mini-ITX build - need help completing build specs

[beyondinfinity]

Hello,

I decided to upgrade my PC (currently an ATX system with intel 2600K and asus p8z77 mobo with 12GB ram)
I'm going to do a mini-itx build because of space considerations.
It took me forever but I finally found a case that I like and also decided on a CPU. So far I have

Case: Phanteks Evolv Shift Air
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600
CPU Fan: Is the fan that comes with AMD quiet?
Motherboard: ?? (B450) Gigabyte's B450i Aorus Pro WiFi OR (x470) ASUS ROG Strix X470-I
RAM: 16GB of ??
SSD: I have one system drive 256GB Intel SSD (at SATA III) and one data drive 1TB Seagate Firecuda 2.5" which I will keep both in the new system
Video Card: I don't game, I do photo edit, and I want to experiment with machine learning - so was thinking of getting an RTX 2060, or at minimum a 1660 Ti

Basically I don't want to spend too much on anything. so what's the most decent parts I can get to complete this system at a reasonable price that's not crazy. In particular my questions are

1 - what kind or brand of mini-itx motherboards should I look at for the CPU I selected? (was looking at B450 or X470)
2 - what Kind of Ram should I be looking at?
3 - SSD - my system drive is almost full and I need to get a new SSD, should I get one of those new M.2 or NVME form factor drives or stick with a 2.5"?
4 - Video Card - I'll decide this later, but if you have any suggestions for quiet cards particularly ones where the fans stop when there's no load
5 - Power supply - Looking for quiet and good quality small form factor

Thanks

 

[dejo]

the gigabyte x570 I aurus gets good reviews but is a bit pricey (all x570 itx boards seem to be)
on ssd's, I would just get something big enough that you dont fill it to capacity. They dont like being full and its hard on their write cycle life.
NVME drives are faster when benching the storage aspect of them, but seat of the pants feel is pretty similar between them all.
the stock cooler with the 3700x that I have will get a bit audible, but its not crazy loud or anything, and it cools reasonably well. I did swap in a 360 AIO water system

 

[Woomack]

My experience:
- Evolv Shift (non-air version) had big problems with airflow and possible cooling solutions, graphics cards at ~170W were overheating. I would read some more about the air version before you decide what graphics card to use there. I find ~130W so GTX1660Ti max for smaller ITX cases so the graphics card won't be loud.
- AMD stock coolers are not letting CPU to boost high and depends on the airflow, it causes the CPU to throttle under full load and run at the much lower clock. The fan itself isn't really loud but also isn't quiet.
- I can't recommend any X470 motherboard as I wasn't testing them with Ryzen 3000 but there are various issues on some of them. As dejo said, Gigabyte X570 ITX is a great motherboard and I was testing it for a while with various components. It's not cheap but I was satisfied.
- RAM depends on your needs. 16GB is about the minimum for new PC nowadays. If you edit photos and use larger files then you may pass that and 32GB is now not so expensive. Remember that with ITX you are limited to 2 memory slots so if you get 2x8GB then upgrade will require replacing the whole RAM. Also, if you decide on a single memory module now then it's not guaranteed you will find another one, the same, later and it may end on replacing the whole RAM. For Ryzen good are Hynix based kits, something like 2x16GB 3600 16-19-19. Samsung based seems a bit better but out of competitive benchmarking there is no significant difference. DDR4-3600 is optimal for Ryzen 3000, everything else is less important as it brings +/- 1% difference in performance.
- Most new ITX motherboards have 1 or 2 NVMe sockets. Mentioned Gigabyte X570 ITX has two and works fine with two drives. I recommend NVMe only because the price is not so much higher and it saves space as you can install it directly on the motherboard. You can keep additional SATA/2.5" SSD as storage drives and if you decide on the Evolv Shift then I think there are 2 spots for 2.5" drives.
- Corsair SFX PSU are great. All SF series are 80+ Gold or Platinum so about the best you can find. I was running a setup with 200W CPU+200W GPU and some additional stuff on the 450W unit without problems. I'm recommending at least 600W unit and then the PSU won't even spin the fan during work.

