Strange behavior while booting up

[bww794]

My computer has been booting up strangely since the day I built it. In it's previous incarnation, upon pressing the power button, the fans would whir up to 100% for a short time, presumably until the bios was loaded and then would settle back down and perform as normal PWM fans would. I actually believe this is probably normal. I stripped that whole computer down and built it back 100% air cooled last night in a Phanteks Evolv X (built a pc for someone else in this case and loved it so much, I just had to have one for myself). Now however, instead of just whirring up to 100% and staying there until the bios loads, they perform this odd dance of whirring up, down, and back up again before settling down where they should be. I wish this was the only oddity. All the while the PC is booting up, the screen seems to blink an extra time while displaying the mobo splash screen and my peripherals go crazy. like they're being registered, then disconnected, then registering again. Lastly (and i believe this to be a complete issue with Corsair iCue alone), the keyboard takes eons to load the lighting profile in iCue and will default to red for several long seconds before loading the rainbow spiral to match the mouse and mouse pad.

I have uploaded a video to Youtube to demonstrate all of the behavior described above, as well as a picture of some stats from my bios. Just in case someone catches it and points it out, I am aware of the fact that the GPU is not in the top slot. It is still in a PCIe x 16 slot and the computer doesn't seem to mind. Performance is phenomenal. Also, I am aware of the fact that I'm rocking an AMD card in a Gsync monitor. I was using a 1080ti that i moved to a different rig. I plan on remedying this in the near future.

That being said - here are the current specs (disregard my sig)
threadripper 1950x oc'd to factory 4.0ghz profile
asus zenith extreme mobo
corsair vengeance lpx 32gb (4x8gb) running at 3466mhz
AMD radeon VII
EVGA 1000w P2 psu
BQ Dark Rock Pro TR4 cpu cooler (reason why gpu isn't in top slot)
Samsung 970evo Plus m.2 SSD as boot drive

The only peripherals plugged into USB are Razer Kraken dongle, mouse pad, keyboard (& port), and usb 3.0 from monitor (which could be unplugged as I never use it). mouse is plugged into mouse pad's port.

I performed a clean install of Windows last night and all of the issues that I have now were also experienced on the last install of Windows. I have the paid version of Driver Easy which updated all of my drivers and Windows update is completely up to date. The only thing I want to try when I get home this evening is downloading the most recent bios to a flash drive and using ASUS Flash utility to update it since the current version seems pretty old. Outside of it's peculiar boot up habits, it performs like a beast and stays cool so I have no complaints there. If anyone wiser than myself could proffer explanation as to why its behaving this way, or reassure me that it's completely normal, I would greatly appreciate it! Link to video below.

View attachment 204528

 

[EarthDog]

Report back after the flash.

 

[bww794]

will do. in your experience, do you think that might solve most of this?

 

[EarthDog]

Perhaps... Ive never really heard of this behavior, but, since the BIOS controls all these things (not windows) it makes sense to flash to the latest/reflash the latest if you are on it already. But yeah, the BIOS is the first place I would look.

If that doesn't do it... start disconnecting anything attached one by one and see if a particular device is causing the odd behavior on POST.

 

[trents]

If flashing the bios doesn't solve the issue then:

Does it exhibit this same odd behavior if the CPU is on stock clocks and voltages, i.e., no overclock?

Almost sounds like it's going through some kind of reset.

 

[Zerileous]

I can't see the video right now, but this sounds like something my system does after I change memory settings. Not sure if it is related to memory training (not really sure what that means, but I have seen similar behavior described as such). Sometimes it rejects the settings and returns to stock, other times it keeps the settings and will then boot normally. I just assumed it was a bit of a picky bios thing with RAM settings on my board. If this is happening every time you boot, it could be memory related. Try returning the RAM to SPD settings and if it goes away, then try returning to XMP.

