it is).

I'm imagining both SA and IO are low for those memory clocks. Try raising SA voltage to 1.3V or so and see if that helps. You'll likey have to do something with the IO as well. I'd also bump the DRAM voltage up a smidge too so its a hair over 1.5V (just in case).

 

[Xdrqgol]

Just tried the following:

4600mhz
1.3v IO
1.3v SA
1.55V Dram

Once the memory test , restarted the computer for like 3 times, it told me - MEMORY OK!

, pressed F10 in Bios and went to boot - got a black screen and multiple restarts, telling me the system has POSTed in safe mode )) what a joke. probably my motherboard is not that good ...

BTW, do you think these RAM kits are bad? they should be SAMSUNG b-die , pretty good from what I read on the internetz

 

[EarthDog]

It could be the mobo.. it could be the IMC... likely the latter. I recall the smaller boards, especially the ASRock Z390 ITX board, did better with faster memory (due to shorter traces?) so it may not be the motherboard.

That said, I'm not a memory expert. I'm sure people with more experience than I will chime in and help.

Sure you can't sell them or something?

 

[Xdrqgol]

haha !!!
Let's see what we can do, and if there is no other way I will eventually sell them ..

It runs now @ 4500mhz / 1.225 SO/1.225 IO / DRAM 1.4v

will run some tests, but if it works at 4500mhz I just think the motherboard is pure "crap" --- I should have known better , should have gone for Asrock!

 

[EarthDog]

That multi just might be testy.. try lowering the CPU multiplier and raising BCLK to get there.

Leave the DRAM viltage at 1.5V though. I wouldn't worry about running below its specs for that until the end. Too many things changing

 

[Xdrqgol]

I have tried to run everything default, like Load Optimized default and just do a manual change on DRAM and / or load XMP2

still without success...


also in regards tot his "try lowering the CPU multiplier and raising BCLK to get there."

I have overclocked the CPU, but I am not soo experienced which mean , I would need a bit of more guidance to " Raising BCLK"

lowering the multiplier , to which value? like 50? (currently I am at 51)
raising the BCLK - currently 100 - , to what value?

On the latter*BCLK*, I am really not experienced, thus, would need some help on understanding how it works.
thanks for all the help!

 

[Xdrqgol]

Tried with BCLK, nothing , doesn't want to run past 4500mhz.

I think, I will have to get rid of them and just get some 4000mhz.

For memory, what would you recommend? G-skill?

 

[Woomack]

... especially the ASRock Z390 ITX board, did better with faster memory (due to shorter traces?) so it may not be the motherboard.

It runs now @ 4500mhz / 1.225 SO/1.225 IO / DRAM 1.4v

will run some tests, but if it works at 4500mhz I just think the motherboard is pure "crap" --- I should have known better , should have gone for Asrock!

ASRock Z390 ITX/PG has a hard wall at 4500 or simply hated all my memory kits (and I tested maybe 7 of which all could at least boot at 4700 on other board). All of them were working fine at 4500 but no boot at even 4533.
ASUS Z390I Strix should run higher than 4600 but again, most motherboards can't boot above 4500 for some reason. MSI needed BIOS improvements to pass this clock. I'm personally using ASUS MXIG as it works up to 4800+ out of the box.
Going back to your board. It should run at 4600 with Corsair memory but on the QVL there is 19-26-26 and 1.40V or 1.50V. If you can make it run stable at 4500 then just work on the timings. Tighter timings will give you more than a bit higher clock. You can also check if you have option trace centering or something similar in BIOS. I have it in Maximus but I don't know if BIOS for Strix has it. It helps to improve signals.
Another thing is the IMC. My 9900K hated anything above 4500 on ambient temps to the point that I had to set 1.45V SA or cool it down below 20°C to keep it stable (dry ice and other things for benching). All my CPUs were running between 4400 and 4800 on ambient temps while the worst were 9700K/9900K ... maybe my luck.

If you can make this memory run at 4500 19-19-19 1.40V stable then switching to something else won't help you (or not much). You could however save a lot of money buying 4000 CL18/19 or 3600 CL16 kit and overclock it to 4400-4500. Now I guess it's too late for that.

Typical VCCSA for 4500-4600 is 1.35V, typical VCCIO is 1.30V. Max which motherboards are auto-adjusting is about 1.4V and I would stick to that for 24/7 work.

From easy to OC memory kits in good price are HyperX Predator and Predator RGB 4000 CL19. You can of course get some Trident Z / RGB / Royals if you like G.Skill. On the other hand, I'm not sure if selling your current kit and buying a new one will give a high enough price difference to be worth the time spent on the sale. I don't know how much does it cost in store and on the 2nd hand market.

 

[Xdrqgol]

thanks a lot for the reply.

Yeah, I have already worked on timings and even lowered from 4500mhz to 4400mhz : 19-19-39 that was the lowest I could go and stable , at 1.5v.


I will stick with them, and see how the AMD 3950x looks in september and maybe I will switch to the new CPU, hopefully , I will then be able to use them at full 4600mhz or more
Also no "Trace Centering" in my bios...

cheers again!