If the case is not a must then check some other options like NZXT H200/210 where you can install larger and quiet cooler and larger/better graphics card which will have better airflow without problems. I know it's a "standard" style case but can save a lot of problems. On the other hand, for work with 2D graphics you don't need any strong graphics card and something like GTX1660/Ti will be more than enough.

 

[trents]

As Woomack suggested, you may want to look at a smaller mid tower case to maximize air flow and space utilization of your work area. Mini itx boards will not only work in mini ITX cases but wil work in mid and even full tower cases. As you can see from my Sig, I am running a mini itx setup and I wish I had opted for a mid tower case instead of an itx case. Unfortunately, at this point in time there are very few options for smaller motherboards anyway with the new Ryzen CPU family. Just a couple or thee mini itx boards and one mATX with the X570 chipset and I would be careful moving down to the 4xx previous generation chipset as not all those boards support the Ryzen 3xxx very well.

 

[Blaylock]

Another great mITX option to consider if you're concerned about airflow should be the Phanteks Evolv ITX.

 

[beyondinfinity]

Another great mITX option to consider if you're concerned about airflow should be the Phanteks Evolv ITX.

True, but I needed to slim it down, that one is too wide (9") Evolv Shift Air is 6.7" wide and fits exactly where I want it. I research so many cases and the ones I really wanted are either too expensive or simply not available for purchase. And very few are in that sweet spot of 7" to 5" wide (not too slim and not too fat)

Anyway for power supply, what about one of these?

- Corsair SF Series SF600 600 Watt 80 PLUS Gold Certified High Performance SFX Power Supply (CP-9020105-NA)
- Corsair SF750 80 Plus Platinum Fully Modular SFX Power Supply(CP-9020186-NA)

For motherboard, yeah the X570 are all expensive for mini ITX. Alternatively I could go with an Intel processor equivalent to the Ryzen 5 3600 that I picked out, and maybe have better selection of motherboards? Any thoughts on that?

 

[trents]

True, but I needed to slim it down, that one is too wide (9") Evolv Shift Air is 6.7" wide and fits exactly where I want it. I research so many cases and the ones I really wanted are either too expensive or simply not available for purchase. And very few are in that sweet spot of 7" to 5" wide (not too slim and not too fat)

Anyway for power supply, what about one of these?

- Corsair SF Series SF600 600 Watt 80 PLUS Gold Certified High Performance SFX Power Supply (CP-9020105-NA)
- Corsair SF750 80 Plus Platinum Fully Modular SFX Power Supply(CP-9020186-NA)

For motherboard, yeah the X570 are all expensive for mini ITX. Alternatively I could go with an Intel processor equivalent to the Ryzen 5 3600 that I picked out, and maybe have better selection of motherboards? Any thoughts on that?

If you really want to go mini-ITX you will have more choices with Intel for motherboards.

 

[Blaylock]

Yeah, 5-7" wide is a pretty odd spec. Silverstone has a decent size collection of SFF cases that might fit that. Here's the SG05-Lite at 7" tall.

The FT03-Mini is 7.4" wide might be another option and design-wise is similar to the Evolv shift.

Finally, the GD04, GD05, & GD06 are all 6" tall. These might work as well.

I'm sure some of these will be priced higher than what you would prefer, but gives you other options.

 

[Bill_Bright]

I don't see where you stated the intended, primary purpose of this computer.

I agree with other comments about the case. For an ITX case, it is huge - assuming this is it. At 18.5 inches tall, it is taller than my Fractal Design R4 mid tower. But with width and depth dimensions of 10.8 x 6.7 inches, it does have a fairly small foot print, so maybe that is what you are going for.

With default clocking, I don't believe cooling will be too much of an issue as that case supports up to 3 x 140mm fans or even a 350mm radiator. However, it only comes with 1 x 140mm fan and that, IMO, is probably insufficient to get a good flow of air through the case. And being a slim case, that does restrict your CPU cooler's height to just 82mm. I note that this case is marketed as "Designed for AIO Water Cooling" which would make it less dependent on air flow cooling.

Still, I think I would pick a different case.

CPU Fan: Is the fan that comes with AMD quiet?

