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Tripp Lite SUPER7 $19.99 Surge Suppressor Protector 150V Clamping V 2160 Joules

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c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Tripp Lite SUPER7 $19.99 Surge Suppressor:
https://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/accessories/apd/a0009015


$19.99 - possibly 10% cashback on click through sites.... and 5% cashback on Paypal through Chase and there should be a additional extra 5% Chase Dell offer valid for another three days.

Free Shipping

Lifetime warranty with $75,000 Ultimate Lifetime Insurance
Clamping level: 150 V RMS
Certified to meet strict UL standards

Lower Clamping voltage is better - it's hard to find one with a legit certified 150V Clamping Voltage.

Tripp Lite says 2160 Joules, though Dell site says 2350 Joules
https://www.tripplite.com/protect-i...or-7-ft-cord-2160-joules-white-housing~super7
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
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lol, I saw this the day you posted your other thread.. but left it alone... I have three of the Super7's.

I don't think you'll find "legit certified" 150V CV because the lowest UL tests is 330 (400/500/600 are the UL ratings IIRC). that is the certification body so is the only 'legit' one to me personally. Many companies make claims...and that may be legit in their testing (however they test), but the governing body only certifies as low as 330V). Unless it's 3rd party verified, I consider it marketing.

Worth noting is when you look at the specs for the device in this thread and the one in your original...at the Tripp Lite site, the specifications claim 330/400/400 on the three different values 'let through/CV' voltages.

As far as looking into this (your other thread covering surge protectors), I don't really. I looked for the lowest UL cert and highest joules with a reasonable price (knowing 330 is the lowest and I want at least 1000 joules). I also have homeowners insurance which covers these items in case of an accident so I don't go too deep down the well. :cool:
 
OP
c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
For years I've participated in threads about this and I think they were unnecessarily complicated.

My understanding now is that you look at the Clamping Voltage *first* - then the Joule rating.

And that means companies with UL certification labels, not companies just 'saying so'.

Tripp Lite itself is a reputable company which has models with 150V CV and modules with 800V CV [lower is better].

The internet agrees you should not get a model with CV higher than 330V, but the internet is unclear if 800V models are useless even if their Joule rating is 3,000.

So with Tripp Lite, you know their low Clamping Voltage is legit, and then after that Joule rating comes into play and that's when it's unclear how much of a difference 3000 Joules makes over 2160 Joules.

Or 1500 J vs. 2160 J, in real life. That's what I'd like to know.
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
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Location
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So with Tripp Lite, you know their low Clamping Voltage is legit,
I'm not trying to be dense here, but how if it isn't UL certified? Is there anything else besides a quote from a CSR that shows 150V? Again, look at the specs pages at the TL website for both of these devices... they say 330/400/400.

Also, I read that 150V is almost too low and in some cases can cause tripping you don't want. No idea if that's really true though.

The internet I'm on (lol) says to get something 400 or less (so 400 or 330)... the lower the better, indeed.


FWIW.....
UL 1449 Voltage Let-through Ratings (500, 400 & 330)
Underwriter Laboratories tests each Surge Suppressor and rates them according to the amount of voltage
they "let-through" to your equipment. The lower the let-through voltage, the better the surge suppressor.
UL established the 330-volt let-through as the benchmark because lower ratings did not add significantly
to equipment protection.

That said, I'd stick to a UL Rated 330 and as high of joules as you want to afford. If you find one with a lower rating... it isn't UL certified, so who knows what it is, and more importantly, under what circumstances... I really think the difference between these surge suppressors is a matter of $4 and the protection is going to be similar. A direct strike is going to smoke what's plugged in.

Anyhoo.. had these for some time now... and I gues they do the job... but, I'm also in stable power town suburbia so I've got pretty clean power in the first place. Thanks for posting the deals. :thup:
 
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c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Source: arstechnica

We often rely on UL's certification, and all the devices we picked have passed UL testing. However, UL certifies surge protectors at multiple levels, and some, like the Tripp Lite TLP1008TEL, are certified at a less stringent 400-volt let-through rating. Tripp Lite's own specs for this model, however, list 150 volts of let-through (320 volts total) as its actual clamping voltage level, and we were able to confirm that in testing. Though we'd prefer the UL rating to be in line with the claimed clamping voltage, we're comfortable that our testing confirmed it.

