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Long Term Storage (rarely accessed) HDD vs. SSD or? And which models?

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Thanks for that. But if the failure rate is higher, that seems not a good idea. I thought the whole purpose of the article was to help us understand which drives have a lower failure rate over time?

What I had considered to do is buy two different brands of external drives. I think I need 2x 4TB drives. One Seagate as you recommend here, and then another WD passport or mybook, I think both are HDD not SSD. I prefer HDD. At least with two different brands I separate some risk. It will probably cost me around 300 or so for the two of them.

Failure rate was more than double but still less than 1% so IMO not a big deal given the price difference between the drives. But agree on just getting two externals and being done with it. :)
 
Does anyone know which of the color drive WD usually puts in their external drives? Or is it a completely different drive altogether?
 
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:eek: joined 2097 and still not decennial member?? That's already 11 years membership! He needs a badge!(I do too)
 
:eek: joined 2097 and still not decennial member?? That's already 11 years membership! He needs a badge!(I do too)

2097 eh? Are we going forward into the future my man? hahahahahahahahahahhaahahhaa I know that was a typo, but I couldn't resist giving you hell. :) I honestly didn't even know there were badges for that. I have been here a long long time yes. But I am trying to figure out how many more posts I need to get that 7th orange star! I must be close!
 
Dear Sir, I checked and your photos are still safe and there was no earthquake yet::D
 
I'd definitely go with an HDD and size a little larger than your present needs so that in a couple years you'll need to scale to a larger drive. My reasoning is that if there is a concern that data cannot be read after 5 years, force it to all be read in 3 when you copy to a new drive. As for off site backup, do you have a friend somewhere who could host a box for remote backups? My son hosts a remote server to meet my remote needs. All was good until I upgraded to a retired rack mount Dell that sounds like a jet spooling up for takeoff. I forgot to check the BIOS defaults and it was set for maximum cooling and operating two Xeons at full speed. I enabled downclocking and went with a less aggressive cooling setting and he no longer points out that it is the single loudest piece of equipment in their house. ;) But I digress. If you're Linux savvy you could configure something yourself. If not you could go with one of the personal cloud server packages line owncloud/nextcloud or perhaps FreeNAS. If you like to spend $$$ you can buy some kind of NAS box, but I prefer something I can control and configure. You can use encryption in flight (ssh, tls) and at rest (truecrypt or similar) to protect sensitive data. (Along with sensible security settings on both ends.)
 
I'd definitely go with an HDD and size a little larger than your present needs so that in a couple years you'll need to scale to a larger drive. My reasoning is that if there is a concern that data cannot be read after 5 years, force it to all be read in 3 when you copy to a new drive. As for off site backup, do you have a friend somewhere who could host a box for remote backups? My son hosts a remote server to meet my remote needs. All was good until I upgraded to a retired rack mount Dell that sounds like a jet spooling up for takeoff. I forgot to check the BIOS defaults and it was set for maximum cooling and operating two Xeons at full speed. I enabled downclocking and went with a less aggressive cooling setting and he no longer points out that it is the single loudest piece of equipment in their house. ;) But I digress. If you're Linux savvy you could configure something yourself. If not you could go with one of the personal cloud server packages line owncloud/nextcloud or perhaps FreeNAS. If you like to spend $$$ you can buy some kind of NAS box, but I prefer something I can control and configure. You can use encryption in flight (ssh, tls) and at rest (truecrypt or similar) to protect sensitive data. (Along with sensible security settings on both ends.)

And all of that pretty much went right over my head. I am not familiar with Linux. I wouldn't even dare to start trying to learn that. And the cloud server packages you mention, I am really not familiar with any of that. Or do you mean that owncloud next cloud and freenas are are online cloud services? Like backblaze? What are the advantages of these over backblaze? Stable? Trustworthy? If they can do encryption in flight than that is fine. Then I don't need to deal with it.

Ok, so I just bought one WD 4TB passbook, or mybook, whatever you wanna call it.

And one Seagate 4TB backup plus hub.

Two questions..

1. Do I need to partion it? If so, how many TB per partition?

2. How many data should I try to move at any one time? Like 500gb per time?
 
1/2. All your choice.

You do not need to partition it, but can if you like. The size is up to you.

As far as what/how to move, also your choice. I'd just move it all and if it doesn't work for whatever reason, move in smaller chunks (though you shouldn't need to).
 
