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Substitute for *Visiontek's* GeForce 4 Ti 4600 /w Epox 8KHA+

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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
Here's my future game machine rig [just need to choose what manufacturers for two of my items; i'll point out with stars]:

AMD Athlon XP 1900+
Epox 8KHA+
256MB Crucial Ram pc2100
***GeForce4 Ti 4600***
Soundblaster Audigy X-Gamer
***40GB HDD***

- i read a ton about Visiontek's problem being sitted in the Epox mobo i chose, but then i also heard that both manufacturers are modifying the capacitators to compensate. is their any online stores that actually label this change?
- has anyone oc'ed the Geforce4 Ti 4600 with much success? i have only read that many people are waiting for the 4200 and o/c it like crazy.

- i'm not sure how big a problem this may be, maybe none at all, that the Epox mobo and Crucial RAM may conflict b/c of something about -ECC-. i dunno what that is so i'm not sure how big of an issue it really is.
- everyone has WD harddrives, but i feel it is no longer reliable. i would like to know which manufacturers make a good 40gb hdd.

Thank you very much!
 

Arcane

Registered
Joined
Mar 18, 2002
if i were you i'd get the gainward ti4600 if you don't want visiontek...and IBM is a good hdd...as for o/cing the 4600 i got 320/735 and was able to run 3dmark demo looped for 2 days straight...i didn't notice much of a diff so i set it back to stock...i think i'll o/c this guy when games become more demanding...
 
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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
how much of a difference does 2mb cache buffer compared with 8mb do to performance? which manufacturers produce these except for Western Digital?
 

GoldenTiger

Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2002
Location
Connecticut
Actually, it is Epox's problem not Visiontek's. NONE of the GF4's fit on the 8kha+ due to the capacitator layout EXCEPT for Visiontek's modified model (kudos to them!). Epox made a capacitator next to the AGP slot out-of-spec and too tall, thus causing the problem. Since that's the board you have, you're stuck with that as your lone choice.

Larger HDD cache makes for better heavy disk activity such as video editting, but not too much else. As for a manufacturer if you don't like WD, go for Maxtor. Avoid IBM... they stink now.
 
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MadMan007

Magical Leopluridon Senior
Joined
Nov 28, 2001
Location
in a magical field
Seagate is another option for HDD. The barracuda IV is slightly slower than others, but is absolutely silent. If you have some case fans you will never even hear that HD. For slighty more speed, go for the Maxtor d740X
 

]-[itman

Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2001
Location
Arizona
The older IBM hdd's were really good, their newer ones are junk. I absolutely loved the 20gb one I bought not to long ago. Their 30 and 40 versions were good as well if I remember right, but I'm not positive. I'm not sure why you don't like WD anymore, but Maxtor and Seagate are 2 other good choices.
 
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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
y i don't like WD...

it's more my dad who despises them. he talks to his friends at work and all of them who tried them out, were faulty, one way or another.
maybe just the production in the bay area[west coast, USA] isn't so sharp.

Great, now IBM isn't reliable either?...well what i've read on the forums here and there, Maxtor has lil to no major problems it seems.

o and GoldenTiger, i don't have it yet actually, my sig sez "soon to be..." so i do have time to divert to another choice, but i've only heard good things about this board.
How do online stores/shops show that they have the NEW Visiontek VC?
I thought Epox were also correcting their boards [altho i don't know how those are labeled as being updated either]...?

i'm still in the fog about -ECC- ram sticks, registered and not registered...but crucial, i know, is very nice and i plan on buying a stick or two from them with that.
 
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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
and if anyone is interested about this :argue: GF4--Epox :argue: conflict, here's a link to the aoaforums.com where they explain more about it:

http://www.aoaforums.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=3560&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

but if u don't wanna read all the posts, this is a complete sum up [oxymoron?] of what Epox had to say about it:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"By case users has difficulty in installing VisionTek GF4 Ti4600 graphic card on EPoX EP-8KHA+ and EP-8KHA, the first solution will be removing the CE6 capacitor [this what's making ALL the fuss]. If users are not experienced in solder iron, they can use pliers to remove this component. If users are still confused with it or have any questions, they can contact any EPoX branch office in worldwide."

...

"Testing with some of the GeForce 4 Ti4600s in our labs has pointed to a problem in which your Ti 4600 card could potentially be damaged if inserted improperly or under force. We would advise all 8KHA(+) owners to use utmost caution when inserting video cards that match that description. Also after testing, we have concluded that there is no significant problem or issue with the motherboard capacitor and the video card capacitor touching. If you own an EPoX 8KHA(+) and it has a definite conflict in which you can not insert your video card there are several solutions available. The preferred solution is to contact your nearest EPoX location. The other solution is to take it to a certified computer technician where they can remove the offending capacitor. It is not recommended that you do this procedure yourself since if done incorrectly it could damage your motherboard and/or your own safety.


We are currently working with manufacturers that do not have this issue and will promote heavily and give all of our EPoX users a chance to buy a G Force 4 Ti 4600 at a lower price."
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

...if anyone would like to comment... :D
 

GoldenTiger

Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2002
Location
Connecticut
Re: y i don't like WD...

13rian said:
it's more my dad who despises them. he talks to his friends at work and all of them who tried them out, were faulty, one way or another.
maybe just the production in the bay area[west coast, USA] isn't so sharp.

