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Think "Zen" will affect intel's pricing scheme?

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bob4933

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2014
For quite a long time, intel's prices on their cpu's have been pretty stagnant. An i3 is a bit over 100$, an i5 is a bit over 200$, and an i7 is right around 300$.

Im seeing prices on the Zen processors that are making me :shock:. The 4 core/ 8 thread variant is purported to be roughly 150$. Even if its "slightly slower" (i.e. 4790k speeds), then what would be the purpose of getting an i5, much less an i7.... The 8 core/ 16 thread is speculated to be less than 300$, which again, why would you get an I7-x processor?

Think Intel will break the mold finally? We saw some pretty interesting sales on intel chips on black friday. 279$ for an i7 6700k, 350$ for a 6850k. I am somewhat convinced that is indicative of things to come, as I dont recall intel ever discounting their enthusiast platform chips that far.
 

Alaric

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Dec 4, 2011
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I think Intel's profit margins are going to take a big hit after 1/17. Provided AMD's new chip matches the hype, they are poised to be a major player in the top end again. I don't think Intel has anything in the offing to beat it in any significant fashion, either. 6700ks could end up going for bargain prices, just to keep sales away from AMD. Attrition is a game Intel can afford to play longer than AMD, so it could get interesting. Good times for enthusiasts! :)
 

EarthDog

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Dec 15, 2008
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I mentioned it in the already existing zen thread... but yes it will IF:

It has Haswell like IPC AND clockspeeds are close. I've seen the rumored pricing and if it's true, I'm not sure Intel will have much of a choice.
 

mackerel

Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2008
I don't think we have good enough understanding of Zen performance and pricing to make any solid conclusions here. My prediction remains that in some mainstream areas it will be Haswell/Broadwell-like, but in other areas it will still be worse than Intel as far as IPC is concerned, although I hope I'm wrong on one specific part of that.

If we make an assumption here, that Zen turned out identical to Kaby Lake in IPC. I'm not saying this is the case, but just for pricing argument. So some Zen 4 core was identical in performance to a 7700k, what would it be priced at? Lower than Intel. You might think, same performance, same price, but Intel have the branding which AMD doesn't. Simple as that. Like for like, Intel will be able to charge more and get away with it. AMD do not have that luxury. Even considering such, if rumours of a much lower pricing are true, it might be indicative of lower performance.

AMD might have indirect benefits, where I've not looked in detail. My understanding was that more was moved on CPU, so maybe mobos can be simpler and cost less (like for like).

Or look at it another way. It isn't a question if Intel will have to adjust pricing, it is how much. AMD don't want to give Zen away, but they still have to undercut Intel if they have any hopes of sales volume. Intel could make it uncomfortable for them if they decide to react. Intel not dropping price is probably better for AMD in the short term, as AMD is going to come out worse in a price war.
 

EarthDog

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I don't think we have good enough understanding of Zen performance and pricing to make any solid conclusions here
Figured that was understood, LOL! Its not released yet and these are only our guesses based off of rumored IPC performance and pricing.

Nobody has said Zen will by Skylake/KL like in IPC. What we have seen is that it looks to be on par with Haswell. What we haven't seen are the clockspeeds. AMD's demo showed it clocked at 3Ghz, which if true, is LOW compared to intel chips, clearly. My thinking, as mentioned above, Zen needs to hit close to 4Ghz or over and have that Haswell IPC to go along with it.

I agree whole heartedly its not even a question of if, but how much.
 

Janus67

Benching Team Leader
Joined
May 29, 2005
Agreed with that, and what, if anything, can/will they be able to do to break into the OEM (Dell/HP/Lenovo) market in a large enough fashion to matter?
 

dejo

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Joined
Nov 11, 2001
Hopefully they can at least manage relevance! If they can achieve that, then they can work their way into the conversation on an overall competitive equality
 
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bob4933

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Jan 3, 2014
Still rumors....