 

[Xdrqgol]

ASRock Z390 ITX/PG has a hard wall at 4500 or simply hated all my memory kits (and I tested maybe 7 of which all could at least boot at 4700 on other board). All of them were working fine at 4500 but no boot at even 4533.
ASUS Z390I Strix should run higher than 4600 but again, most motherboards can't boot above 4500 for some reason. MSI needed BIOS improvements to pass this clock. I'm personally using ASUS MXIG as it works up to 4800+ out of the box.
Going back to your board. It should run at 4600 with Corsair memory but on the QVL there is 19-26-26 and 1.40V or 1.50V. If you can make it run stable at 4500 then just work on the timings. Tighter timings will give you more than a bit higher clock. You can also check if you have option trace centering or something similar in BIOS. I have it in Maximus but I don't know if BIOS for Strix has it. It helps to improve signals.
Another thing is the IMC. My 9900K hated anything above 4500 on ambient temps to the point that I had to set 1.45V SA or cool it down below 20°C to keep it stable (dry ice and other things for benching). All my CPUs were running between 4400 and 4800 on ambient temps while the worst were 9700K/9900K ... maybe my luck.

If you can make this memory run at 4500 19-19-19 1.40V stable then switching to something else won't help you (or not much). You could however save a lot of money buying 4000 CL18/19 or 3600 CL16 kit and overclock it to 4400-4500. Now I guess it's too late for that.

Typical VCCSA for 4500-4600 is 1.35V, typical VCCIO is 1.30V. Max which motherboards are auto-adjusting is about 1.4V and I would stick to that for 24/7 work.

From easy to OC memory kits in good price are HyperX Predator and Predator RGB 4000 CL19. You can of course get some Trident Z / RGB / Royals if you like G.Skill. On the other hand, I'm not sure if selling your current kit and buying a new one will give a high enough price difference to be worth the time spent on the sale. I don't know how much does it cost in store and on the 2nd hand market.

I am running it now at 4000mhz @ 15-18-35 - is this better than 4500mhz @19-26-46? Have to understand this timings better and what to aim for ....
Any information to spread some light is really appreciated!

Cheers!

 

[Woomack]

Check and compare windows memory benchmark ( 'winsat mem' command from command prompt ) or AIDA64 memory bandwidth - mostly read and copy while the latest release suggests that copy is showing actual performance out of synthetic benchmarks. This should show which setting is better.
If you can make it run at 4000 CL15 then I guess it will run at 15-15-15 at the same or not much higher voltage. Most kits won't run below CL17 at 1.35-1.40V.

You may try Command Rate 1N but I guess it will need 2N. It highly depends on the motherboard. For example I have to set additional settings for trace signal only to make it boot on my board at 4000 CR 1N while some other guys on the same model run up to 4133+.

 

[Xdrqgol]

so far I got 150 (*increase) points in Cinebench R20 using 4000mhz and 15-18-18-31 compared to the 44000mhz one.

the thing is, I cannot decrease the :18-18: part at all, like...no chance. Anything below that would malfunction and give errors in memtest...

 

[Woomack]

Typical is something like 4000 19-19-19 at 1.35V. Some kits can make 18-18-18. Higher voltage will let you to lower the timings but if it's for 24/7 usage then I would check if something like 15-18-18, 16-18-18, 17-18-18 or 18-18-18 will work at 4133-4266 at 1.35-1.40V. Really it won't change much as anything above 4000 is already fast for memory.

Cinebench R20 is not really repeatable. You can have one additional service in the background and it may cause +/- 500 points. R11.5/R15 were better but again, these benchmarks are not showing memory performance. Winsat command is easy to run and it shows how OS performs on given memory settings. Some other benchmarks are good too like Geekbench but you have to know which results are important for daily work and which are only good for competitive benchmarking.
If you compare memory performance in games then 3DMark is reacting good on various memory settings but most can be seen in physics tests.

 

[Xdrqgol]

EDIT: just saw your comment , probably while I was posting this. Yeah I will tweak it a bit more and see if I can get it to run a bit faster and up the CL a bit as well as you mentioned. THANKS A LOT FOR THE REPLY!!

Actually this is the maximum I could go @ 4000mhz:

CL15 - tRCD18 - tRP18 - tRAS28 - tRFC350 - CR2T

Update:

AIDA64 results:

4000MHZ @ CL15 - tRCD18 - tRP18 - tRAS28 - tRFC350 - CR2T

Latency:42.7ns
Read:57213MB/s
Write:58167MB/s
Copy:52626MB/s

4400MHZ @CL19 - tRCD26 - tRP26 - tRAS46 - tRFC600 - CR2T

Latency:44.9ns
Read:58113MB/s
Write:62014MB/s
Copy:52228MB/s


if I am sticking to the latency, I would go with CL15 XXXXX

what would you think?

 

[Xdrqgol]

Wow, thanks again for the tips.

I got it working at 4266MHZ with the following:

CL16 - tRCD18 - tRP18 - tRAS28 - tRFC350 - CR2T
41.2 ns Latency and everything else seems much better score than previous ones.

I will probably stick with this, leaving it overnight in memtest and see if there are any errors but I doubt!


I can say that I am pretty happy with these RAM modules, pretty sure that on X570 motherboards I can push them to 4900mhz - 5000mhz, cannot wait for september to pick my AMD 3950x !!!

Many thanks again!

 

[EarthDog]

Awesome man! Glad it is working!

That said, I would be absolutely floored if the Memory on the new Zen2 CPUs could reach nearly 5K... They (Zen/Zen+) struggles now in the mid 3's+. I would imagine 4K is in the cards though.

 

[Xdrqgol]

Cheers my man!

Well, from what I read and saw so far the memory on Zen2 starts at 3600mhz..there was something on reddit about it. Also someone overclocked it on X570 and said that there is a lot of headroom on those boards.
Will have to wait the release and see some benchmarks, get our hands on some boards! it will be fire if they can though..

Maybe you know more , I have absolute no access to them (yet) , it is just what I read from some trustworthy sources.

Although, 3950x , cannot do 5GHZ on air. so that is that, no expectations whatsoever ....that is a closed subject it seems.