• Welcome to Overclockers Forums! Join us to reply in threads, receive reduced ads, and to customize your site experience!

water cooling with something else?

Overclockers is supported by our readers. When you click a link to make a purchase, we may earn a commission. Learn More.

Platinum1

New Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2001
Of course, I'm not suggesting you don't have a liquid, but has anyone considered or tried other fluids? Does filtered water work best? I know that a little salt makes water conduct electricity (much) better, what about heat? Has anyone tried antifreeze or freon (or the equivalent) in a closed system? Although I don't think freon would work in an open system, there might be another additive that helps water conduct heat better. Also, does anyone know if food coloring adversely affects the system? I really doubt it does but thought I would ask while on the subject of additives



I know nothing about water cooling. I've never tried it. If this post sounds really dumb, sorry, please just ignore it and don't flame me.
 

KILLorBE

Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2001
Location
The Netherlands
Platinum1 (Jun 24, 2001 03:44 a.m.):
If this post sounds really dumb, sorry, please just ignore it and don't flame me.

Welcome to the forum Platinum1
We won't flame you, Like another member said: "The only stupid questions are the ones not asked"
Yes PPL have used (and are still using) other fluids (alcohol, antifreeze), but I think some other members can answer this question better than I can.
 

Beggar

Registered
Joined
Jun 23, 2001
Hi dude, the goodness of a fluid pretty much depends on the SHC (specific heat capacity) of the fluid, this is how much energy is required for a certain temperature increase, water has a very high SHC, i.e. takes a lot of energy for the waters temp to increase, therefore, the water is cooler thru the the block for longer than other stuff and cause the temp difference is greater the block gets cooler faster. Water has a very high SHC compared to other fluids due to the double hydrogen bond or something like that, and therefore is probably best (i think there are a few better but they are hard to get hold of)
 

Shadow ÒÓ

Mod in Hiding
Joined
Dec 20, 2000
Location
Pensacola, Florida USA
Welcome to the Forum!

For the most part, water is the "best bang for the buck". There have been several other fluids discussed here, but most are either dadngerous or just too expensive.

Don't worry about flames..........this is a very friendly board. =)
 

Flash

Member
Joined
May 21, 2001
I haven't tested it yet, but I'm told that an additive called water wetter increases the efficiency of a water cooling system. It also prevents algae growth. I believe the best solution (pun intended) is to use some antifreeze (to prevent corrosion/algae growth) and some water wetter to improve thermal efficiency, which is reduced somewhat by antifreeze.
 

cjtune

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2000
Beggar (Jun 24, 2001 06:18 a.m.):
Hi dude, the goodness of a fluid pretty much depends on the SHC (specific heat capacity) of the fluid, this is how much energy is required for a certain temperature increase, water has a very high SHC, i.e. takes a lot of energy for the waters temp to increase, therefore, the water is cooler thru the the block for longer than other stuff and cause the temp difference is greater the block gets cooler faster. Water has a very high SHC compared to other fluids due to the double hydrogen bond or something like that, and therefore is probably best (i think there are a few better but they are hard to get hold of)

This is if you are talking about a single-phase working fluid system. Two-phase systems (liquid/gas), like that of freon in your fridge depends more on latent heat of vaporization per unit mass of the fluid. BTW, liquid metals are used in some nuke power plants in place of water but I doubt anyone would enjoy the notion of having volatile liquid sodium circulating through your PC's casing.
 

CpuWaterCool.com

Registered
Joined
Jun 11, 2001
In a closed system, you have lots of play. The most popular is, again, Water Wetter. Not because it has the best performance per se, but the best performance for your dollar. Remember, corrosion isn't the only concern. Your tubing needs to survive the additive also!
 

rugby

King of Cats Senior
Joined
Feb 2, 2001
Location
Chicago, IL
I used distilled water and then tried water wetter with my watercooling rig. THe water wetter definitely cooled better, a couple of degrees is all I needed, but this stuff stinks like cat urine. I'm not joking, when I spilled a tiny bit on my hands my wife thought I emptied out the cat litter box with my hands! Go to an automotive store and pick up a bottle for 8$/12oz bottle instead of the ludicrous prices the online overclocking stores charge.
 

Asz

New Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2001
why doesn't anyone try something really weird, like a couple cans of pepsi?
 

