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Trying for 3.8ghz and BSOD Stop: 0x124...

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ZealEngine

Registered
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Trying for 3.8ghz - think vcore dipping under load is problem!

So I have the following machine...

Asus M4A79XTD MB
AMD PH II X4 955 3.2ghz BE
Sunbeam freezer with AS5
Saphire Radeon 4890
4gb Gskill PC 1600 DDR3
2x 1 TB Seagate HD (Raid 1)
Antec 300 case with extra fans (all air exiting the case is cool)
500w Thermaltake psu
Windows 7 pro 64

Works great at 200x18 cpu 1.45v, prime 95 stable for 8+ hours. But if I up to 18.5, prime 95 crashes in a matter of minutes, I get a garbled video flash, then a bsod with STOP: 0x00000124 error.

One idea - I googled the 124 error and came up with this..

http://groups.google.com/group/micr...2424dfea394/f90096518a4eab5a#f90096518a4eab5a

However here is the problem - in my bios non of my two hds are detected. SATA pots 1 and 2 say "Not Detected", is this normal for a Raid 1 setup (I sure hope so)? I mean clearly the raid array is working (Asus Raid Expert utility shows both disks as part of one logical disk). Just for fun I checked the settings for these "Not Detected" ports, and "32 bit HD Access" IS in fact enabled, so maybe there is nothing to worry about here?

Only other odd things I noticed in bios - even though I am set to cpu 1.45v, bios reports only 1.431v (could my problem be a simple matter of me not giving my cpu enough juice?). Also I remembered turning on this "Anti Surgy Support" feature, but I never had any clue what it did/does. Should I turn it off?

Been banging my head against the wall for days. I have tried every combination of cpu/nb voltage, nothing seems to work. Any ideas?

* Here are my current bios settings...

cpu bus freq - 200
pcie freq 100

cpu ratio - 18.5
cpu/nb freq - 2400hz
cpu voltage - 1.45v
cpu/nb voltage - 1.3v
cpu vdda volt - AUTO

HT linkspeed - 2200hz
HT linkwidth - AUTO
HT Volt - AUTO

DRAM freq - 1333hz
DRAM Volt - 1.5v
(under timings there were dozens of settings, however I set the traditional CL, tRCD, tRP and tRAS to 9-9-9-24)

NB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.1v)
NB 1.8v - AUTO
SB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.35v, which is max... odd)

*The above crashes with the bsod x124 in 3 minutes of prime95. Bump the multiplier down to x18 and it is solid as a rock.
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
Ok I think I have identified my problem. A couple times I tried pushing my cpu voltage past 1.45v, and noticed prime95 would last longer at 200x18.5 (I think onetime I got it to go for an hour straight at something like 1.465v). I have also read that this STOP:124 error is related to low vcore. And finally, I am noticing amd overdrive report that vcore is dipping from 1.45v idle, to 1.4 when I launch prime 95.

So long story short, I think my problem is vcore. More specifically, my vcore dropping below 1.45 when under load. So the question is, how do we fix this? I have read that the "CPU VDDA" setting in bios is designed to 'kick in extra power under load', but I have been unable to confirm this.

(I just tried setting cpu vdda to 2.7, and amd overdrive STILL reported my voltage dipping from 1.45v to 1.4v under load... what the hell)

*just noticed amd overdrive has a voltage slider for something called "CPU Extra-OV", which is set to 0.0v. And oddly enough I dont see ANYTHING like that in my bios, so god only knows how it works... sounds like what I need though...
 