That's all relative as it depends on your tolerance for fan noise (I have none), ambient noise (room background noise) and the fan noise of other components (PSU, graphics, case fans). I will say this, OEM coolers are MUCH MORE quiet and efficient than OEM coolers from yesteryear and MUCH better than many want us to believe. If the CPU you select comes with an OEM cooler, I say "try it and see". In a properly cooled case (with default clocks/voltages) the CPU fan should not need to ramp up to full speed (and loudness) very often. You paid for it, see if it works. If not happy, then you can buy an aftermarket cooler.

2 - what Kind of Ram should I be looking at?

You need to decide on your motherboard first - then check the board's QVL (qualified vendors list) on the board's website to see what the board supports. Note there are just too many RAM makers and models for board makers to test them all so generally you don't have to buy listed RAM. But you should buy RAM with the same specs as listed RAM to ensure compatibility. And I recommend you buy all the RAM you think you might want now. And while 8GB is probably enough, I agree with going with 16GB.

4 - Video Card - I'll decide this later, but if you have any suggestions for quiet cards particularly ones where the fans stop when there's no load
5 - Power supply - Looking for quiet and good quality small form factor

The problem here is graphics cards are often the most power hungry components in our systems. So ideally, you should pick your card first, then determine your power requirements and pick an appropriately sized PSU. If you buy your PSU before knowing your final power requirements, you must make sure you buy big enough to cover anything you might eventually settle on. That makes it a guessing game.

And I note you have much fewer options when it comes to SFF PSUs. If you get a mid tower case that supports standard ATX PSUs, you will have tons more options available to you. Careful homework will show there are several µATX and mini-ATX cases that support ATX PSUs too. Note the EVGA Supernova "G3" series of PSUs are still standard ATX PSUs, but are physically smaller than the normal "G2" series. So they mount in the same standard location, but take up less room inside the case.

Note a new computer typically requires a new OS license. So keep that in mind when working the budget.

 

[Zerileous]

It looks like you've already had some great responses! I feel like I should always mention this when people look at the shift: https://modmymods.com/custom-phanteks-evolv-shift-front-panel.html https://modmymods.com/custom-phanteks-evolv-shift-back-panel.html. Of course adding both of these would increase the cost by $150, so you'd have to *really* like the case. But with the mesh side panel even replacing the front should help a lot. They were tested by jayztwocents here, it wasn't as substantial of an improvement as we might have liked, but it does help

If you don't need PCIe gen4, don't be afraid of x470 boards, I believe the strix x740-I was a well reviewed model. However do be aware that you'll need to do some research on compatibility, and also ensure that the board has either been flashed to a BIOS that supports 3000 series processors, or that you have the ability to flash it. Otherwise it may make more sense to go Intel due to board price. The initial GN review of the 3600 summarized:

The i5-9600K outperforms the 3600 in most of our game benchmarks as games have been slow to adapt to CPUs with more than 8 threads, and the 5GHz+ overclocking potential of the 9600K makes it an even clearer winner for exclusively gaming, but the R5 3600 is the more versatile and potentially cheaper option at $200 MSRP.

. Now that Intel has lowered the price of the 9600k, it may be the better option given board selection / price. It is currently on sale for $200.

 

[beyondinfinity]

Ok thanks so much guys. To answer some questions above
Primary purpose of computer - (main)Photo editing +general productivity, (secondary) machine learning
Regarding the case, I'm trying to solve this issue So anything 8" wide or wider is just not going to work for me.
Which is why I'm trying to slim things down.

Based on all the above information I revised my build to the following

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 3600 (based on the tests I've seen on youtube, it out performs the Intel i5 9600K)
Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 I AORUS PRO WIFI
Power Supply: Corsair series SF600 80 Gold
Video Card: RTX 2060 6GB series (but haven't researched which exact one yet - will depend on which case i get)
SSD: Western Digital WD BLACK SN750 NVMe M.2 2280 1TB (gen 4 drives are pretty expensive and I think this one is gen 3, are gen 3 drives compatible with the gen 4 sockets on the latest motherboards?)
RAM: (not sure yet, 16GB, maybe 32GB depending on price difference)

Case: I might just cram everything in my existing ATX case until I find a mini itx case I like (probably never !)
FT03 mini was a good option, but I can't find it for sale anywhere online anymore. But some other contenders now are SIlverstone RVZ03, Fractal Node 202, Metallic Gear Neo Mini V2.

