Need to change PSU probably

[OSFP]

Hi, let'w start with my System components since its critical on how much power i need...

Abit NF7-S rev2
AthlonXP Barton 2500+
2x512Mb HyperX PC3200 (BH-5)
Sapphire Radeon 9700 Pro
2xRaptors 36Gb Raid 0 = 70Gb
IDE WD 200Gb
DVD Rom Pioneer 120S
CD-R Plextor 12x10x32A
Floppy Drive
5xCase Fans

Ok, my case is a Chieftec Dragon, so I currently use the Chieftec PSU that came with it...the 360W one
Its features can be seen at this link :
http://www.chieftec.com/products/psu/PSII PSU.htm

Its the 360W , the 1 FAN version...

First of all, I think my system is kinda power hungry....i mean the radeon and those raptors , plus an OC at 2200MHz must need some considerable power...that one would expect such a cheap PSU wouldnt handle....

Well it does for the moment...no crashes and stuff...
However I plan on buying the new SP97 heatsink and do some vdimm vdd mods in order to get the most out of my system, and I think that with the upping of voltages and stuff, the 360 one wont handle the job....or at least it will limit my OC...

So I need 3 things from you...

1) Tell me what u think of my current PSU (see the link above for features, or if you know about it...) cause I cant evaluate it...i dont know anything about PSUs...

2) Tell me if i need a better one for the above procedures as I think...

3) Suggest a new one (if the answer to Question2 is YES)...

Lastly, Tell me in which range of Watts should I search....what would be OK and what Overkill for my system....

PS: I currently have the CPU on default vcore (1.65) ....and it can reach 2230 with that....but I wanna reach somehting like 2500 and this will need some power indeed...

 

[Top Hat Theater]

Check to see if the 3.3v and 5v combined output is greater than 240w. If it is, you should be fine. If not, I'd suggest looking into an Antec Trupower 380 or 430 or a Sparkle/Forton 350/400w PSU. I would suggest going for either higher output unit as you're right about your system being power hungery.

~THT

 

[Tawcan]

What are your 5V and 3.3 rail readings right now?

Try using this link...it's not the most up-to-date but it gives you an idea...
http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/

Using the above calculator it said you need about 230W, but since you're overclocking you are probably using a lot more than that.

If I were you I would watch out for the rails and see how they look and if the system is stable enough after you do all the mods and stuff.

As for PS I would go with Antec TP, but there are lots good choices out there as well.

 

[OSFP]

Actually using your calculator Tawcan it said a 407 power supply is recommended....which makes me worried if this was for default usage... will the 430 Truepower be enough for OC?

BTW Antecs cost a lot....are they worth it?
For example in a local shop, the Antec 550 goes for 170 euros, the 430 for 110 and a Q-Tec 550 goes for 55 euros....a world of difference...

 

[Deathknight]

Well since he has an NF7-S motherboard, the primary rail of concern is going to be the 12v rail, since that is the rail that the cpu is powered off of. Not to discount the 3.3 + 5.5 of course but your 12v rail is powering alot of the stuff in your rig and I could see that being a factor for you as you increase your OC (and your vcore).

 

[Tawcan]

Actually using your calculator Tawcan it said a 407 power supply is recommended....which makes me worried if this was for default usage... will the 430 Truepower be enough for OC?

BTW Antecs cost a lot....are they worth it?
For example in a local shop, the Antec 550 goes for 170 euros, the 430 for 110 and a Q-Tec 550 goes for 55 euros....a world of difference...

Oops I must missed some stuff then.

I have a Antec TP 430 in my system and it has been pretty stable.

My system:
NF7-S rev 2
2500+
Ti4200
DVD & CDRW
1 HD
5 case fans

My Antec has treat me pretty well so far. Ahh you're from Europe. I'm not too familiar with Q-Tec so can't really tell you. The best bet is do some research and read some reviews. There are a lot of PS reviews on the web. Check out www.systemcooling.com

 

[Tawcan]

Well since he has an NF7-S motherboard, the primary rail of concern is going to be the 12v rail, since that is the rail that the cpu is powered off of. Not to discount the 3.3 + 5.5 of course but your 12v rail is powering alot of the stuff in your rig and I could see that being a factor for you as you increase your OC (and your vcore).

12V.... aren't too familar with the NF7 boards yet.

 

[OSFP]

I dont see any "combined 3v and 3.3v" rating, how can i evaluate my current PSU?
U can see its features at a link in my first post...

 

[Deathknight]

12V.... aren't too familar with the NF7 boards yet.

Well I am only familiar from personal experience. I know of a couple of nforce2 boards that for sure use the 12v rail(but also a good # of them still use the 5v). Was alot easier when all the boards were the same

 

[OSFP]

Ok , today i decided to push my PSU and see the results...
So I installed motherboard monitor 5 to check the voltages from there, and started running progs like SuperPi , Toast and Prime and looking at the voltages....

Well i notices the +3.3 never goes below 3.39 , the +5 is always 5.13 and the +12 is 12.16 .....are these good results? what should i look for?
Another thing i noticed its that the CPU instead of 1.65 , was 1.63 usually, and the RAM instead of 2.9 was 2.96 ....but I dont know if these are due to the PSU or the mobo....

