just grabbed a ti 200(didnt have anything better at the time) from a best buy for fun. nice card an all but i'm use to ati's image quality and the textures look a bit washed out on the geforce 3. Mainly i need OGL performance and the g3 seems to lack it a little. I'm using the 23.11's and riva tuner. runs stable at 230/500 so far. i know the core is about maxed, might do 235. will do 240 but artifacts and locks up in 3dmark 2k1. ram will do 560 but locks up like above. 550 locks too, so i just dropped it to 500 for now. I saw some 8500LE's, 128mb there, was thinking about getting one. Might go back 2morrow and get it, but i'm wondering if it'll be worth it. I hear i can get 300/300 outa the LE, my question is are the drivers ROCK SOLID. meaning no crashes. I'm not looking to grab that extra 1% outa it by screwing with it. I just need somthing good in OGL and can do 4x fsaa or smoothvision or whatever its called for the 8500. I've noticed with the G3 that with 4x fsaa on it looks good but the 2d looks like crap, ie scope in UT on sniper rifle. and by default ati cards look like they have less jaggies.