Multi-channel fan controller for several PWM/Non-PWM fans Vs a decent MB?

[PigeonStriker]

Jalyst, this is an excellent response and also is the real answer for your quest.

What you dream of is a very specialized custom made circuit that I believe that it can not be made by just some sketching the circuit at the paper then build it in one or two days even for an senior EE. It is a really a serious electronic project.

I guess you just have to live with the current options that already mentioned previously.
Unless you can find an EE to design and build it from the scratch just for you.

If this project ever becomes a super high priority for you, let me know.

Given the right conditions, I was making that offer. But economically speaking, it's not worthwhile. (And I'm just an EE student, so no guarantees for anything standing the test of time.)

Ignoring shipping, I'd estimate 1-2 months of dedicated working on it in my spare time.

 

[bing]

Great news, apparently I missed the part that you were implying you'll going to build it, Jalyst should be happy by now.

Should this turned into a transactional rather than voluntary (aka free), please proceed it in the classified section.

 

[jalyst]

Jalyst, this is an excellent response and also is the real answer for your quest.

What you dream of is a very specialized custom made circuit that I believe that it can not be made by just some sketching the circuit at the paper then build it in one or two days even for an senior EE. It is a really a serious electronic project.

I guess you just have to live with the current options that already mentioned previously.
Unless you can find an EE to design and build it from the scratch just for you.

Yes as identified some time ago...
I think the closest I'll get to what I want (aside from engineering it all from the ground up) is this.

What do you think of the feasibility of modding the miniNG to make it suitable for true/quality PWM control of 2x G1238B12BBZP-00.
And then "daisy-chaining" it to the BigNG? (which will accommodate my remaining 10 LVC AP14/15's)

*edit*
it appears we were posting our latest posts at almost the same time, great minds think alike?

Given the right conditions, I was making that offer. But economically speaking, it's not worthwhile. (And I'm just an EE student, so no guarantees for anything standing the test of time.)

Ignoring shipping, I'd estimate 1-2 months of dedicated working on it in my spare time.

I never got that impression from earlier posts, sorry if I gave you that impression.

I'm mostly interested in making do with components out there + some modding if/where necessary.
Hopefully with the guidance of my peers

I would consider your suggestion, but would need to have an idea of total cost (parts+labour).
I wouldn't be interested in spending much more than the most expensive pre-built controllers out there.

I'm not a fan of this route because of potential outlay, plus I'd like to get my hands dirty & learn a thing or two!

 

[bing]

Y
What do you think of the feasibility of modding the miniNG to make it suitable for true/quality PWM control of 2x G1238B12BBZP-00.
And then "daisy-chaining" it to the BigNG? (which will accommodate my remaining 10 LVC AP14/15's)

Feasible ? Yes, but who is going to do that, don't know and not sure if anyone willing to do a circuit surgery on that expensive controller, and its also doesn't make any sense if the person has the skill and capable of doing that surgery, he might better to design and build a new one for himself.

 

[jalyst]

Well I guess it depends on how in-depth the surgery you speak off is.
That's my problem, I'm not 100% sure...
Could you give me an idea (very roughly) of the steps I'd have to take, to do what I'm suggesting?

 

[bing]

No idea since I don't have it, its a mcu based controller and not just simple discrete components circuit which is hell a lot more difficult to mod.

Unless you're buy me one for free, but no guarantee it will work....j/k..

C'mon Jalyst, seriously, you haven't bought any of those fans, while imo you spend too much time & energy to find the controller, why not buy them 1st, then try it and get a feel if you really need that controller.

 

[jalyst]

LOL sorry, I do understand your frustration, I often frustrate myself.
I do have most of the fans, the total build is underway very soon.

About to research/finalise:
*Enclosure
Finding a ATX HTPC case that uses 120mm fans & meets other requirements is proving difficult.
But I may have one or two that are close enough.
*Digital (HDMI/HDCP) capture

Then I'm onto final fans & fan controller...
I will 1st make do with my MB, & then take it from there.

If I decide to move ahead with discrete controller (this is likely), I'll play with it myself 1st.
And if it doesn't meet expectations, I'll consider sending you & pigeon a freebie

 

[Brutal-Force]

Let me chime in here on something. While building my pwm circuit, I destroyed a Fan controller trying to use it to control the PWM circuit in my case. Fortunately it was only a $15 dollar fan controller and not one of the $100 dollar type or I would have been heart broken.

 

[jalyst]

It may not come to that yet...
only offering a freebie if after trialling everything, I'm not satisfied.
Of course no expectations from Bing/PigeonStriker

 

[PigeonStriker]

What do you think of the feasibility of modding the miniNG to make it suitable for true/quality PWM control of 2x G1238B12BBZP-00.

I briefly looked at the miniNG and BigNG, and wow, they're pretty good! If I had a lot of fans to control, I'd buy them.

And then I looked at the datasheet for that fan you want. That's a crazy fan.
-It looks like it's 4-pin PWM.
-But at 5KHz. Now the earlier posts make sense about 25KHz vs. 5KHz.
-Similarly, the 'true/quality' you refer to.