Proof:
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...-surge-protector-for-your-home-electronics/2/
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
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Location
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I saw that article too. :)

So help me out, kindly. Where on the product pages does tripplight mention 150V? If I do a search on the product page, there are three occurrences for "150"... all of which correspond to a $150,000 figure.

Also, what is the relevance on the "(320V total)" mention? If the value is 150V... why do they clarify 320V total? Am I(we?) missing something on that UL1449 standard/understanding it?
 
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c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Yes, gladly and let's see together:
On this Tripp Lite official page I see these words:
SUPPRESSION: AC: 150V RMS Clamping/2160 joules/330V L-G, 400V L-N, 400V N-G UL1449 3rd Edition
https://www.tripplite.com/protect-i...d-2160-joules-tel-modem-protection~tlp1208tel

When contacted, Tripp Lite officially responds in writing about other models using the same "150V RMS clamping" terminology. So that would address the occurrence of the term 150V in an official setting.


Now the big picture: I want them to have 330V or 400V but not higher. ANY figure below that from a reputable company like Tripp Lite tells me the Power Surge Protector is the real deal, unlike many (many) others. So to me, as long as a Tripp Lite is at or bellow the 330V-400V range - it is okay.


Now let's turn to this: Tripp Lite has an 800V model. I have it.
Tripp Lite TLP128TTUSBB
4320 Joules ; Clamping Voltage 800 V
https://www.tripplite.com/protect-it-12-outlet-surge-protector-8-ft-tel-fax-modem-coax~tlp128ttusbb

So now what is going on!?
I am on a mission to try to clarify how useless is that model?
If at 800V it will be too late for its gigantic 4320 Joule rating to even matter?
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
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Location
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If at 800V it will be too late for its gigantic 4320 Joule rating to even matter?
Good question.

I suppose this will go unanswered...
what is the relevance on the "(320V total)" mention? If the value is 150V... why do they clarify 320V total?
Where's JR? :p

EDIT: After looking at your link more closely, that is neither of the devices in the thread(s), but a different model that actually says as much..right?
 
OP
c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Yes, Tripp Lite has models with varying Clamping Voltages.
Their best are 150V RMS Clamping - all the ones I posted are verified by Tripp Lite to be "150V RMS Clamping".

Then I made a point that to me, it makes no difference if they are 150V or 330V/400V, as long as they are not over.
In other words, it's okay if they are 150V and it's okay if they are in three hundreds, both are great!

And then most importantly, Tripp Lite ALSO has 800V Clamping Voltage models. Not the ones I posted. The ones I posted are 330V or lower - just great.
It's those other models that I feel are more comparable to various say, Belkin models, with high Clamping Voltage ratings.



Now THEY are the ones that need clarification. What happens when we have a 500V or 800V clamping voltage model!?
Specifically if CV is that high - does it even matter what their Joule rating is, do 4,000 Joules matter if CV is high?

So again, in conclusion, the Clamping Voltages on models I posted are just fine whether they are 150V or 330V.
But what is questionable is what happens with models with 800V CV.
 
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c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Tripp Lite, I have it in my comparison notes, I can try to look for where Tripp Lite posted that.
There are Tripp Lite models with higher CVs, but Super7 is one of the good ones.

- - - Inserted PDF - - -

If Super7Coax is the same model as Super7 without Coax then Clamping voltage (RMS) 150V is listed in this Tripp Lite pdf:
Tripp Lite SUPER7COAX.pdf
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
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Location
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I have these same questions...

https://www.electriciantalk.com/thr...clamping-voltage-on-a-surge-protector.278244/

Unfortunately, my high school actually had a really horrible physics teacher and we literally learned nothing about circuits. Doubly unfortunate is that I regularly work with electricians for my job so I'm always trying to learn this stuff from the web which isn't always the best way.

