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ViaAqua heats my water

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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
I just installed a new pump into my system, the ViaAqua 1300. I have heard from others that the pump is warm to the touch. I didn't see anything mentioned about it heating the freaking water up! I thought (hoped?) the heat would have dissipated through the pump instead of the water, well guess what? I opened up my case last night to check on things. The computer had not been run since the day before. The pump is on all the time. I touched the waterblock and well, it was warm to the touch. It was not cool like most metals at room temperature. I felt the water lines and they too were warm. So, I booted up the computer and went into the BIOS to check out the cpu temp. It was 35C at boot up! It has never been that. It always boots up around 27C. Well, guess it is time to break out the cash for an Eheim. Are the Eheims cooler? Anybody had these experiences with the ViaAqua? Should have listened to my gut instinct.:(
 

NeoMoses

Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2001
was the fan running on the radiator the entire time? if not, then don't worry. All pumps will add some amount of heat to the system. That's the price you pay. An eheim may add less heat than a via aqua, but it will still heat the water.

What matters is how the system performs at steady state. What are your full load temps after 10 hours?
 

cack01

Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2002
Location
San diego or UC Davis
As mentioned, all pumps will heat the water to some extent. I do feel the via-aqua is in a class of its own. Mine runs very hot and I won't even run it without a fan on to cool my radiator.

But... I don't feel you need to spend money on a eheim just b/c your pump runs a little hot.
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
The system at idle (with fan running on radiator) is 40-41C. Load is 47-49C. It is a Tbird 1133 at 1.85V. D-tek spiral block with 1/2" fittings, chevette heatercore with 120mm shrouded fan sucking air in from the front.This just seems too high with this pump. I just changed from a homemade block with a submerged bilge pump running about the same temps. 8C above ambient upon bootup seems a little high.
 

kaltag

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 28, 2002
Location
Boise Idaho
i've got the via aqua too and if i leave it on yes it heats the water and radiator and block. but like stated above any pump yo get is gonna do it. if it's a big problem for you try attaching some HSFs to the pump housing.
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
Yes every pump will add some heat, but this one, judging from comments in other posts is one of the hotter running pumps. The eheim 1048 runs much cooler from the reviews I have seen, although with less flow.
 

Albigger

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2002
JML said:
You should rig your pump to turn on and shut off with your computer.

... or just leave your comp. on all the time :D

seriously (though my comp is on almost all the time) when i leak tested my WC setup with no fans on the rad and a danner mag drive 700gph pump, it heats the water quite a bit.

with the fans goin on the rad though, shouldn't be too much of a problem.
 

Ottoman

Member
Joined
May 21, 2001
Location
Bahrain
that strange, are u guys sumberging the pump in the water? or using it inline?

with no fan on my heatercore, i get on die temps in the 30's...
i use the viaaqua 1300 as well...


could it be that your rad isn't disipatting heat fast enough?
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
JML said:
You should rig your pump to turn on and shut off with your computer.
I thought about that, but these pumps are meant to stay on. The continuous cycle of off and on would decrease their life expectancy, wouldn't it ?
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
Ottoman said:
that strange, are u guys sumberging the pump in the water? or using it inline?

with no fan on my heatercore, i get on die temps in the 30's...
i use the viaaqua 1300 as well...


could it be that your rad isn't disipatting heat fast enough?
My rig is inline w/o a reservoir. The heatercore is a chevette heatercore that others have great results with. It has a 120mm fan sucking air in from the front. Like I said, the block and water lines are very warm when I touch them, so I think this pump is not helping. It is spec'd. at 20 watts compare to the eheim 1048 at 10W and the maxijet 900 at 8.5 W
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
More fans?!?!?!? (runs away)
Seriously, I am trying to be less fan dependent.
Fans=bad.
Anyone heard of a fans anonymous:D
 

safemode

Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2002
Location
Michigan / Pennsylvania
Why do you care about the temps of your water when the computer is not running or when it's booting up. Those temps dont matter. What matters is full load temp and your avg temp for any given length of time you use the computer. First off your Tbird is overclocked from what? if you're operating at 1133 then it should be 1.7 volt, not 1.85. Second off pumps that cool by water are cheaper because they dont need elaborate lubricants and parts to cut down on heat so that it can be cooled by air. Your water cooled pump should last longer than a air cooled pump with less maintainance. I say should and not will because some pumps are trash no matter what. Best powerhead like pump i know of is the maxijet and probably the best outboard pump would be an eheim. Eheim's cost 3 times as much for a reason, and it's not because it pumps more water.

You shouldn't be concerned with the temp of your water when the computer is not running. It's a waste of time to care. the Tbird is a chip that runs very hot. Rather than buy fans which will add noise i'd just go and get the xp1700 tbred since it runs very cool and performs better than you can overclock your 1133 anyways. They cost what, 60 bucks. So for the money you'd spend on an eheim you could get a better chip that results in lower temps with what you have now. I bet your temps are in line with what they should be though for the chips you're running at the ambient temp you're running at. The higher the ambient temp the more air you need to push over the radiator... So you've discovered that without a fan you need a delta temp of 8C for the heattransfer to equalize. With a fan I bet it's right on close to 1-2C. Which is what you'd expect. I dont know what you're looking for here. Even water cooled boxes depend on the crappy air to move the heat out of the system.
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
safemode said:
Why do you care about the temps of your water when the computer is not running or when it's booting up. Those temps dont matter.
I disagree, starting off with water that is atleast 8c over ambient puts one at a disadvantage immediately. You know how water is good at cooling? That same property also makes it cool down from a higher temp slower. It resists cooling the same degree it resists being heated. There is now way that water starting at that temperature now being used to cool something hot can be as efficient as water starting off from room temperature.
First off your Tbird is overclocked from what? if you're operating at 1133 then it should be 1.7 volt, not 1.85.
Check the sig, it is overclocked with higher v for a REASON, stability. I am pushing the chip for all it is worth. When you reach a certain point of oc'ing a chip and it is unstable, what do you do? Increase voltage to get it stable. It worked, so I pushed it for all it is worth.