I would buy something like the ncase m1, but I hate that the front USB ports are so close to the bottom.

 

[Blaylock]

This looks to be a great build BeyondInfinity. Here are a few talking points to consider (if you haven't already).

CPU: The Ryzen 5 3600 is a great CPU. If you plan to overclock go with the 3600X, otherwise solid choice.
Motherboard: If you don't intend on utilizing PCIe Gen 4 then dropping to an X470 or even B450 chipset could cut the mobo cost in half and perform the same. (You may need to update the BIOS for the 3xxx series CPU first)
PSU: Outstanding choice!
Video Card: RTX 2060 6GB is good and should be more than enough for your primary usage.
SSD: NVMe prices are finally starting to come down making them a viable option even if the performance/price increase isn't always justifiable. Personally I prefer the Samsung 970 EVO Plus to the WD SN750. It's slightly faster and costs less.
RAM: 16GB should be adequate but keep in mind with an ITX build you don't have the option of adding another 16GB.
Case: I'm not sure where you are located but I was able to find the FT03 on Amazon for $212 (Damn pricey).

Hopefully this sparks more discussion and gets you closer to something you will be satisfied with for years to come.

 

[Bill_Bright]

I'm trying to solve this issue

I think I have seen that picture before - something about getting power over there, IIRC. But yeah, that's a tight fit with that door in the way.

There certainly are slimmer cases but you do have to be careful about cooling as they often restrict the size of case fans and as noted before, the height of the CPU cooler can be a problem too - at least with upright coolers.

until I find a mini itx case I like

As seen here, that Gigabyte board is an ATX Form Factor board. It will not fit in an ITX case.

 

[Blaylock]

Motherboard: Gigabyte X570 I AORUS PRO WIFI

Bill, You missed the "I" after the X570. It is in fact a mITX board.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Oops! Sure did. I actually didn't miss it when I copied and pasted the model number in Google. It was there that I clicked on the wrong one.

Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[trents]

OP would need to look at the cost/benefit of getting another tick or two of overclock from the more expensive 3600X. I would guess the 3600 would overclock to almost the same level.

 

[Blaylock]

OP would need to look at the cost/benefit of getting another tick or two of overclock from the more expensive 3600X. I would guess the 3600 would overclock to almost the same level.

Agreed, and let's be realistic, Ryzen isn't really much of a clocker at any rate. Compound that with a mITX build with questionable airflow. This is looking like a stock build. (Not there's anything wrong with that)

 

[trents]

Agreed, and let's be realistic, Ryzen isn't really much of a clocker at any rate. Compound that with a mITX build with questionable airflow. This is looking like a stock build. (Not there's anything wrong with that)

I tend to agree.

 

[beyondinfinity]

SSD: NVMe prices are finally starting to come down making them a viable option even if the performance/price increase isn't always justifiable. Personally I prefer the Samsung 970 EVO Plus to the WD SN750. It's slightly faster and costs less.

Actually I checked prices and the SAMSUNG 970 EVO PLUS M.2 2280 1TB PCIe Gen 3.0 x4, NVMe is more expensive than the Western Digital WD BLACK SN750 NVMe M.2 2280 1TB PCI-Express 3.0 x4.

Currently (in CAD) Samsung is around $349 regular price and the Western Digital is $319 regular price. However the Western digital is on sale for $179 making it a really good deal. I might just go for it based on the price.

 

[DaveB]

IMO you're going overboard pricewise since you're not a gamer and your main use is Photo editing. My i5-9400F/GTX 1660 Ti system would be cheaper with an inexpensive B360 motherboard which only requires inexpensive DDR4-2666 RAM. Such a combo with 32GB of memory is just $350 at Newegg including VA sales tax, and a mini ITX GTX 1600 Super, which is way more than you need, is just another $230. 1TB NVMe M.2 drives are available at Newegg for around $100. You'll never notice the higher speed of pricier NVMe drives anyway except in benchmarks. But the Ryzen/RX 2060 system you've spec'd is certainly a nice one and it is your money.