So... the miniNG... 50W/channel PWM, 3-pin.

50W/channel, and the fan's specs are
Input 53.4 W
Voltage 12 V
Operating Voltage 9.6 - 13.8 V
Current Rating 4450 mA
Current Starting 6100 mA

53.4W / 12V = 4450mA
-I'd say this is iffy at best. It'll probably work, but the miniNG's parts could be slowly dying.
-If not much extra headroom was given in the miniNG, it could die pretty quick, but I doubt it.
-To be safe, I'd only run 1x G1238B12BBZP-00 per miniNG.
-But there's a slim chance the miniNG's power electronics can't handle it (strictly speaking, 53.4W > 50W), so could be looking at completely redoing the miniNG's power output. Not happening.


3-pin / 'true/quality'
-Looking at the bigNG and miniNG, they seem to only have 3-pin outputs (unless I really missed something).
-They have nice photos of the bigNG (Atmega 16), but I can't quite make out the chip on the miniNG (looks like Atmega 8). I've worked with these before, and it looks like they've exposed the debugging pins, so custom firmware changes might be possible unless they've locked the chip. But hopefully it wouldn't come to that.


So.. first thoughts on modding the miniNG:
-I'd make a custom 4-pin header as so:
12V - connect straight to input molex.
GND - connect straight to input molex.
RPM sense - connect to same pin on miniNG's 3-pin fan header.
PWM - connect to PWM output directly on the mcu. It would be a simple matter to find which pin it would be via the datasheet, then hooking up an oscilloscope / good AC voltmeter to confirm. If the signal gets too degraded by the fan, then run it through a buffer.

This would, in theory, give you what you want, since I think the miniNG's software (via a bigNG) can control the PWM duty cycle in small increments (the true/quality requirements).

Potential problems:
-miniNG's power output is too weak (described above). If this is the case, then find a different controller to mod.
-The fan's 5 KHz PWM freq doesn't work well. If this is the case, then the firmware would have to be modified to change the PWM frequency. That could be as simple as changing 1 byte, or it could be much worse. It might not even be possible if they've locked the mcu. Otherwise, it might be possible to construct a frequency divider. That would take some thinking though.

 

[jalyst]

Wow fascinating, thanks Pigeon you rock, some awesome food for thought!
I will definitely keep all this in mind if/when the time comes!

So far I've only found a few ATX HTPC cases that take 120mm fans*.
And even then they only take one to two at the most!

Luckily I realised this before I placed an order for 4x more AP-14 on top of the 2x I have!
The 4x AP-15's I have are okay, as they'll be in a P+P on the RAD, which will be mounted externally to the case.

But when I wanna muck around w/2x 5400+ RPM fans on the RAD (will prolly need diff. rad or stacked rads) I'll have 4x fans I can do nothing with, LOL.

It's weird because decent similar-sized tower cases, generally have at least 50% more 120mm fans.
Hopefully I can find a case that takes a few more than just 2x...
Then again maybe it doesn't matter, so long internal airflow of the case is designed well, but how to assess that?!


*that also meet other basic requirements

 

[jason4207]

The Antec NSK2480 only has 2 120mm fans, but in my research it has one of the best airflow's of any HTPC case. A lot of HTPC cases use 92mm, 80mm or even 60mm fans, and that just doesn't make a lot of sense to me since they are so loud. To get those little fans quiet you have to slow them to the point they barely move any air.

Only thing I hate about the NSK2480 is that it only comes w/ a silver face. They should have a black option.

It's also a microATX case, so keep that in mind if you're considering it.

 

[jalyst]

Yeah ATX is one of my other criterion unfortunately.
I want the full 7 slots, if I could have 8* I'd be even happier

But that's not gunna happen for cases that conform to ATX.
Haven't seen even one like that yet...

Don't really like the NSK2480 overall aesthetics too, looks ugly IMO.
But being an Antec it'd have decent airflow.

Shame they don't make an ATX version, it'd prolly be on my short-list.
Going to start a dedicated thread soon to list what I've found.


*for my Essence ST's daughter-board that doesn't actually "need" a PCI slot

 

[jalyst]

I do have most of the fans, the total build is underway very soon.
About to research/finalise:
*Enclosure
Finding a ATX HTPC case that uses 120mm fans & meets other requirements is proving difficult.

So far I've only found a few ATX HTPC cases that take 120mm fans*.
And even then they only take one to two at the most!
It's weird because decent similar-sized tower cases, generally have at least 50% more 120mm fans.
Hopefully I can find a case that takes a few more than just 2x...
Then again maybe it doesn't matter, so long as internal airflow is designed well, but how to assess that!
*and also meet other basic requirements

Yeah ATX is one of my criterion unfortunately.
I want the full 7 slots, if I could have 8* I'd be even happier
Going to start a dedicated thread soon to list what I've found.
*for my Essence ST's daughter-board that doesn't "need" a PCI slot

A thread to find a case that meets my criteria has been started.
I'd be most grateful if anyone can think of others to add to the sole case I've found!