+1 what trents said

 

[bww794]

I want to say yes, it performed the same as before I applied the pre-loaded 4.0ghz profile to the CPU in the bios. Also, it's a 3600mhz kit of RAM, but defaulted to 2133 when first installed. I tried clocking it to 3600 in the bios, but got what I assume is the Windows 10 BSOD (with the frowning emoticon). I then read online that someone else was having the same issue with this exact model of memory but found that 3466 was stable so i chose that instead and it didnt crash. Maybe I needed to up the volts or something? Idk... honestly, 3466 is plenty fast, i just chose this kit because it was among the fastest on the ASUS QVL for my motherboard. To add, I replaced a 2x16gb kit of Ballistix LT Sport @ 2666mhz which did not need to be oc'd and the wonky booting was happening back then too. I will flash to bios version 1701 tonight and let you all know what happens.

 

[EarthDog]

Also, it's a 3600mhz kit of RAM, but defaulted to 2133 when first installed.

This is normal. You should enable the XMP profile to have your board properly set up the timings/voltages etc.

I tried clocking it to 3600 in the bios, but got what I assume is the Windows 10 BSOD (with the frowning emoticon).

GO back to defaults, and use XMP/DOCP profile.. whatever they call it. That said, 3466 MHz with 4 sticks is getting high for the platform in the first place. More tweaks may be needed.

 

[Johan45]

After watching the video that really didn't seem all that bad, the Zenith is slow to boot on a good day anyway.
There's an LED readout on the IO shroud, it could give you some clue as to what's hanging it up if anything.
Could be memory related as has been said, many AMD boards have a "retry" setting if memory doesn't boot the first time.
Definitely update the BIOS, I was having issues with mine hanging on SSD initialization and that seemed to solve it for me.

 

[trents]

bw794, can't open the attachment. Get an "invalid" message.

- - - Auto-Merged Double Post - - -

I'm wondering if the memory is causing an issue as well. 3466 mhz and 32gb might be pushing the envelope and I'm not sure that the Corsair Vengeance LPX is one of the memory products that works well with Ryzen/Threadripper at higher frequencies.

 

[bww794]

well like I said, I didnt always have this kit in there. just installed it last night. It was a 32gb kit of 2666 before and behaved just the same. I dont think it's rejecting any of my settings because they all seem to stick, the boot up is just a whirlwind of events. I will see if i can glimpse anything from the oled on the io shield, but I'm itching to get the bios updated. i was reading the notes of the various bios versions between the current from 5 days ago all the way back to the one im on now from summer 2018 and a couple of them specifically cited "improved memory support" and "improved system stability".

EDIT: also, its funny that i used to hear so much about "Ryzen loves/needs fast memory" but now you're telling me that 32gb at 3466 is pushing the envelope. i dont know what to think anymore.

 

[EarthDog]

EDIT: also, its funny that i used to hear so much about "Ryzen loves/needs fast memory" but now you're telling me that 32gb at 3466 is pushing the envelope. i dont know what to think anymore.

Well, Ryzen does NEED fast memory to take off its shackles... however "FAST" for AMD is not 'as fast' as Intel. On any platform, the more memory used, the lower the ceiling is for speeds.

 

[trents]

Ryzen "loves" fast memory from the standpoint that it really boosts performance when compared to using faster memory with Intel. But it's also true that Ryzen (historically) has been very picky about what memory it will work with in frequencies above about 2666 mhz. It was discovered by Ryzen first generation owners in the early days of Ryzen's release that the memory products with the Samsung "B" die chips were the most likely to allow Ryzen to run memory at say, 3200 mhz. That issue was mitigated to some extent by later bios releases from the motherboard manufacturers but it did not totally disappear. The Ryzen IMC is superior to that of it's FX predecessor but still not as robust as Intel's.

 

[bww794]

so for a first gen threadripper on the zenith extreme, what would be the ideal upper speed if this was the kit you had to use? 3200mhz? I believe this particular Corsair Vengeance LPX is Samsung B die single sided.. if you believe everything you read on reddit.