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QuietIce

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May 7, 2006
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Anywhere but there
The drop in voltage between idle and load is called vDroop and almost all motherboards have this to some extent. While 0.05v (I assume when you say 1.4v you mean 1.40v?) is a little much it's still (barely) within what I would call "normal" for a quad. Nothing wrong with increasing your vCore as long as you stay below 1.55v (actual at idle) and 55°C CPU core temperature under load ... :)

Prime95
OCCT
CoreTemp
 
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Parad0x420

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Jun 22, 2007
Location
Dark Side of the Moon
You should be able to go higher than 1.46v to the CPU, most BIOS should be able to go 1.55v and higher. Is there any option for Vdroop in your BIOS? I think that is the setting that will compensate for the slight drop in vcore during load if it's increased. But I think you may just need bump the vcore a little more.
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
Well last night I bumped the cpu voltage to 1.4875v (it dipped to 1.45-1.44v under load), and at first I crashed withing 3 minutes. I then realized I still had my nb and ht at 2400/2200, so I set them both back to 2000/2000, and then I was able to run prime95 for over an hour (for the first time ever at 200x18.5x). Got kinda hot though (would idle around 40-42, and load around 55c). However if that is the MAX load under prime95, I am not too worried (since 'normal' apps will NEVER put that much strain on the cpu). Plus turning cool'nquiet back on should help when idling.

So I guess this is proof that what my system needed all along was more vcore, so that leads me to believe the only thing that will help when trying for 200x19 is even MORE vcore... Is it safe to bump to 1.5v JUST to get 3.8ghz?

*one interesting thing I noticed in bios, it only reports my vcore at 1.46v, so maybe it isnt really running as high as we think? And no I could not find a 'vdroop' option in my bios.
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
Well I havent been having any luck getting to 200x19, here is the highest stable settings I have found thus far...

cpu bus freq - 200
pcie freq 100

cpu ratio - 18.5
cpu/nb freq - 2400hz
cpu voltage - 1.4875v
cpu/nb voltage - 1.175v
cpu vdda volt - 2.7v (not sure if this is doing anything)

HT linkspeed - 2000hz
HT linkwidth - AUTO
HT Volt - AUTO

DRAM freq - 1333hz
DRAM Volt - 1.5v
(under timings there were dozens of settings, however I set the traditional CL, tRCD, tRP and tRAS to 9-9-9-24)

NB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.1v)
NB 1.8v - AUTO
SB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.35v, which is max... odd)

The above runs prim95 for hours on end, maxing out around 55c. If I bump to 200x19 I crash within 2 minutes.

Another intersting thing I noticed - the above settings are stable, but if I bump the HT freq to 2000hz I crash in a matter of minutes. I wonder if I should try increasing the ht voltage? Or are we sure a 2000hz ht is 'fast enough' and wont be a bottleneck? What all does the HT talk to anyway?
 

jlc4892

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Dec 16, 2009
Same deal here man, I have been trying for a while to get it past 4.0 and it just wont go.
 

QuietIce

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If you're not running Crossfire/SLI then that HT Link speed is plenty.


The HT Link carries all the data to/from the CPU except RAM data, which goes straight from the CPU to RAM. Even 1600 MHz is enough for most video cards because there simply isn't enough data to overload the Link as long as it's only one card ...
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
The HT Link carries all the data to/from the CPU except RAM data

Wait, so what ELSE does the HT control? It sounds like youre saying its SOLE purpose is to bus data to/from the graphics card? And if that is the case, what the hell is the pci express bus for? And why is it (the pcie express bus) only at 100hz? Wont that cause a bottleneck with a 2000hz HT?

In anycase, can you explain why it would cause my machine to bsod when set to 2200hz at 200x18.5 vcore 1.4875v, yet works fine when running at 200x18 vcore 1.45v?
 

QuietIce

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OK, I'll say it another way. The HT Link is the data path for everything in your system except RAM but since video takes up the biggest portion of the Link's bandwidth that's what most people are concerned with. HDDs, DVDs, and all the other peripherals are a small (but very important!) part of the data flow. The video portion of PCIe ties into the HT Link at the NB chipset (not to be confused with the cpuNB on the processor) while all other components tie in at the SB chipset.

The CPU, and more specifically the cpuNB, has to balance data coming from the cores, RAM, L3 cache, and the HT Link - all of which operate at different speeds. Changing the speed of any one component changes that balance putting more or less stress on the cpuNB.


Sorry, I don't happen to have a system graphic of the 790FX but the 790GX shown here is similar ...
 