Help me plz, I need to know how to check my PSU....
Now I overclocked to 2250 stock voltage and check stability...

 

[CrashOveride]

That looks good to me, they are even high, better than low as long as they don't get too high up. The 3v+3.3v thing you were looking for should actaully be 5+3.3, it should be there.

I would say that you shouldn't be having any problems from you PSU from the looks of things.

 

[johan851]

Your rails are very good...with my 400w Antec the 12v dips as low as ~11.5v with a high vcore.

The higher RAM voltages and lower CPU voltages are the motherboard's fault. The NF7 tends to overvolt memory and undervolt the CPU.

 

[OSFP]

What about the Vcore? If i set in bios 1.65 which is the default for bartons, then under load the vcore is 1.62-1.63 ...
When I choos in bios 1.675 then its 1.63 steady under load and 1.65-1.66 idle....
Is that because of the PSU or its just the mobo undervolting so i should just give more in the bios to chieve what I want and only care about what i see in the mobo monitor?

Also I cant seem to find a way to see the Vdd in windows, any clues?

 

[Tawcan]

What about the Vcore? If i set in bios 1.65 which is the default for bartons, then under load the vcore is 1.62-1.63 ...
When I choos in bios 1.675 then its 1.63 steady under load and 1.65-1.66 idle....
Is that because of the PSU or its just the mobo undervolting so i should just give more in the bios to chieve what I want and only care about what i see in the mobo monitor?

Also I cant seem to find a way to see the Vdd in windows, any clues?

NF7-S seems to undervolt the Vcore a bit.

Your rails look pretty good.

 

[OSFP]

I read somewhere else that the monitor is not precise in any way and that I must use a multimeter to count the actual values....any clues how i can do that? I got the multimeter but where sould i put it to count?

And also, the fact that the vcore is not steady , is because of the abit or the PSU? I mean ok the abit undervolts, but on Load i get less voltage than in idle, is that because of the abit or the PSU?

 

[CrashOveride]

I read somewhere else that the monitor is not precise in any way and that I must use a multimeter to count the actual values....any clues how i can do that? I got the multimeter but where sould i put it to count?

And also, the fact that the vcore is not steady , is because of the abit or the PSU? I mean ok the abit undervolts, but on Load i get less voltage than in idle, is that because of the abit or the PSU?

The monitor is pretty close to what the motherboard is actually getting to the components. You can use a multimeter to determine if the problem is the PSU or the connection btwn the PSU and the motherboard (or maybe a problem with the motherboard). Because your rails arn't low I don't think you need a new PSU and testing will PROBABLY yeild postive results I don't know that it would help the situation. But then again it's always good to be sure. If you want to measure it you measure the red and a black (on the molex while the computer is on - maybe under load if you want) for the 5v and yellow and black for the 12v (black is ground of course).

On the Vcore since I have heard stuff about the NF7-S being a lil low on that and mine is just a lil low (no more than .04 EVER though) while my memory is almost rock solid I would put it to the board before the PSU, esp since your rails look great.

 

[OSFP]

Everyone keeps saying my rails look OK, and in fact I dont have any reset problems etc....
However my system looks like it needs lots of power (see 1st post the system components) and I got a cheap 30 euro 360Watt PSU....so it doesnt look sensible....thats why I am so hesitant to believe the mobo monitor....

And the fact remains, currently I run at stock vcore, but I plan on buying the new SP-97 heatsink, and also doing vdimm mod which means I will up the vcore to something arount 1.85-1.9 and the vdimm around 3.2 , so will these changes make me need a new PSU?

The way I see it, its already "too good to be true" that this cheapo PSU handles my current system, but with the +vcore and +vdimm coming, will it survive?

 

[CrashOveride]

I would guess it would if the readings are good (feel free to test with a multimeter though) it would last, they are really on the ball, most people don't get it that good. It could be a luck PSU or somthing... and then maybe you just have a really good connection from the PSU to the motherboard... I dunno.

If you really don't think it will you could but a good branded PSU and throw it in see if it works out the same, worste case senario you have an extra PSU to use in another computer or somthing.

 

[johan851]

A new PSU might help keep the 12v rail up at those higher voltages. If I were you, I'd see how it handles with the voltmods. If you're still not happy with its performance then you should go ahead and upgrade it. Seriously though, your PSU is handling the 12v rail better than my 400w Antec.

The core voltage fluctuation you talked about is a fault of the motherboard and power regulators, I think. I get the same thing - as much as .08v or so at around 1.95+ vcore. Cooling the mosfets helps this a decent amount, but still not perfect.

 

[OSFP]

Ok, thanks for your valuable advice, I am gonna go on with the vdimm - vdd mods, and I will decide what to do from the results...

Only thing is I need to wait until the SP-97 heatsink becomes available... Since I will need to remove the mobo in order to do the mods, and I will also need to remove it from the case to install the SP-97, I wanna do them at the same time...

Once again thanks for your advice, and feel free to help me in the mobo section that I will ask some stuff for finding info on mods for the Abit...