Anyway, this might sound like a stupid question but what is the exact definition of the clamping voltage on a surge protector? What is the exact definition of the let-through voltage?

I ask this question because there seem to be different definitions of these two simple terms online. My two additional questions still deal with figuring out what clamping voltage is.

On the below website, the two terms appear to be defined to be almost the same. The let-through voltage rating equals the total voltage allowed to reach your equipment, taking into account: surge suppression, noise reduction, and line conditioning.

people.richland.edu/dkirby/172surgesuppressors.htm

On many websites, "experts" agree with the definitions of these 2 words. Look at: zerosurge.com/glossary/

However, in the article below, it's defined slightly differently. The clamping voltage is the voltage in which the MOV clamps and so is the voltage that is allowed to reach your plugged-in device. But, let-through voltage is the difference between the clamping voltage and the peak of the nominal AC voltage of the power line (which is about 170V). (Look at the first sentence in the second paragraph.)

arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/06/from-the-wirecutter-the-best-surge-protector-for-your-home-electronics/2/

Is the writer of this article totally wrong about what let-through voltage is?

However, Tripp Lite seems to define clamping voltage (RMS) totally differently. In Tripp Lite's technical specifications (link below) for most of their surge protectors, the clamping voltage (RMS) is stated to be 150V. It appears that they are incorrectly defining the clamping voltage to be the difference between the voltage when the MOV clamps and the peak of the nominal AC voltage (170V). In other words, the MOV clamps at 320V (170V + 150V).

tripplite.com/protect-it-12-outlet-surge-protector-8-ft-cord-2880-joules-tel-modem-coaxial-ethernet-protection~TLP1208SAT

Strangely, in the white paper below by Tripp Lite, it seems to define clamping voltage and let-through voltage correctly this time, sort of stating that the two terms are the same thing. It's not really clear. (Look at the bottom paragraph on page 6.)

assets.tripplite.com/white-paper/how-to-choose-the-right-surge-protector-white-paper-en.pdf

EDIT: This is what I was trying to say above about the 320V... so... yes, Tripplight 'tested it', but there's someone asking why their rating is different than the rest and wondering about the two clamping points. I think in the end, even if these are 330V clamping, they'll still do the job. But I wouldn't buy these for the "150V" rating that's being touted until there's some additional clarification. :thup:
 
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c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
EarthDog, this arstechnica forum reply to me accurately sums up everything I ever saw on this topic in the last twenty years:

"I think a lot of us here are fatigued from previous discussion threads about surge protectors. The way they work is not as obvious as the marketing department's joule numbers would indicate, and it's too easy for people to take some basic electronics knowledge and assume too much.

If you don't know specifically what you're doing, read the instructions that came with your UPS and surge protectors and follow them, obeying all safety-related information from each."



Nobody really knows is what arstechnica forums reply says.


I was never stuck on 150V personally, it was always about if the company is reliable enough to be trusted that it's 330V or less.
I think Tripp Lite is one of the rare companies which have consistently come up in discussions everywhere as reliable.



Another proof, reply to me last night on All About Circuits:

AllAboutCircuitsTrippLite.jpg



I think I'd like to simplify things and maybe just try to see if we can express opinions on this simple choice of two:
IF YOUR CHOICE IS ONLY THESE TWO, and they cost the same, which would you pick to connect your expensive OLED TV and stereo system to and why?


• Exhibit A is the model of this thread topic:
Tripp Lite SUPER7 with 150V RMS to 330V Clamping Voltage and 2160 Joule Rating
https://www.tripplite.com/protect-i...or-7-ft-cord-2160-joules-white-housing~super7

• Exhibit B's Tripp Lite TLP128TTUSBB with 800V Clamping Voltage and 4320 Joule Rating
https://www.tripplite.com/protect-it-12-outlet-surge-protector-8-ft-tel-fax-modem-coax~tlp128ttusbb

Exhibit B costs 50%+ more but for the purposes of equal comparison, assume they both cost the same.
 