Great, now IBM isn't reliable either?...well what i've read on the forums here and there, Maxtor has lil to no major problems it seems.

o and GoldenTiger, i don't have it yet actually, my sig sez "soon to be..." so i do have time to divert to another choice, but i've only heard good things about this board.
How do online stores/shops show that they have the NEW Visiontek VC?
I thought Epox were also correcting their boards [altho i don't know how those are labeled as being updated either]...?

i'm still in the fog about -ECC- ram sticks, registered and not registered...but crucial, i know, is very nice and i plan on buying a stick or two from them with that.

Nope, they're not reliable at all anymore (see 60gxp and 75gxp, as well as IBM's response of "don't run drives more than 4 hours in any 24 hour period, our drives aren't designed for that").

RAM: You only need registered for 4-dimm-slot boards to use all four slots at once. Otherwise, it isn't needed at all. Don't spend the extra money needlessly.

Motherboard: Play it safe and get an Iwill XP333 or XP333-R. It has the same performance level as a KT266A, has voltage adjustments up to 2.035v for vcore and 2.8v for memory, FSB guaranteed to 166mhz ("ddr333 compatibility"), great BIOS, 5 PCI, onboard audio that is sb-live quality, great board layout, 3 DIMM slots, a USB header, and TONS of other goodies, not to mention ATA133 on the RAID model, plus no via chipset issues like sblive/8233 and PCI latency under RAID issues. I wouldn't get an 8kha+... more expensive, no goodies, capacitator issue being out-of-agp2.0 spec (hardocp and firingsquad checked documents and measured it out...), and it is an aging board. Don't get me wrong, the 8kha+ is an excellent board, but it is old and can't stand up to newer offerings such as the XP333/R, plus it has the KT266A's pci latency issues which were of especial importance to me when I was deciding a few months ago since I do video editting/capturing. There simply are better options at this point than that board.

GF4 ti4x00 line capacitator (this affects all brands, all models... they ALL are based on the reference design and have the same capacitator layout except for visiontek who is shrinking some of theirs, no others are doing that special measure though): The ONLY card that is guaranteed to fit is a new Visiontek with the smaller caps. There is no way to know what's in the box, though... mine, shipped March 29th from Gateway, had a couple of smaller caps but they none of them was the one that hits the Epox's out-of-spec capacitator. I've seen pictures of a few various revisions, one of which would work on the Epox board. Do yourself a favor and just shy away from the 8kha+ so you don't get disappointed when the card that comes turns out to be one that won't fit. There's no way to know, and vendors you call or email aren't likely to open the shrinkwrapped boxes and check, much less know the exact capacitator that poses the issue in the first place.


Sorry for the big text hunks :). You'll have to live without any more than major defining paragraphs :D!
 

GoldenTiger

Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2002
Location
Connecticut
MadMan007 said:
Seagate is another option for HDD. The barracuda IV is slightly slower than others, but is absolutely silent. If you have some case fans you will never even hear that HD. For slighty more speed, go for the Maxtor d740X

Heh, I forgot about the seagate. It is indeed a good option as well :).
 
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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
oyh crap. i'll have to do a LO-ha-OT[lot] more research now if the 8kha+ is really starting to go extinct, but basically i want a nice stable, easily o/c-able rig that will harness the XP 1900+ chip...

changing the mobo would change quite a few of my items on the list [hard drive maybe...ram been thinking of changing anyways].

jeebus, would it just be easier if i left a thread open askin, "best stuff for xp 1900+?"

but as of now, this is the status of my future components:

mobo: 1st thing i need to find out
cpu: athlon xp 1900+
Sound Card: Turtle Beach Santa Cruz
Video Card: GeForce Ti4600 128MB DDR [Visiontek or most likely Gainward gold pack]
ram: crucial [2 * 256mb DDR or 1* 512mb DDR pc????]
HDD: Maxtor [research seagate when i have time] [40+GB capacity]
Other Peripherals: strip from my current comp sytem

i'd like to make a final decision by next weekend hopefully, so i hope i'll have time to research during the week.
 

]-[itman

Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2001
Location
Arizona
I wouldn't quite say extinct, just not king of the hill. Basically, the 266A chipset will become like the 133 chipset is. With a new mobo, you'll have your pick of manufactuers for the 4600. I can tell you that I absolutely loved my Visiontek GeForce2 Ti I had. I got a very good overclock(about 70 pts less than the top score on our 3dmark team, granted there's only one more but, well I think you get what I'm saying) I wasn't done with that card either. I KNOW i could have reached 5900 if not 6000 with that card if I hadn't sold the system. Anyway, I haven't had any experience with Gainward or Leadtek, but I've heard very good reviews of those cards as well. The ECC thing s the Error Checking of the RAM(can't remember what it stands for exactly but it's something like Error Code Checking). It used to be very important but now a days, RAM is a lot more reliable than it used to be. I wouldn't worry about it. That's a great soundcard and crucial is highly recommended(They're developing a new pc2700 model but I don't know when it will be out) I was able to hit 255fsb with default RAM voltage and all the RAM timings maxed out. Maxtor is a good choice but Seagate does deserve some research. I would suggest buying 1 stick of 512mb RAM to help overclocking. As far as mobo goes, the IWILL has a 333 version out but others due as well. You can post in the AMD motherboard section to get the best answers;)
 
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13rian

Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2002
yes, and i have. all this research is a lot of work, but i know it will be worth it once i boot up my gaming machine! :p :p