Show off your System :)

[Oklahoma Wolf]

offtopic- but which subwoofer do you think would sound better

http://www.harmankardon.com/specifications.asp?cat=SUB&ser=&prod=HKSUB 12&sType=

or

http://www.etronics.com/product.asp?stk_code=velcht10&rpc=4120&catid=4203&store=

(for another forum member)

Velodyne by a huge margin - not many companies know their stuff like they do.

I too suggest listening to them before buying.

 

[Azzkiller]

Nice "Quasi 3-Way" there, Azz. I love that trick!

Yeah, running the bottom woofer to 1.6khz didnt sound too great, and really screwed up imaging. The lobing was pretty bad.

Looks like you have some good woodworking skills, too! Is that a JBL horn (w/Emenince small format driver)? Very clean enclosure. Me likes the flared port!

Eh my woodworking skills are alright, certainly not anything special. But I did spend a lot of time sanding and finishing the enclosures, which is probably why they look decent. The horn and driver are both Eminence. The Eminence isnt a piezoelectric (i really hate the way most of them sound) but a titanium diaphramed inverted dome I might upgrade to a Radian compression drivers in the future, as the Eminence has some small peaking problems.

How do you like the Behringer power amps? Just curious. I have some behringer gear that does OK.

They are built like a tank. Im pretty sure they are the same design as the QSC RMX line. I used to have a QSC RMX 1450, and the Behringer puts out about 1kW more power, but costs 30-50 dollars less than the QSC amp. I even put a switch on the fan to disable it. The fan is only needed when I really crank up the music loud.

I hope we can get along!

Why wouldnt we?

I took more pictures of my other equipment too:

 

[Azzkiller]

Trust your ears. They don't lie, but can pe persueded by your internal procesor's (read that "Your Brain's") preconceptions. Listen with open ears.

Which is why I reccomend using blind testing whenever possible to minimize biases and other influences as best as possible.

 

[Azzkiller]

First off.... DONT GET harmonkardon for subs....

What's wrong with HK subwoofers? Did you have bad experiences with them?

 

[Randyman...]

I can't STAND peizo-electrics either - even on a GOOD CD horn! I prefer 2"/1" Exit compression drivers (as you have), as the 4"/2"exit drivers tend to loose articulation on the last octave (8KHz - 16KHz or so). The lower x-over of a 4"/2" exit is nice, but not woth the tradeoff IMO...

What do you roll off the bottom 12" at? Around 300Hz or so?

Looks good - and we CAN get along just fine

 

[seamadan000]

No pictures, as it is not setup at the moment (summer living for a college student)

61" Samsung DLP rear projection monitor
JBL S310 floorstanding speakers for front L/R channels
JBL S-center
JBL S38 rear L/R
DIY Adire Shiva 12" in sealed enclosure.
Yamaha RXV-1300 Reciever
Adcom amps for the sub and mains
Beringher Frequency destroy for Eq duties

Nothing too fancy, but it gets the job done in a dorm room

 

[Randyman...]

You built a Shiva? How do you like it? I have seen the DIY links, but was always curious HOW they sounded...

 

[seamadan000]

dang good IMO (which is all that matters as far as I am concerned )

Its a good driver and the DVC design allows me to use an older pro amp to power it, which is nice.

Also, b/c the room is tiny I get a ton of room gain, so it really shakes the walls.

It is a lot 'tighter' than the ported subs I have heard, but that is more due to the sealed enclosure and the low Q value of the alignment.

 

[Randyman...]

I go both ways (WHOA - What did I just say?). For PA use, I prefer ported to help efficiency and lower excursions (you are NOT going to get 20Hz very loud in a club/bar anyway), and for home/car I usually go sealed. I like the quickness of an acoustic suspension enclosure when applicable. That 2" max X-Max of the Shiva doesn't hurt either!

Neato-bendito!

 

[Azzkiller]

I can't STAND peizo-electrics either - even on a GOOD CD horn! I prefer 2"/1" Exit compression drivers (as you have), as the 4"/2"exit drivers tend to loose articulation on the last octave (8KHz - 16KHz or so). The lower x-over of a 4"/2" exit is nice, but not woth the tradeoff IMO...

What do you roll off the bottom 12" at? Around 300Hz or so?

Looks good - and we CAN get along just fine

Yeah, I too prefer the 1" exit drivers. One reason I really like the Radian CD's is because they have a 1" exit, and still can be crossed over as low as 800hz 4th order electrical.

Yeah, the bottom 12" is rolling off at around 300hz. I am actually contemplating redoing the entire front baffle if I upgrade to the Radians, and use a MTM design. The center to center distance shouldnt be too far considering the low xover point, and I could probably get a bit less lobing too. That would be quite a bit more work though

 

[seamadan000]

yeah, man that shiva can really move. Now that I have seen, heard and FEALT what a high x-max driver can do I will never go back!

I would love to build an acoustic suspention but my space and skill would both be insufficient for the task . Ported is great for high output, but for the rooms that I build I get enough gain that output is never a problem, so sealed it is for me!

It doesn't hurt that sealed is like 10 times easier to build either

 

[Randyman...]

Azz,
A 12" MTM. That wold be a first that I've seen! The low x-over should make that work just fine. 800Hz for THAT horn is pretty impressive. Those big ol' horns on my SP-2XT's are rated to load down to 800Hz as well but come in at 1.2KHz 3rd Order (18dB) to help power handling...