EarthDog

Gulper Nozzle Co-Owner
Joined
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Location
Buckeyes!
EarthDog, this arstechnica forum reply to me accurately sums up everything I ever saw on this topic in the last twenty years:
Pretty sure I said that about marketing and lightning earlier. :p

But yeah, you're preaching to the choir. I just find that 150V number to be a bit confusing if a bit disingenuous because of how they list it. The bottom line is that 330V is better than 800V (or 600V or 400V) and is the 'best' rating from UL. In other words, look for UL1449 certs at or under 400. The higher the joules the better and don't forget.....
A direct strike is going to smoke what's plugged in.

IF YOUR CHOICE IS ONLY THESE TWO, and they cost the same, which would you pick to connect your expensive OLED TV and stereo system to and why?
Well, I connect to the Tripp7 at 330/2360?. So I guess that answers that. How much more or less or w/e... we can't quantify.
 
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c627627

c627627

c(n*199780) Senior Member
Joined
Feb 18, 2002
Either that or ["Quick, remove it, EarthDog's on to us..."]
 

JrClocker

AKA: JrMiyagi
Joined
Sep 25, 2015
Where's JR? :p

He has a job, and has been avoiding being sucked into another over analysis, deep dive into something that I already commented on before! :p


1. The electronics in your house won't survive a direct (or even adjacent) lightning strike...this is not what surge suppressors are for (this is what home owner's insurance is for)

2. Surge suppressors are meant to defend against "dirty power"

3. Dirty power be caused by a number of things
- Dirty from the utility: highly unlikely
- Transients caused by large loads turning on/off that are on the line (not in your house): highly unlikely
- Transients caused when power is restored after a power outage: likely
- Transients caused by large loads turning on/off in your house: likely
--- Large loads are anything with a large motor (inductive load): pool pumps, AC compressors, freezers, and old refrigerators
- Transients caused by solar flairs: highly unlikely, but basically you are screwed

If your lights momentarily flicker when your AC or pool pump kicks on, you have transients at your house.

If your lights momentarily flicker when nothing is going on at your house, then this is caused by the utility.


The most common cause of electronics damage is under/over voltage for the power coming into your house. Under/Over voltage is anything outside of 110-127 V range (in the US). Sustained (a few seconds or more) of under/over voltage can cause serious damage to electronics...under voltage causes increased current draw in the power supply section, over voltage can damage voltage limiting devices in the power supply.

The power grid is one large interconnected electric circuit.

What causes under voltage?
- Too heavy of a current load (real power) on the power system...as the load approaches maximum for the generator, the voltage will decrease
- Too heavy of a current load (reactive power) on the power system...the utility will lower the voltage ON PURPOSE to reduce the VARs circulating in the system
- A solar farm dropping output due to unexpected solar energy decrease (i.e. clouds)
- A wind farm dropping output due to unexpected wind energy decrease (i.e. the wind slows down or stops)
- Generators losing frequency lock

What causes over voltage?
- If a large load suddenly disappears
- Generators losing frequency lock

It takes the utility a few cycles to compensate for any of these conditions. We are pretty much beyond the era of extended over/under voltage for long periods of time. However, even these few cycles can damage electronics.

Another new technology introduced into the power grid is a "recloser"...this device will cycle power a few times trying to "burn off" what caused a fault (i.e. short circuit) on a power line. If these devices are in your area, you will notice something like the following when power is going to go out:

- power clicks off for a second or two, then clicks on
--- if the fault is cleared, power delivery resumes
- power clicks off for 5 to 10 seconds, then clicks on
--- if the fault is cleared, power delivery resumes
- one more try with a longer outage
--- if the fault is not clear, trip the circuit

A surge suppressor will not protect you from over voltage, under voltage, or recloser power cycling.

As stated above, your BEST protection is a good UPS...pure sinewave output...that will protect you from over/under voltage conditions.