Well its being released tomorrow, I think *some* of these rumours should start to hold credence at this point.

But then again, the msrp rumours of the nvidia and 480 cards were SPOT ON, but look at that price gouging :(
 

EarthDog

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Sure! But still rumors. There is will be an asterisk at the end of every post until release.....tomorrow. :rofl:
 

mackerel

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Mar 7, 2008
Let's see how much they actually tell us... it is possible for them to say a lot without conveying useful information.
 
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bob4933

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Jan 3, 2014
I think the pricing rumours will prove accurate ****

That said, I am firmly confident demand will be so freaking high that that miracle "150$" i7 crusher is going to wind up in the 250-275$ category anyway. Dubious at best.
 

Mr.Scott

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Jun 9, 2013
Intel will not drop pricing on a potential one and done. They have more than enough resources to just sit back and watch for a while. AMD is not going to march right in and steal any major market share assuming Zen is decent. It takes time to rid old memories and market new product with it's own identity.
 
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bob4933

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Jan 3, 2014
Intel will not drop pricing on a potential one and done. They have more than enough resources to just sit back and watch for a while. AMD is not going to march right in and steal any major market share assuming Zen is decent. It takes time to rid old memories and market new product with it's own identity.

Brand loyalty doesn't appear to be strong enough in the evolving pc market to deny the appeal of true performance. If a Zen 4c/8t gives 4790k performance (Which is 95% as good as skylake) for 150$, its going to be extremely difficult to deny that appeal. Die hard intel fan or not, your wallet typically sways which side of the fence you're on.

I am more curious how the OEM market is going play out. 16c/32t workstation cpu for a few hundred bucks feels incredibly appealing as well.
 

Mr.Scott

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Brand loyalty doesn't appear to be strong enough in the evolving pc market to deny the appeal of true performance. If a Zen 4c/8t gives 4790k performance (Which is 95% as good as skylake) for 150$, its going to be extremely difficult to deny that appeal. Die hard intel fan or not, your wallet typically sways which side of the fence you're on.
I'll counter your post using Nvidia as an example. Nvidia cards sell 4 to 1 over AMD even if the AMD card is less expensive and performs close to the same or better than the equivalent Nvidia card. Still a fact to this day. See the 480 vs. 1060 thread. ;)
Brand loyalty is stronger than you think.
 
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wingman99

Member
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Dec 10, 2003
I believe Intel will not decrease the price of kaby lake and there will be a increase do to manufacturing cost. AMD is going to have great prices and performance. That is my prediction.:D
 

Woomack

Benching Team Leader
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Jan 2, 2005
I also don't think that Zen will affect Intel prices in any way. Maybe sales will drop but not price. Intel has too big % of the market and really they don't care about AMD. The same as Nvidia already doesn't care about AMD and they set higher prices each new generation. AMD is following them and because of that they lost a lot with series like Fury. Too high price, not enough users trust and barely any sales.
 

EarthDog

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I honestly feel there is more brand loyalty for the underdog than there is for the front runner. I think where we are really going to see the price drops are in the HEDT platform more so than KL. Since KL is brand spanking new, I don't see it being discounted soon, but your 6800K on up I bet will drop... again depending on haswell like IPC and clocks. If either of those two aren't there, they won't touch prices.
 

Woomack

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Jan 2, 2005
Only gamers and enthusiasts still wait for AMD and not even so many as it was couple of years ago. HEDT is recently dedicated more as workstation than gaming platform and for work barely anyone is buying AMD. I just see that people don't trust AMD anymore and for most it's just a toy. When they want good platform for work then they pick Intel and they don't care if it costs more ( well, there are limits ).
It's not only because of processors but because motherboard manufacturers are designing much worse motherboards based on AMD chipsets than on Intel. There is also much worse support for AMD platforms.
Overclockers and enthusiasts see other things. On OCF many members will buy Zen because they want "new toy" but their main platform will be still Intel.