Noob Intro & Rig Questions

[Stickman84]

Hi,

I am a UK based noob. I have gamed for about 25 years now and I've never really known what I am doing. I never really needed too much to be honest, I just pull things apart and stuff things in and hope for the best.

I download whatever things tell me I should download and fiddle the hell out of things until they work. And then I've usually spent so much time fiddling I end up buying something to replace it after my fiddling has failed to fix the issues I am having.

This is roughly what I currently attempt to game on.

ASUS M5A78L-M LX V2 Motherboard
Corsair Hydro H60 Cooler
AMD FX eight core 8120 3.1ghz
8GB GSkillz DDR3 1600 mhz Ram
Palit GeForce GTX 560 TI 1GB
Corsair 750M PSU
Windows 7 64 Bit (installed on physical HD at present)
Some 1TB Physical Hard Drive (cant remember details)
120GB Samsung Evo SSD (only games installed on this)

So here I am on my GF's laptop realising I need to buy a new CPU and a new MOBO for my own PC and am not sure what to buy. I had a lot of issues with some particular games which frustrated me greatly. I have decided that my CPU is just utter crap and needs replaced. Which means my MOBO needs replaced too. I have done my best to try and remember what my PC is off the top of my head and enter it into my signature as this seems to be the norm here. I always read these forums for advice, but have never actually got involved and just asked the actual questions I need. So here I am. Wondering what motherboard I should buy and whether I should go for an i5 or just fork out for an i7 since they seem to be the best.

My current PC build was an attempt to making a functioning budget gaming PC. I bought it about 3 or 4 years ago now I think. I bought the SSD, Cooler and PSU more recently though. Hence I feel I mostly need a new CPU to fix freezing issues I am having in some games. It freezes a lot in bursts. I currently have the following BIOS features disabled as I suspect they are somewhat unneccesary but honestly don't really know what a few of them are/do. Core C6 State disabled, Cool n Quiet disabled, AMD Turbo Core disabled, Unleashing Mode disabled.

I used to use unleashing and have all 8 cores enabled but I read that this CPU is a bulldozer which sucks so tried to use just 1 core and overclock it to 4.1ghz. Probably a stupid noob idea but sure, you can tell me why/if thats wrong/stupid now since I am here.

Thanks in advance for whatever feedback or input you all give me.

 

[bob4933]

.........

Your motherboard is toast. The fact it lasted for a considerable length of time is honestly astounding to me.


Looking at your rig, you're probably better off going with an entirely new setup. GTX 500's are relatively ancient now, don't even support DX12. The psu is old, ram is ok, hard drive and ssd are ok.

What's your budget?

 

[Janus67]

If you are trying to run a game on a single core that explains a lot of your problems, turn all 8 back on.

Beyond that if you wanted to buy a new video card it wouldn't hurt as an upgrade.

I'm honestly surprised that the motherboard managed to last this long, and if the cooler is holding up its end of the bargain as it is pretty underpowered for a 8core cpu.

 

[trents]

I would say your 750Ti video card is more likely the limiting factor in the system you delineate in your post, not the CPU. But the motherboard you chose is not a good match for an 8 core FX processor. That's a poor foundation. You might consider the option of buying an Asus Sabortooth motherboard and a better video card. Then overclock the CPU as far as you can which would also imply getting a better CPU cooler. Just a thought. Or it might be better to take that same money and invest in an Intel Haswell based CPU system. Either way, you would want a better video card.

 

[Stickman84]

Interesting feedback. Yeah I've had this PC for ages. It's done well to last this long.

I should probably have mentioned that I generally don't play big mainstream games. Mostly weird indie stuff etc. That's maybe helped.

I probably will replace the gfx card eventually but I honestly feel that whatever's going wrong at the minute, and from what you lot have said, is probably more my motherboard then. I'll maybe replace it first.

Hilariously I was actually using the stock fan on the CPU for a couple of years before sticking that other cooler in. I like to just mess around and see what I can get away with using. I only changed to using 1 core very recently as a test.

Any recommendations for a good value motherboard to upgrade to? Would an ASUS Sabertooth support an i7 or anything in the future if I was to want to try overclocking this FX one first? Is it entirely based on the voltage the mobo /cpu can handle/requires?

Ill maybe look into GFX cards as well then.

 

[bob4933]

Lets start with some basics boss, not condescending, simply an explanation of things


1) CPU's use specific "sockets". While it would be GREAT if all cpu's used the same socket, its just not how it is. For example, your cpu is an AM3+ socket. So mostly you will find motherboards that support AM3/AM3+. "780"; "970", "990" etc are the northbridge chipsets. While they don't imply any sense of compatibility, newer (higher usually) is "better". Intel uses a number based system; i.e. "LGA 1150"; "LGA 775"; etc.

