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Voodoo3, what's "significantly" faster?

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RoadWarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2001
Location
Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada
Hi guys,

I have a voodoo 3 PCI in my system at the moment. Now I can overclock this quite happily to 3500 spec, and I'm not a resolution snob, 800x600 or 1024x768 is fine for me.

I'm buying new toys, Chaintech 7VJDA with KT266A, XP 1700+, 256Mb DDR, and at first thought it would be a bit silly to be using a PCI card with these..... but I've been looking at figures, and dang me if it doesn't look like I can't improve on the voodoo much for cheap.
So I was going to keep it for now, until my wife said she wants a good card for her K6-2-400 system. It hasn't got an AGP slot, PCI cards are rare, so we thought she could have my Voodoo and I could get a new AGP card. However, the upgrade budget is tight and I can probably only spend around $100 or so Canadian.

However, what I consider an "upgrade" has to be at least 50% faster than what I've got, and looking at benchmarks and reviews I am not seeing anything that looks very nice at a price I can afford. It would seem that some of the GeForces are only as fast or a little faster and even slower in some situations, likewise the first Radeons, and I get to buy into the "will the sucker work with my motherboard" pile of hurt.

So I'm seeing quotes around here that for example the GeForce 2 MX 200 , sometimes performs slower than a Voodoo 3, which I can believe, since I've seen benchmarks with it only leading the Voodoo a few percent, and in the best cases doubling the performance, but in those situations the Voodoo is down among some cards that it wouldn't normally consider competition, so seems more like a driver oddity.


So what I would like is a rundown on the cheaper GeForce cards that are available OEM and surplus at the moment, which is which??? it's damn confusing. Which will definitely be all round "significantly" faster, and which might I be dissappointed with?

Heh, before I got the voodoo it seemed like you could get cheap and good AGP cards for $30US and up, now I want to improve on it, I'm only sure that's the case at like $100 and up.

I usually have a "at least twice as fast" upgrade philisophy on other parts, I don't usually notice the difference much otherwise.

Thanks,

Road Warrior
 

funnyperson1

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2001
first of all, the Radeons are jsut as compatible as the Geforces....2x the performance....easily done....check the Radeon7500 for around 80$ on pricewatch and the Geforce2Tis for around 90$......these should be almost 4 times as fast as your Voodoo3 PCI.....id spring for the 7500 as the Geforce2s have low image quality comapratively....
 
OP
RoadWarrior

RoadWarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2001
Location
Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada
Thanks, yes, I know the Radeon 7500s should be nicely faster, I wasn't convinced about the first Radeons though, likewise the earlier GeForces.

Now price is the problem on these, I can get them locally for around $170 Canadian, which seems way too much to me at the minute, even $90 US is gonna end up like ... 90x1.55=140ish, then the 30 bucks difference would probably get swallowed in shipping and taxes and whatever daylight robbery protection fee or whatever the shipper wants to charge. (okay they call it a "customs presentation" fee or something, but some are ripoff high, ...... UPS :mad: :mad: :mad: )

What are GF 2 MX 400s like? I seem to be able to get a deal on those.

Road Warrior
 
OP
RoadWarrior

RoadWarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2001
Location
Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada
Oh are Radeon 7500s with TV out the same as regular Radeon 7500s, I understand they underclock the 7500 all in wonder, so was wondering if they did the same to tv out versions, or are they the same as standard?
 

Tracert

Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Location
Southbridge, MA.
High Road Warrior,

It sounds to me like your a prime canadate for a used video card. You don't seem to be in that big of a hurry for the new card, so why not wait until you see a 7500 or GF2 for sale in the classifieds.

Heck, I picked up my 1800+ there for $75.00, just wait for the right one, make an offer and you better off then spending on new.

Esp with the level card your looking at. Should be lots of people looking to move up to 8500 or something and sell their GF2 or 7500.

You and I have the same upgrade rules it seems. Good luck and happy hunting.
 