FWIW amazon prime account holders get UNLIMITED online photo storage.
 
I purchased an external WD HDD for the same reasons and dropped it on the floor the day after I backed up (triple redundancy) all my data. The drive never booted again. Since then I've purchased SSDs for storage (no moving parts) and haven't looked back. Although kinda pricey compared to spinners, the pricing is becoming more attractive with each passing day. I've recently seen larger SSDs for 16¢/GB.
 
1/2. All your choice.

You do not need to partition it, but can if you like. The size is up to you.

As far as what/how to move, also your choice. I'd just move it all and if it doesn't work for whatever reason, move in smaller chunks (though you shouldn't need to).

Got it, thanks.

FWIW amazon prime account holders get UNLIMITED online photo storage.

I don't use prime, I am not in the US. And I don't trust Google, Amazon or Microsoft with my data. But thanks for the information. Might be useful one day.

I purchased an external WD HDD for the same reasons and dropped it on the floor the day after I backed up (triple redundancy) all my data. The drive never booted again. Since then I've purchased SSDs for storage (no moving parts) and haven't looked back. Although kinda pricey compared to spinners, the pricing is becoming more attractive with each passing day. I've recently seen larger SSDs for 16¢/GB.

Did you drop it while it was running???? They should have replaced it for you under warranty, those external drives are supposed to have protective measures to prevent that from happening! That sucks. SSDs just die without warning though, and at least HDDs are still made in SE Asia while most of the SSDs are made in China.

I remember 20 years ago I had a Maxtor drive. It had issues about 2 months after I bought it, weird sounds and what not. I remember after deleting everything before I shipped it back, I tossed that thing around my apartment for like 30 minutes bouncing it off the floor, throwing it, etc. I had carpeting also, so I was shocking it, with static continually also, directly onto the circuit boards. I was young... Figured what the hell, so long as I do not cause cosmetic damage to the drive, they will never know what I did to it anyway. So I tried to hurt it more and make it crash or mess up the board. So after 30 minutes or so of doing this, I plugged it in after all that and it still worked. I was shocked. In addition, one day I got really mad at something or someone while I was on the phone or just after a call and punched the side of my PC case while my PC was on, I have 4 drives inside, ALL WD, everything survived except the case is dented, but I learned never to do that again as I realized afterwards that I could have crashed every drive I had in there. Which WD external did you have?
 
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And all of that pretty much went right over my head.
Sorry

I am not familiar with Linux. I wouldn't even dare to start trying to learn that.
No worries - no need.

Or do you mean that owncloud next cloud and freenas are online cloud services? Like backblaze?
Not exactly. They're packages That you run on your own hrdwqare and provide functionality similar to the cloud providers. If you prefer to buy once vs. pay monthly and retain full ownership of your data, these would be something to look at. They are generally configurable via a web interface (web server on the device itself, not in the cloud) so you don't need to know the underlying technology. I'm not suggesting these for local storage, though many use them for that. It would be a useful solution to host at a friends house.

Ok, so I just bought one WD 4TB passbook, or mybook, whatever you wanna call it.

And one Seagate 4TB backup plus hub.
Those are good for local backups. I have local and remote file servers for automated backups. I also have a Seagate External HDD that I use for ad-hoc backups.

Try not to drop them. ;)
 
Ok, so I just bought one WD 4TB passbook, or mybook, whatever you wanna call it.

And one Seagate 4TB backup plus hub.

Do I need to partion it? If so, how many TB per partition?

Good choices. I just use one NTFS partition, works fine with Linux or in case there's a Windows machine I would need to share with.
 
Sorry


No worries - no need.


Not exactly. They're packages That you run on your own hrdwqare and provide functionality similar to the cloud providers. If you prefer to buy once vs. pay monthly and retain full ownership of your data, these would be something to look at. They are generally configurable via a web interface (web server on the device itself, not in the cloud) so you don't need to know the underlying technology. I'm not suggesting these for local storage, though many use them for that. It would be a useful solution to host at a friends house.


Those are good for local backups. I have local and remote file servers for automated backups. I also have a Seagate External HDD that I use for ad-hoc backups.