The problem with AMD is their AM3+ is a DEAD SOCKET. This means the fx 9590/8350 chips are the BEST you will get from them, and you can never upgrade out of that on the same mother board. Since you need a new motherboard anyway, I would take this time and invest in an intel solution.

2) An 8120 overclocked SHOULD be "ok" for gaming for a bit, certainly if you're not doing anything major. So with that chip, and given your performance requirements, the gigabyte 970 ud3p seems to be up your alley. Its 89$ at newegg.com. The sabertooth is in an entirely different league, but its performance you probably dont need. I'd say a 4.0 ghz overclock on a hyper 212 evo would be a decent spot in terms of reliability and performance, without stressing your motherboard too much.

3) for strong, out of the box performance, I would seriously have to recommend you go intel route. The pentium g3258 sounds incredibly up your alley. The cost/performance ratio on this thing is freaking off the charts. PLUS you can pair it with a relatively inexpensive motherboard (as long as youre not doing super serious overclocking) and be ok. I'd imagine most indie games were single threaded applications anyway. For the cost of a decent AM3+ and the age and nature of your system, this would absolutely be the way I would go personally. If you DID want more performance, that socket is the same as the i5 4460, which would be a simple swap! So, kind of a two-fer there.



Its astonishing your m5a78 has lasted this long to be blunt, consider yourself lucky you got your money's worth out of it!


TL;DR -> probably best not to invest money into a dead chipset.

 

[Theocnoob]

Some quick points-

You never turn cores off. Only extreme overclockers do that and they don't even do work on the chip they just take a screenshot.

Your board was NOT made to support your CPU. It may physically work with it but the voltage regulation part of your board is being beaten to death by your CPU.

Fiddling without knowing what you're fiddling with is bad.

Making "odd" decisions and implementing them in BIOS (like overclocking on that motherboard you have, or turning cores off) are bad things too.

I think you'd do well to invest in a platform that is efficient, future proof, and is easy to overclock, with handholding and advice from this forum, if you're so inclined.
I would suggest you look at a combination such as a 4690K or 4790K (4 core 4 thread 6MB L3 cache vs 4 core 8 thread 8MB L3 cache) and a decent Z97 motherboard. Something like an ASRock Extreme 4 or ASUS Z97-A.

Your RAM is fine to re-use-- it is 2 sticks right? 2x4GB? It's not 1X8GB is it? That'd be bad too. You want to run 2 sticks or 4 sticks on most platforms. On some it's 1 stick or 2 sticks and on some its four sticks or eight sticks but on your current one and Z97 it's 2 or 4.

Your storage (drives) are fine to reuse too.

Is that a CX750M you have? That's a bit dodgey as powersupplies go. CX, CS, and RM Corsair PSUs like to roll over and die. They are decent PSUs when they work, but they do like to die. You might want to replace. If it's a TX/HX/AX disregard that comment.

If you've had your Corsair Hydro H60 Cooler since 2011 when you built your PC this also can not be brought over to the new system. ALC/AIO liquid coolers build up gunk and sludge inside them over time. With "real" water cooling you'd clean your blocks and tubes and your rad and refill everything but with an ALC you're stuck. It's recommended to toss and replace these every 3-4 years. With big air cooling, you don't have that problem.

I'd suggest you look at (in the low end) a Cooler Master Hyper 212 cooler for your new CPU, and in the higher end either a Noctua NHD14 or NHD15. With the D15 check board compatibility. You will need low profile RAM with big air coolers as well (RAM that is not "tall")

Most importantly I would advise you not to fiddle with your PC, not download "everything" you're told to, and generally not screw with any settings unless you explicitly understand why and what you are doing. If you like to fiddle with things, fiddle with something cheap and cheerful like a Raspberry Pi. If you kill it, you're only out a few bucks.
Merry Christmas.

 

[bob4933]

ocnoob, my CM TX750 definitely did the "roll over and die" thing... took out my killer haha. NH-D15's support more memory than D14's btw (cut back higher on the memory side)

 

[Theocnoob]

ocnoob, my CM TX750 definitely did the "roll over and die" thing... took out my killer haha. NH-D15's support more memory than D14's btw (cut back higher on the memory side)

Strangely enough my TX750 also rolled over and died after about 3-4 years... My HX850 is still going strong after almost 5 years. I've decided it's all going to be high end Gold or Platinum rated supplies from now on. Not worth the risk. I have yet to have PSU die and toast any other component but I don't like the risk.