Arkaine23

Captain Random Senior Evil
Joined
Nov 8, 2001
upgrade

Tracert said:
High Road Warrior,

It sounds to me like your a prime canadate for a used video card.

Should be lots of people looking to move up to 8500 or something and sell their GF2 or 7500.

Like me!
 

TUK101

Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
Location
Wash. State
A 32mb ddr Radeon would get you just what you are looking for. You can find one for around 50-60 bucks. Look on www.newegg.com, as that is where I got mine when I made the same upgrade as you are now. The image quality is excellent, and the fps are quite as step up from the Voodoo 3.
 

Malakai

New Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2001
Location
Fl
funnyperson1 said:
first of all, the Radeons are jsut as compatible as the Geforces....2x the performance....easily done....check the Radeon7500 for around 80$ on pricewatch and the Geforce2Tis for around 90$......these should be almost 4 times as fast as your Voodoo3 PCI.....id spring for the 7500 as the Geforce2s have low image quality comapratively....
Id beg to differ on the image quality issue, a good brand Nvidia card, Gainward is best IMHO, looks the same as a Radeon.
I have:
Radeon32megDDR,Geforce3 Ti200 by gainward.
I've used:
Radeon8500, Gainward geforce2 Ti550, and the old no name Geforce2MX400 in a Vaio system.
the no name mx400 has terrible image quality, but all the other radeons and geforces are the same. If your card uses quality components like gainward, there is no difference in quality. My geforce3 Ti200 looks better than an 8500 with ansiotropy 8x(64tap) and quincunx AA, by far. thats why i kept it over the 8500. their performance at the speed mines at(see sig) is on par in everything but 3dmark2k1.
Roadwarrior, a geforce2 Ti550 by gainward comes nicely o/c'ed stock and will o/c VERY high and can easily be found for 80$ US, maybe less. I highly reccomend gainward, their cards use great components and have supberb image quality. Just make sure its a golden sample. those cards are great on a good system, and performance over your current card will well more than triple or quadruple
-Malakai
 

Tracert

Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Location
Southbridge, MA.
Malakai said:

Id beg to differ on the image quality issue, a good brand Nvidia card, Gainward is best IMHO, looks the same as a Radeon.


I also have seen most of these cards in action, and as long as you are using a fairly high quality monitor, you should see a difference between the GF2 & 3 and the Radeons.

Usually when I couldn't tell the difference, it was because the monitor was not the best quality in general and/or I was running the monitor out of it's true spec (just because a monitor will handle 100Hz @ 1024 768 doesn't mean it was really ment to run at 100Hz).

So I guess if your monitor isn't that great then don't worry about the clearity thing, but if you have a good monitor or will be getting one soon, then I would say the Radeon will make a difference.

Just MHO.
 

funnyperson1

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 16, 2001
i beg to differ upon your differing:D ....i specifically said Geforce2 teh Geforce3 and 4 cards have greatly improved quality....but the Geforce2 are nowhere near ATi....if as Tracert said you have a nice monitor....
 
OP
RoadWarrior

RoadWarrior

Senior Member
Joined
Nov 25, 2001
Location
Niagara Falls, Ontario, Canada
Hmmm I *think* I've got a nice monitor, don't get much opportunity to compare. IBM P70, 17 inch Trinitron vertically flat, does 1280x1024 in standard modes, can synch up to 1600x1400 I think but at less than recommended refresh rate or something. (100Hz?)

What's "good" these days?

Road Warrior
 

rogue1979

Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2002
Location
Las Cruces, NM
I would look for a Radeon LE/32MB DDR or a Geforce 2 GTS-V. The will definately fit in your budget and give you a big performance jump over the Voodoo 3. My brother had a Radeon 64MB VIVO for sale for $80, I could see if he still has it if you're interested.
 

Tracert

Member
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Location
Southbridge, MA.
RoadWarrior said:
Hmmm I *think* I've got a nice monitor, don't get much opportunity to compare. IBM P70, 17 inch Trinitron vertically flat, does 1280x1024 in standard modes, can synch up to 1600x1400 I think but at less than recommended refresh rate or something. (100Hz?)