Read your other post - It keeps getting clearer and clearer!

SeaMadman,
Sealed is pretty hard to butcher unless the box falls apart! Ported is not all that difficult, and I even used simple "Paper Nomograms" for a decade with about 10% acuracy in f3. BoxPlot (freeware) does the trick for me now.

Later :Cool:

 

[seamadan000]

I've done the ported thing, and I just winISDed it then made the box as big as it needed to be, but that was kinda big...

Luckly my Grandfather is a master woodworker/carver/furnature maker, so my boxes are always REAL nice (thanks Grandpa!)

 

[Azzkiller]

I would love to build an acoustic suspention but my space and skill would both be insufficient for the task . Ported is great for high output, but for the rooms that I build I get enough gain that output is never a problem, so sealed it is for me!

It doesn't hurt that sealed is like 10 times easier to build either

Well, an acoustic suspension enclosure is the same thing as a sealed, so it looks like you already built one

Ported isnt too hard to build, especially if you use prefab ports like a precisionport. All you have to do is glue the port together and cut a hole in the enclosure and fasten it in.

 

[seamadan000]

doh, I was thinking inifinte baffle . Watch out, I'm an idiot with power tools...

you are right that it isn't too tough to build a ported box, but the problem I have is to tune it as low as I would want my sub to be I would need really long ports, ports that don't fit in the planned box size! And what could be easier than slapping two braces and four sides together (watching someone else do it and drinking beer, which is how I build my boxes)!

 

[Azzkiller]

doh, I was thinking inifinte baffle . Watch out, I'm an idiot with power tools...

you are right that it isn't too tough to build a ported box, but the problem I have is to tune it as low as I would want my sub to be I would need really long ports, ports that don't fit in the planned box size! And what could be easier than slapping two braces and four sides together (watching someone else do it and drinking beer, which is how I build my boxes)!

Infinite baffle is really cool. Many people consider it to be the best enclosure design as far as sound quality is concerned. However, most people that do IB's actually use a room or attic of their house as the enclosure instead of using a box.

http://home.comcast.net/~ttriff/page4IB-Gallery3.html
Some of these designs make me drool. ThomasW has 12 Shiva's in an IB, and another guy has 18!!!!! Dayton DVC 15" woofers!!!

 

[seamadan000]

yup, those things really rock. I saw one over at the HTF that had like 10 Tempests. Each one of those moves like TWICE THE AIR as a shiva.

I don't think that you could even breathe in those rooms if they cranked em'

I actually heard one in action, 4 12' dayton DVCs in a false wall that went to the garage...

I'm a grown man, but I am not afraid to say I soiled myself durning star wars.

I cannot imagine 12 or 18.

 

[Randyman...]

When I was a punk, I had eight Punch 15" subs in my CLOSET! I drove them off of a SAE A502 (not quite enough power, but it ROCKED). It got stolen by another punk friend of mine.

Insurance covered me, and I replaced them, and bought Punch car audio power amps (Since my drivers license and aquiring a ride was not far off), and powered them off inverters (always driving them into protection). They got stolen about a week after my older bro had a huge party, and everyone was scoping out my stuff

I was a weird kid! My Mazda B2200 also got stolen twice due to my "Broadcasting To The World" with the huge "Rockford" stickers on my truck, and "If You've Got It, CRANK IT" across the snug-top's rear glass. I had eight 18" punch's in there the last time it got stolen and eventually stripped/totalled. Tuned for 20Hz to 40Hz - much above that was NOT all that impressive, but I NEVER heard 15Hz-25Hz notes like that - EVER! I was pretty stoopid!

These days, you can get 150dB with a SINGLE 15" driver in a car and some serious power (Like 3000 watts on that one driver, and it takes it!!!) Granted, these modern "DB Drag" competitors are "High Q" tuned frequency specific systems (70-80Hz usually), but that is still pretty impressive IMO. I think the current DB Drag record is in the high 170dB range. FYI - That WILL kill you!

Later

 

[Oklahoma Wolf]

When I was a punk, I had eight Punch 15" subs in my CLOSET!

Sounds like fun

In my early days of audio before I knew better I used to run 2 pairs of awful 6x9" Sparkomatic car speakers in free air off a Canadian Tire boom box - back then I cared more about seeing the Sparkomatics dance around on the shelves I had them on than sound quality. Strange thing is, the boom box never complained about being cranked with a 2 ohm load and is still working to this day. Can't say the same for the Sparkomatics, not that I would care to use them if they were still alive lol.

 

[twEEkerAreUs]

I had eight 18" punch's in there the last time it got stolen and eventually stripped/totalled. Tuned for 20Hz to 40Hz - much above that was NOT all that impressive, but I NEVER heard 15Hz-25Hz notes like that - EVER! I was pretty stoopid!

8 18 Inch Punch Subs in your vehicle? Simple question, Why/How? Was it strictly for SPL comps or what........Not familar with the Mazda B2200 technically, isn't it a truck? I can't imagine jamming 8 18 Inch Subs inside of it especially Punch's.

Why not go with just 1 or 2 high quality Subs that are SQL? Sucks to hear it all got stolen though, worst possible thing you can do is "Advertise" that you have a system period unless you plan on guarding it all the time, it really is a shame. What was the complete setup you had and how much power did you have running to everything?

*Edit* I have the Klipsch 4:1's speakers for my computer and in the process of a Car Audio system when I buy my new car. Plan on a nice Home Audio setup when we move, not worth doing it now.