 

[bob4933]

Yeah mine was pretty old as well. Served well... until it didnt xD

 

[Theocnoob]

Yeah mine was pretty old as well. Served well... until it didnt xD

I dont consider that old. In my eyes a PSU should last 6-10 years as a minimum, provided it isn't zapped by lightning.

 

[Itachiii]

What type of gaming are you doing? What's your budget? Supposed that you don't play just an online MOBA and that you have some room in your budget, I would go for an Asus M5A99X or a Gigabyte ga- 990FXA-ud3 and a GTX 760ti at least. Now if you're restricted by ur budget, asus m5a97 and r9 270x?

 

[Stickman84]

The games I've mainly been playing on this setup in the whole time I've had it are, Day Z and Day Z standalone, Diablo 3, 7 Days to Die, Space Engineers, CS:GO, Mortal Online, LOTR: Shadow of Mordor, Natural Selection 2, Chivalry Medieval Warfare, Rust, ARMA 3 : Altis Life, etc.

I'm not sure if I want budget or not, I don't like buying the high end stuff usually as its pricey and often seems excessive. I mean, I've had this budget rig about 3 years which people here clearly say shouldn't even work. I've fiddled with everything a lot and its never conned out, it just seems like it struggling massively in some games now and getting CPU freezes. This is why I feel I should replace the motherboard and cpu. But I've never found any games run that bad on it. To be honest Mortal Online is the worst performance on it. It's the only one that freezes.

I'll look into all the options suggested here when I get out of work!

 

[Itachiii]

The games I've mainly been playing on this setup in the whole time I've had it are, Day Z and Day Z standalone, Diablo 3, 7 Days to Die, Space Engineers, CS:GO, Mortal Online, LOTR: Shadow of Mordor, Natural Selection 2, Chivalry Medieval Warfare, Rust, ARMA 3 : Altis Life, etc.

I'm not sure if I want budget or not, I don't like buying the high end stuff usually as its pricey and often seems excessive. I mean, I've had this budget rig about 3 years which people here clearly say shouldn't even work. I've fiddled with everything a lot and its never conned out, it just seems like it struggling massively in some games now and getting CPU freezes. This is why I feel I should replace the motherboard and cpu. But I've never found any games run that bad on it. To be honest Mortal Online is the worst performance on it. It's the only one that freezes.

I'll look into all the options suggested here when I get out of work!

By budget we mean how much money are u willing to spend on your upgrade. It's normal to get freezes and stuff since your mobo is struggling with that power monster you got on her Since you're in UK.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/M5A99X-R2-0...18994799&sr=1-1&keywords=asus+m5a99x+evo+r2.0

+

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nvidia-GeFo...e=UTF8&qid=1418994838&sr=1-1&keywords=gtx+760

These should do the job pretty nicely and you got headroom for new releases like DA Inquisition etc. for 258£. Tell me what you think.

 

[Theocnoob]

By budget we mean how much money are u willing to spend on your upgrade. It's normal to get freezes and stuff since your mobo is struggling with that power monster you got on her Since you're in UK.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/M5A99X-R2-0...18994799&sr=1-1&keywords=asus+m5a99x+evo+r2.0

+

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nvidia-GeFo...e=UTF8&qid=1418994838&sr=1-1&keywords=gtx+760

These should do the job pretty nicely and you got headroom for new releases like DA Inquisition etc. for 258£. Tell me what you think.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/VTX3D-280-X...s&ie=UTF8&qid=1418997120&sr=1-2&keywords=280X

Here's a 280X for even less money than that 760, and more performance too.

We like to recommend the GA970AUD3P by Gigabyte over ASUS' M5A99FX R2.0 here. I believe it's slightly cheaper as well. Still, it's 970 vs 990FX. If you want the big boy chipset, the ASUS board is a better buy. Having said that, a Crosshair V, or a Sabretooth, are even better choices if we're sticking with 8 core FX.
Those FX cpus really need to be overclocked to open them up though. I would also suggest a decent CPU cooler to get the CPU to at least 4.4. JM2C.

Stickman84, How does Shadow of Mordor run on your 560Ti? What kind of framerates do you get (you can use FRAPS to check)? My friend and I do steam sharing and he wanted to check that game out but he only has a 560Ti like you. I know that game eats a lot of VRAM so I'm curious how it's running on a 1GB card.

 

[Itachiii]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/VTX3D-280-X...s&ie=UTF8&qid=1418997120&sr=1-2&keywords=280X

Here's a 280X for even less money than that 760, and more performance too.