You shouldn't be concerned with the temp of your water when the computer is not running. It's a waste of time to care.
Again I disagree. Thermal properties (potential) of water negate that statement
.the Tbird is a chip that runs very hot.
I am glad you told me that, I had no idea!
Rather than buy fans which will add noise i'd just go and get the xp1700 tbred since it runs very cool and performs better than you can overclock your 1133 anyways. They cost what, 60 bucks.
Did you ever think for a moment I may have an XP 1600 on the way? Don't make assumptions.
I bet your temps are in line with what they should be though for the chips you're running at the ambient temp you're running at. The higher the ambient temp the more air you need to push over the radiator... So you've discovered that without a fan you need a delta temp of 8C for the heattransfer to equalize.
Here you are admitting you need to change the water temp 8C to get it to room temperature. What I am saying is there has to be a pump that does not put that kind of heat into the water to begin with. This pump is rated at 20W, the maxijet and eheim are 8.5 and 10W respectively. That has to equate to lower beginning temperatures of the water. I am running a fan over the radiator as I stated previously, though not when the computer is shut down.
I dont know what you're looking for here.
Then how can you answer? Why post? I am looking for suggestions from others in a manner different from yours. The previous replies have been in a helpful manner. From what I have read in many other threads that you have replied to, you are more argumentative than helpful. Just my two cents.
 

JML

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2000
Location
New Jersey
What (I think) safemode is basically saying is that starting temp doesn't matter cause when the temp stables (after like an hour or whatever) it will end being the same. I'm not saying I believe or disbelieve what he is saying, though it seems to have some merit.

and I didn't mean add more fans, just replace the ones on your rad w/ the AC's.
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
JML said:
What (I think) safemode is basically saying is that starting temp doesn't matter cause when the temp stables (after like an hour or whatever) it will end being the same.
I understand his theory. But after I left it idle for a couple hours , the temps didn't drop at all which is why I believe his theory is wrong. The temps rose from 35 at bootup to 41 idle within a few minutes and stayed there for as long as I left the computer on. I am changing my ambient temp. now because I actually did a conversion knowing the room temp was about 68F (Ambient temp, mind you was probably 20C) By that theory, if you start out with water at 15C above ambient, then heat that up by running the computer even in idle, his theory should show that at first the temp at idle should be 15C above what it would have been with water that is at ambient temp. Now, because the fan is cooling the radiator and water, it should drop because the temperatures are "stabilizing". Sort of like pool water that sits in the sun all day. At night you go out to take a dip, it is warmer than the air temp. Then slowly it drops (IF there is no added heat) This is because the thermal potential of water is such that it resists temperature changes. As I said, this water will eventually cool down if no temp increase is applied to it. But, if you apply heat to it it will never cool down to what it would have been had it started at air temp. Am I making sense in this explanation?
and I didn't mean add more fans, just replace the ones on your rad w/ the AC's.
I know, I was just adding some humor.
 
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Albigger

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2002
JML said:
What (I think) safemode is basically saying is that starting temp doesn't matter cause when the temp stables (after like an hour or whatever) it will end being the same. I'm not saying I believe or disbelieve what he is saying, though it seems to have some merit.

even if this is true (which it seems to not be, as srwven posted temps stay high if the water is hot) then it is still at a disadvantage. - so what, you can't run your computer under load for the first 'X' amount of time after you start it up until the water cools back down again (because the load temp would be higher with higher temp water and possibly result in unstability)? That would kind of suck if the 'X' amount of time it took to cool down the water was anyhwere past even say 10 minutes.

most of the overclockers on these boards push their hardware to the limit where 8C difference can mean quite a bit to stability


EDIT: srwven it sounds like the radiator and fan setup you have is only sufficient to remove the heat of the cpu, but the the cpu and the pump heat. try either: a) pushing more cfm through the radiator, temporarily or b) lowing your vcore and overclock temporarily -- and let the pump run for a while without the computer on (so as to heat up). then turn on the computer and fans on the radiator and let it sit for a while (like you did before) and see if temps go down this time. If they go down now, with less heat (due to lower overclock and vcore, or higher cooling capacity because of more cfms) then it suggests that the radiator is the limiting factor. If you have a good radiator and fan setup, I would guess that (even if the water is warm due to the pump running) the radiator shouldn't have trouble dissipating the heat from the cpu and the pump and bringing water temps (and cpu load temps) back to normal within a reasonable amount of time.

sorry for my long-windedness, but i wanted to explain clearly my thoughts
 
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srwven

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Location
Pennsylvania
Albigger:
Gotcha. I will have to do more investigating. My gut instincts don't feel right with a pump that is adding this much heat to the water. I may check out a maxijet 900 to see if that does anything first.
 

nikhsub1

Unoriginal Macho Moderator
Joined
Oct 12, 2001
Location
Los Angeles
Any pump that you run with the rest of the system OFF is gonna heat up the water, period. I don't care if the pump only puts out 1W of heat, it is gonna happen. When I would bleed my system with the Eheim 1048, everything got WARM with just the pump running, there is NO WAY to avoid this.