Big Mike

Senior Head of Import Performance
Joined
Dec 17, 2000
Location
Fort Wayne, IN
A couple cans of pepsi in a watercooling rig would leave enough crud deposits to block the thing in no time flat...as was stated in a single phase cooling system there really isnt much thats finacially feasible that can outdo good old water and an OTC additive like water wetter
 

cjtune

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2000
Yeah, and pepsi might just give off bubbles in your piping that can potentially choke off flow and heat transfer (air is getting in between the water and the inner surface of your radiator), just like cavitation in water pipes.

One method I've read of cooling multi-processor modules is to immerse them into a liquid with low vaporization temperatures, like fluorocarbon (CFC, HCFC, etc.). The liquid, when in contact with the hot CPUs, will BOIL, and rise up and escape form the liquid surface and then be condensed by water-cooled coils above. The condensed FC will then drip back into the pool and thus completing a cycle. Here, heat is first removed (primarily) by the latent heat of vaporization of the FC and then passed on to the ambient by the water-cooled coils and radiator. Of course, the FC and water coils has to be in a pressurized container/tank. If anybody can build a PC sealed in a air-tight fridge, then this project should be only a bit harder... Anybody extreme enough to try?
 

SharkyTM

Member
Joined
Mar 9, 2001
Location
Ithaca, NY
truth be known........ the best liquid to use thats feasible (this excludes liquid n2, o2, or he) would be liquid ammonia... its possible to make a system that uses ammonia and doesnt corrode... just requires a little chemistry knowledge... the reason for using liquid ammonia is that it has the highest heat capacity and latent heat of vaporization.... water is a far second...... dunno if any OC'ers have tried it, but someone should try... :)



SharkyTM
 

Spewn

Registered
Joined
May 1, 2001
What is the specific heat capacity of ammonia? Also, keep in mind that the stuff is toxic, and it'd be INCREDIBLY illegal to use it in your home(an arena near me had an ammonia leak, and they evacuated half the university campus).
 

Mr.L

New Member
Joined
Jun 27, 2001
cjtune (Jun 24, 2001 11:03 a.m.):

This is if you are talking about a single-phase working fluid system. Two-phase systems (liquid/gas), like that of freon in your fridge depends more on latent heat of vaporization per unit mass of the fluid. BTW, liquid metals are used in some nuke power plants in place of water but I doubt anyone would enjoy the notion of having volatile liquid sodium circulating through your PC's casing.

I think MERCURY is less dangerous than liquid sodium , anyone have tried mercury instead of water?
 

*spazzed*

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2000
Location
hamilton, ontario, canada
Spewn (Jun 27, 2001 10:42 a.m.):
What is the specific heat capacity of ammonia? Also, keep in mind that the stuff is toxic, and it'd be INCREDIBLY illegal to use it in your home(an arena near me had an ammonia leak, and they evacuated half the university campus).

Actually, I have found some house hold items that contain small amounts of amonia......such as after bite ;D I hate pesky mosquitos
Has any one used Dex-cool anti-freeze(the orange stuff) ???
 

inertia

Registered
Joined
May 24, 2001
Um, ammonia can be bought at Wal-Mart.

There aren't many things more toxic than mercury (Hg). Methylated mercury will leech straight through rubber gloves like they're not even there. Ignoring that, the stuff is DENSE as it it weight a LOT.
 

dozier768

Member
Joined
May 9, 2001
Location
portland,or
lol ya mercury would be good but its highly toxic and is known to accumulate in the brain in small amounts and cause insanity lol not to mention it would be real hard to pump
 

Kingslayer

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2001
Location
Port Charlotte, Florida
Ok, so we have Mercury which will kill you or make you insane.
Ammonia, which may be illegal and will kill you.
Pepsi, which will cause bubbles...(the smartass in me says use flat pepsi...duuhhhh)

What about common stuff. Let's say...hydraulic fliud. It's not a heavy as oil, can be pumped, and if I remember bleeds heat pretty well. If you don't believe me you've never set your arm on an actively working hydraulic resevior...

How about bleach...I dunno, im grasping at straws...

What about other thin oil based substances. There's a ton of them out there.

And what about the grandaddy of them all. Electrolytic Fluid. It's a non-conductive (electricity, don't know about heat though) fluid. Spring a leak and you don't have to worry. And I have seen a computer run completly submerged in this stuff. Drives were on the outside of course. But even the power supply was submerged.
 

doublec16

Registered
Joined
Apr 3, 2001
I don't know where you're getting this info about mercury. I've held mercury in my hand and I'm still alive. It's only if you take it internally that you'd be in trouble. I think it has a similar effect as lead: it stays in the system and prevents proper metabolism in the cells, thus killing them, which is particularly dangerous for the brain where the cells don't reproduce, if you survive long enough to worry about that sort of thing.