What's "good" these days?

Road Warrior

I would think that monitor would be enough to notice a difference between the cards. I have a Trinitron Multiscan 200ES, which is a little older, but I can see the difference.
 

Malakai

New Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2001
Location
Fl
i have a viewsonic 19in G90FB graphics series monitor. I do admit that its been awhile since the geforce2 Ti. BUt my Ti200 and the 8500 were both used recently, im on a Ti200 now, and there is no diff, i think that a Ti200 w/quincunx and 64tap ansiotropy looks better.
Sorry th interupt your thread roadwarrior, go ATI if less than a geforce3. I really dont like the 7500 that much, but thats just me. I really liked my old 32meg ddr radeon o/c'ed to 200/200.
the LE versions like 30$ and u can use radeon tweaker to reenable hyperz and o/c it to 200/200 and have a nice card. mine was a ratail LE(it was built by ATI, not an OEM) very cheap at tcwo.com
-Malakai
 

Mag22

Registered
Joined
Mar 16, 2002
Having been a 3DFX fan and very sorry to see their demise, I must say the Voodoo card image quality was always better than the competitiors. 16-Bit color looked better than the 32-Bit Nvidia competition to me. I remember when my friend brought home his shiny new TNT2 Ultra, excited about the 32-Bit color. A few weeks later I bought a Voodoo3 3000 for comparisons sake (For $40 less) and we both saw the light. Ahh the times have changed. If I understand you want to spend @ $70 U.S. for your new card and double your frame rates. A Voodoo5 5500 64 MB card can be had for $50 or less, but that will only add 30-40% to your current performance level. Prior to the 7500 and 8500 Radeon's, I saw nothing but pathetic frame-per-dollar ratios. I suggest you find a remanufactured GF2 Ultra or GTS. These should fit nicely into your budget and give you 2-2.5x's the 3DMark scores. Everyone on this forum has spent plenty of time researching, spending and tweaking, so take this as MHO also.

Currently pleased with a GeForce3 Ti 200 @215/460
Epox 8KHA+ and AMD 1800+ arrive next week!!
 

vlovich

Registered
Joined
Dec 13, 2001
I also live in canada. If you live in TO you can pick up Toronto Computes from a local library for free. It has many advertisements from many different companies. I know that when the gf3's came out, the geforce 2mx's were approximately $100 (from a small computer store, not something like Futureshop which way overprices things). Also, you said that a Voodoo 3 PCI managed to outperform a gf2 on some tests? I highly doubt this as the Voodoo 5 was created to compete with gf2 and it was pretty close but got beat on every test. So there is no way that the voodoo 3 could possibly beat it. Look over the benchmarks again and make sure they are reliable. I know because i have a voodoo 5 pci and it is outperformed by my brother's comp even though i have a faster processor with faster ram and fsb. So look up the prices in Toronto Computes! or Canada Computes! (i'm not sure but i think this has very little if any national advertisements). The best advice i could give you would be to go to a small store. If you want more piece of mind though, that costs $$$. Even at futureshop you can get a gf2 mx 200 for 109. Although i don't recommend this because it is a pci card and since you have an agp slot, you should upgrade to a agp card because of all the added benefits (agp texturing, sideband addressing, faster bus, direct memory access just to name a few)
 

WyrmMaster

I'm a little teapot Senior
Joined
Dec 17, 2000
Location
Montana, USA
Depends on the price you want to pay, but if you upgrading from a voodoo 3 then you cant go wrong with a geforce 3 ti200 for $100 or a radeon 8500 for $150 IMHO
 

-=UR=- Ranger

Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2001
Location
Giessen, Germany
One more suggestion-The Kyro II based cards.

Nice performance. Good picture quality and at a very competative price. Don't know about Canadian or US Prices, but it should be cheap.