We like to recommend the GA970AUD3P by Gigabyte over ASUS' M5A99FX R2.0 here. I believe it's slightly cheaper as well. Still, it's 970 vs 990FX. If you want the big boy chipset, the ASUS board is a better buy. Having said that, a Crosshair V, or a Sabretooth, are even better choices if we're sticking with 8 core FX.
Those FX cpus really need to be overclocked to open them up though. I would also suggest a decent CPU cooler to get the CPU to at least 4.4. JM2C.

Stickman84, How does Shadow of Mordor run on your 560Ti? What kind of framerates do you get (you can use FRAPS to check)? My friend and I do steam sharing and he wanted to check that game out but he only has a 560Ti like you. I know that game eats a lot of VRAM so I'm curious how it's running on a 1GB card.

Yea it was a quick and rather sloppy search. Thankfully more experienced people correct us Agreed on the 280x but since he will be overclocking wouldnt the A99X be a better idea?

 

[Theocnoob]

Yea it was a quick and rather sloppy search. Thankfully more experienced people correct us Agreed on the 280x but since he will be overclocking wouldnt the A99X be a better idea?

Overclocking is not particularly affected by going 970 vs 990. It's more the platform differences from A to B than anything tweaking wise. If sticking with a single GPU config Id get the UD3P.

 

[Stickman84]

I haven't been home to test my fps on Shadow of Mordor with fraps today. I'll do that when I get a chance though for you.

I don't really have a strict budget, I mean, if I can justify spending the cash I can probably spend it. I just have a lot of hobbies so I generally try to not go nuts and buy more than I really need.

Actually sod it, I just ordered an "Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Motherboard (AMD 990FX/SB950, DDR3, S-ATA 600, ATX, PCI-Express 2.0, USB 3.0, SupremeFX III, Extreme Engine Digi+ II, Socket AM3+)" and should hopefully have it by 23/12/14.

Its a start. I'll look into getting a new gfx card next probably the one you recommended above and then potentially upgrade my CPU at a later date after i milk whats left of my 8 core FX.

Baby steps lol!

 

[Theocnoob]

I haven't been home to test my fps on Shadow of Mordor with fraps today. I'll do that when I get a chance though for you.

I don't really have a strict budget, I mean, if I can justify spending the cash I can probably spend it. I just have a lot of hobbies so I generally try to not go nuts and buy more than I really need.

Actually sod it, I just ordered an "Asus Crosshair V Formula-Z Motherboard (AMD 990FX/SB950, DDR3, S-ATA 600, ATX, PCI-Express 2.0, USB 3.0, SupremeFX III, Extreme Engine Digi+ II, Socket AM3+)" and should hopefully have it by 23/12/14.

Its a start. I'll look into getting a new gfx card next probably the one you recommended above and then potentially upgrade my CPU at a later date after i milk whats left of my 8 core FX.

Baby steps lol!

You bought a $200+ motherboard on a dead socket? An $80 board would have served you just as well. Also, upgrade to what? You already have an 8 core. You can get a (sliiiiightly) faster 8 core, or a stupidly overvolted overclocked 8 core (9590)... but we're not talking about milestone upgrades here. You're pretty much as high end as it's going to get on that platform, save for some overclocking.

Go ahead and pick up an NHD15 or an H110 or an H105 too because that H60 will get you absolutely nowhere with that CPU. Terrible product, the H60. Overpriced, underperforming. Can be matched by a $30 air cooler. Sad product really... shouldn't exist.

 

[bob4933]

http://www.amazon.co.uk/VTX3D-280-X...s&ie=UTF8&qid=1418997120&sr=1-2&keywords=280X

Here's a 280X for even less money than that 760, and more performance too.

Thats not a 280x... thats a 280... "x-edition".... Probably the most vile of misnomers ever. How they can get away with that is mind boggling.

You bought a $200+ motherboard on a dead socket? An $80 board would have served you just as well. Also, upgrade to what? You already have an 8 core. You can get a (sliiiiightly) faster 8 core, or a stupidly overvolted overclocked 8 core (9590)... but we're not talking about milestone upgrades here. You're pretty much as high end as it's going to get on that platform, save for some overclocking.

Go ahead and pick up an NHD15 or an H110 or an H105 too because that H60 will get you absolutely nowhere with that CPU. Terrible product, the H60. Overpriced, underperforming. Can be matched by a $30 air cooler. Sad product really... shouldn't exist.

At least he got a proper motherboard that will get him some real use out of that 8120. He can overclock the **** of out of it now.

H50/55/60's have their purpose, its not intended for overclocking. Im going to be getting one for my HTPC, the damn stock cooler is crap, and the case wont fit anything like a CM212