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ZealEngine

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So where is the cpu/nb in that diagram? And how is it not bottlenecked by whatever the HT is running at (how can the cpu/nb run at 2400hz if the HT is only 2000hz?)?

Or a better quesiton - WHAT does the cpu/nb control? If the onboard mem controller talks to memory, and the HT talks to everything else (via the northbridge/southbridge), what is left for the cpu/nb?
 
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QuietIce

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The cpuNB is the interface between the rest of the system and the processor cores. In this diagram the cpuNB includes the L3 cache, System Request Queue, Crossbar, IMC, and HT Link hub. Basically everything except the L1/L2 cache, which is controlled by the individual cores, and the cores themselves. Note this is an Opteron diagram (instead of Phenom) and has two extra HT links ...
 

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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
So calling it cpu/NB is a little misleading then isnt it? I mean it has no direct connection to the NB right? Only the HT interfaces with the NB correct? Wouldnt a better name be cpu/L3Cash or cpu/HT?
 

SCFAdamVcG

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Mar 27, 2009
Location
Morecambe,North West,England.
Missing one vital thing ..
take a guess what it is ..
CPU-NB Voltage..
When I was pushing for 3.8ghz it was unstable no matter what until i pushed the nb's voltage up , stock just wont do for 2400mhz..
also add a little more vcore whilst your at it ..
I have the cpu one below yours ..
Needing 1.53 volts for 3.8ghz
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
I have tried cpu/nb voltage up to 1.3v (which according to dolk is more than I should need), and I can never get stable 3.7ghz. However, if I bump my vcore to something like 1.48v (so it doesnt vdroop below 1.45v under load), I can set my cpu/nb voltage to 1.175v, and everything is fine. Again, here are my current settings...

cpu bus freq - 200
pcie freq 100

cpu ratio - 18.5
cpu/nb freq - 2400hz
cpu voltage - 1.4875v
cpu/nb voltage - 1.175v
cpu vdda volt - 2.7v (not sure if this is doing anything)

HT linkspeed - 2000hz
HT linkwidth - AUTO
HT Volt - AUTO

DRAM freq - 1333hz
DRAM Volt - 1.5v
(under timings there were dozens of settings, however I set the traditional CL, tRCD, tRP and tRAS to 9-9-9-24)

NB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.1v)
NB 1.8v - AUTO
SB Volt - AUTO (amd overdrive shows 1.35v, which is max... odd)

Temps are getting hot (55c load) so before I push anymore vcore I am trying to get some better cooling. On a side note, I am pretty disappointed in this core contact freezer. I got a good application of AS5 (I first filled in the little gaps in this heatsing base, then got a very thin even layer on the cpu spreader). I think the problem is - even with the fan on full speed (2200rpm) I still cant feel any air coming out the opposite end of the heatsink (I was expecting a jet stream of air to be coming out of all those fins). The fan is plenty powerful enough when I disconnect it, but man when you attach it to the heatsink its like no air is moving through the fins... /rant off
 

dillinja666

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May 28, 2009
Location
San Diego
weird..I have a 955 and im running 3.8 200X19 right now with 1.45v 2400ht and 2400nb with auto voltage on both ht and nb dram at 1333 9-9-9-24-33 @1.65v
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
Well your ram is a bit higher than mine (1.5v), ... what temps are you getting at those settings?
 

dillinja666

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May 28, 2009
Location
San Diego
Well your ram is a bit higher than mine (1.5v), ... what temps are you getting at those settings?

idle 34 load 53-54ish.
Im useing the dark knight cooler, but I think I need to re-do the TIM, i use the stuff that came with it cause I ran out. Im useing the antec 900 case as well
 
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ZealEngine

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Dec 6, 2009
Were you a part of Inteland before this ...?

...um no, not really. But I take it my analysis was correct (ie cpu/nb has nothing to do with the north bridge)?

*btw I ordered some more case fans (my 'MB Temp' is reading 34c, which seems kinda high), hopefully that will get my temps down a bit, so I can up the vcore to something like 1.5v..
 
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