Try not to drop them. ;)


Ohhh, but that would mean that the hardware is on site, not off site. It is a personal cloud, is that right? That doesn't really solve the problem, because if my house catches fire or an earthquake takes down the building, I still lose everything. It is a great idea, but... Or am I not thinking right about this... Is that that I am buying the hardware and it is housed somewhere else? I am interested to know more, perhaps I should F******* google it eh. ha.:D

As for dropping them... Ok.. Please enlighten me here... If these external drives are so dang delicate to use, what the heck is the difference then that I just don't go buy a raw internal HDD, use the VANTEC HDD external unit I have already, plug that HDD in backup my files, take that disk out, put it in a plastic box that I already have and store the HDD raw drive somewhere on a shelf? I don't get the point of owning an external drive if they are so bloody fragile. My internal HDDs in the Vantec device can use E-SATA also which is much faster than 3.0 USB! I am really interested in knowing opinions here because to me the externals sound useless now. I can drop an internal and it will still work. Drop an external and it dies, WTF gives? Enlighten me please. Aren't externals supposed to be more hardy? :-/

Vantec makes an external unit to plug in internal HDDs, it is like an external but can do multiple drives, can even be set up to do RAIDS, but I am not interested in that as I want to store the drives used for backups away from the computer and not plugged in. I only use the Vantec for downloading stuff and extra storage, but it acts just like an external drive, anyway.. enlighten me please.:cool:


Good choices. I just use one NTFS partition, works fine with Linux or in case there's a Windows machine I would need to share with.

It was already formatted, no idea what they used. It had some files already on the drive also. At least the Seagate did, have not opened the WD, am considering to return it actually based on what you guys comment on my above questions about externals vs internals...
 
Ohhh, but that would mean that the hardware is on site, not off site. It is a personal cloud, is that right? That doesn't really solve the problem, because if my house catches fire or an earthquake takes down the building, I still lose everything. It is a great idea, but... Or am I not thinking right about this... Is that that I am buying the hardware and it is housed somewhere else?
Yes. USB connected drives are fine for local use. You need some intelligence to use these on a remote LAN. Suggested setup would be
- Put the NAS (Network Attached Storage) at a friend's house,
- Configure their firewall to provide access. I would probably use a VPN.
- With the VPN you can now view the drives 'locally' on your home LAN.

You would also want to encrypt the remote drive unless you really trust your friend and anyone they provide network access to.

As for dropping them... Ok.. Please enlighten me here... [...] ? I don't get the point of owning an external drive if they are so bloody fragile.
That was mostly in reply to PMRobert17's comment.

HDDs are mechanical devices and can suffer damage from drops. I don't consider them excessively susceptible but really the obvious questions are how hard the landing and how far did it drop. IMO not a reason to dismiss usage of external HDDs - just a reason to handle them with some care.
 
Yes. USB connected drives are fine for local use. You need some intelligence to use these on a remote LAN. Suggested setup would be
- Put the NAS (Network Attached Storage) at a friend's house,
- Configure their firewall to provide access. I would probably use a VPN.
- With the VPN you can now view the drives 'locally' on your home LAN.

You would also want to encrypt the remote drive unless you really trust your friend and anyone they provide network access to.


That was mostly in reply to PMRobert17's comment.

HDDs are mechanical devices and can suffer damage from drops. I don't consider them excessively susceptible but really the obvious questions are how hard the landing and how far did it drop. IMO not a reason to dismiss usage of external HDDs - just a reason to handle them with some care.

Ahhh, ok, yeah, I won't be setting that sort of thing up at anyone's house, but I will keep it in mind. I think I may end up going with Backblazes B2 service, as it seems only about $10 a month for an off site solution.

As for externals... but... still.. what is the difference between buying an external or buying an internal, using the external vantec copy device I have and then storing the raw HDD in a plastic case somewhere? It is smaller, takes up less space, no additional cables and wires and can use E-sata... Is there really ANY advantage in my case to using an external rather than the internal raw drive?
 
External drives will be a little more expensive because of nice outside enclosure.
Also xternal drives are typically a little slower.
 
External drives will be a little more expensive because of nice outside enclosure.
Also xternal drives are typically a little slower.

So basically I just wasted more money and bought something that will take up more space! And also wait more time for data to upload... :bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head:bang head There was no reason to buy external drives to begin with, my original plan to just buy a raw drive would have been cheaper, less space consuming and better to store and FASTER!!!
 
Well no, you haven't wasted anything. You still got plenty of storage:) it's not the destination, it's the drive there. Desperate times call for desperate measures.
 
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