I bought CMK32GX4M4B3600C18

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/62vp2g

 

[Johan45]

I run mine at 3466 when I'm running it that is. IIRC I upped the DRAM voltage to 1.37 V which helped to stabilize it. This was also two different kits of G.Skill Samsung based RAM so it does work at that speed but milage will vary from CPU to CPU

 

[bww794]

corsair's own website has its tech specs listed as tested at 3600mhz at 1.35v. Say I continue to run it at 3466 at 1.35v with an extremely cool internal case temp and good airflow, is there any need for that vengeance cooler that comes with the kit?

 

[Johan45]

No, the coolers are ver seldom needed, they look cool sometimes though.
When setting 3466, there's a preset in the memory section that works quite well if you haven't found it yet

 

[bww794]

good to know. Thanks!

 

[bww794]

update time! Flashed the bios last night - no change, but I'm not mad. Probably should have been done, issues or not, and now it is so one less thing.

After fooling with it last night and this morning, i have concluded that my issues ARE most likely memory related. I loaded optimized defaults in the bios and rebooted which brought the memory back to 2133 and supposedly 3.7ghz for the cpu, but it still says it's sitting at 4000mhz on the hardware monitor in the bios (HWMonitor application is not in agreement and shows 3698mhz+/-). I know something was failing to happen during startup because numerous times I would boot up and successfully make it to the desktop only to be greeted by a small popup down by the system tray telling me that Radeon Wattman had restored defaults due to an unexpected system failure.

I found in the bios where there are preset memory speed OC's for single sided samsung b die based on "fast" or "safe", but the same thing would happen. I'd boot it up, make it to the desktop and find that the memory was actually still running at 2133. So I said screw that and went with the DOCP standard as suggested and it immediately set me at 3600mhz with some additional changes to timing and some other things. I also went ahead and loaded the 4.0ghz OC built into the bios. The first bootup was successful and i launched a game and jumped right in... everything seemed fine. My sceptical side wanted to close all apps and reboot just to see if the stability was going to be consistent and wouldnt you know.... BSOD.

The DOCP Standard option had the voltage at 1.35 (as tested by corsair) but Johan45 suggested upping the DRAM Voltage to 1.37 even at 3466 just to make it stable so maybe that was the problem? Either way, here's where i currently stand: bios optimized defaults reloaded, cpu NOT oc'd, then DOCP standard loaded for RAM and then manually dropped back down a peg to 3466. CPU fan control set to PWM turbo preset, Chassis fan 2 fan control set to PWM silent preset. I wonder if it should be noted that the Evolv X has a built in fan hub into which i have 5x140mm BQ! silentwings 3 PWM fans plugged (2x front int, 2 top exh, 1 rear exh)? i used command prompt command "wmic memorychip get speed" to verify that its consistently booting up and running at the correct memory speed. Now im affraid to OC the cpu back to 4.0... at least with the oc built into the bios anyway.

I know i sound like a walking disaster, but 2 other things i want to bring up -
1. this morning i booted it up then immediately shut it down using the proper "Start>power>shutdown" method and i dont know if it's because the bootup and shutdown happened in such rapid succession or if something else is causing it, but it just hung there. Screen off, periphs off, PC still running and hdd light on mobo blinking as if it were still doing something. I didnt really see any other option than force shutdown. Any thoughts? Doesn't happen often.

2. with the weird behavior of the mouse and keyboard during startup, which seems to be slightly different each time, sometimes the keyboard will not register until AFTER the splash screen has passed making it impossible to have pressed DEL or F2 to get into the bios so i wind up having to restart the computer and try again. I feel like once the mobo recognizes the keyboard, it should stay there. Not drop it and register it a second time. Just things that might not bother the average person, but when you spend this kind of money for components reputed to be this "high end", you just kinda want it to work as advertised.... you know?

let me know if there's any other details needed. Thanks!

 

[Johan45]

That 4.0 GHz on defaults is picking up the Boost speed of the CPU and is normal.
Are the mouse and KB connected to a hub?