Which system should I build?

[Demon of Elru]

So I have been wanting to update my current system which is X299 with a 10900X and RTX 3090Ti, I am at a crossroads of sorts, I am not sure if I should go with Arrow Lake or W790 Sappire Rapids which is the successor to X299. The cost of course is a big difference one I am willing to bear if it makes sense. How would sapphire rapids be for gaming? I realize its not made for it but would it be better than what I have now? How much worse than Arrow Lake? I also am drawn to expansion of W790. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

 

[EarthDog]

I'll say if you don't need to be on the HEDT platform for what it provides, then don't go there. So... what does you use your machine for that you're going HEDT? What expansion would you need? Share some info so we can help.

Would you consider AMD? You should... 9950x is a beast beats out the new arrow lake stuff in most heavily multithreaded things, is a solid gamer, and uses less power.

Edit: from your 2023 thread on this same subject, I'm still on x670/x870. You mentioned TB4 and that (or usb4) is standard now on z890 and x870. There's more usb ports than ever on the latest platforms... same with m.2 storage and boards have high quality audio.

....basically read my posts from your 2023 thread again... 9950x + x870 = win and saves quite a bit of jack.

Edit2: x870e aorus master = 3x pcie slots, two still accessible with big gpu, 12 usb ports on rear io (including 2x usb4)... etc.

 

[Demon of Elru]

Yes I have also decided to remove my internal sound card and use an external DAC. So that saves a need for a PCIe slot.

 

[EarthDog]

Yes I have also decided to remove my internal sound card and use an external DAC. So that saves a need for a PCIe slot.

There are plenty of boards with just two, so you're good to go on the consumer platform.

 

[Demon of Elru]

There are plenty of boards with just two, so you're good to go on the consumer platform.

Three is a good min for me, I realize most new boards both Z890 and W790 have plenty of usb's but I have an internal expansion card I use, its 8 port usb 3.0. so a third slot left free for whatever is plenty. Whether it be for a new NIC card or PCIe capture card. Sadly not too many PCIe expansion choices. Also the other big option is Wake On Lan, I use it fairly frequently so the Z890 boards must have that feature, or I would need a PCIe NIC.

 

[EarthDog]

That x870 aorus master should fit the bill. Just double check it has WoL. I think most do.

 

[Demon of Elru]

Thank you I will definitely look into it. Its tough since the HEDT specifically advertises it.

 

[infinitevalence]

What are the features of the HEDT that you like?

I like the PCIe options, as well as the RAM options, but the starting price point is NOT worth it for me.

If you are only going Intel, I do like options with vPRO as it gives you IPMI like functionality without having to get a server/workstation board from the likes of Tyan/Supermicro/Gigabyte/ASrock Rack.

 

[Demon of Elru]

What are the features of the HEDT that you like?

I like the PCIe options, as well as the RAM options, but the starting price point is NOT worth it for me.

If you are only going Intel, I do like options with vPRO as it gives you IPMI like functionality without having to get a server/workstation board from the likes of Tyan/Supermicro/Gigabyte/ASrock Rack.

Same as you, PCIe expansion capacity, Memory capacity and the guarantee of Wake on Lan are the three major options as even consumer boards now have 2.5-10gbe network ports. But yes the price is frankly absurd. If I do go with consumer Ill get the 285K and MSI Unify-X still cheaper than the ASRock W790 board I wanted to get which is very nice mind you. I realize at this moment in time the new AMD chip is a bit better for gaming and is said to run cooler but to me these things seem worse than they are in the real world. I am used to Intel and their BIOS and features so I like to stick with it. But yeah HEDT is nice but very expensive now however I would bite the bullet and cry my way to purchasing it, however I more and than likely won't have to.

 

[Woomack]

I am used to Intel and their BIOS and features so I like to stick with it. But yeah HEDT is nice but very expensive now however I would bite the bullet and cry my way to purchasing it, however I more and than likely won't have to.

If you pick the new Intel, you will find out how many options are different in the BIOS than in the previous generations. All basic options have remained the same, but you find the same on AMD mobos. All options are the same as on HEDT mobos ... as long as a manufacturer decides to include them. IPMI functionality is only for higher workstations and server mobos. HEDT generally doesn't have that. There are exceptions, but they will cost $1k+.
I also can't see a significant difference between AMD and Intel temps/wattage right now. It was huge in the last gen, but the 265K runs at about 180W under high load, and the 285K is maybe up to 220W. This is about the same or less than Ryzen non-X3D options. I don't get where some reviewers get their numbers, as some in early reviews suggested 300W+. Tests generally show that AMD is faster (not talking only about games), but I also don't get that online fights when everything runs great on both brands, and the difference barely shows an advantage on any side.

I'm not sure what new Intel updates will bring. There will be a new microcode soon, and I know there will be Gear 2/4 improvements (at least ASRock mentioned it for the upcoming BIOS releases). However, this is only about CUDIMM, and you can't get CUDIMM at high capacity right now. Well, you can barely get it in any capacity.
I still feel like the market focuses more on Intel products. AMD motherboards are improving compared to Intel options, but when you test multiple of them, you see that something is always missing, and AMD is still considered more for home entertainment than work.

It's a bit weird that the HEDT/IPMI options are mentioned, and the next Z890 Unify-X appears If you want OC mobo, look at ASRock Z890 OCF. I have one in tests, and it runs great. It also has great support from ASRock/Nick Shih team, so you can expect many updates quite often. They have already released 20+ BIOS versions and the next improvements in RAM support. ASRock also costs almost $200 less in stores like Newegg.

 

[infinitevalence]

Same as you, PCIe expansion capacity, Memory capacity and the guarantee of Wake on Lan are the three major options as even consumer boards now have 2.5-10gbe network ports. But yes the price is frankly absurd. If I do go with consumer Ill get the 285K and MSI Unify-X still cheaper than the ASRock W790 board I wanted to get which is very nice mind you. I realize at this moment in time the new AMD chip is a bit better for gaming and is said to run cooler but to me these things seem worse than they are in the real world. I am used to Intel and their BIOS and features so I like to stick with it. But yeah HEDT is nice but very expensive now however I would bite the bullet and cry my way to purchasing it, however I more and than likely won't have to.

What kind of applications and expansion cards are you running? It sounds like you may have some specific requirements and that changes my recommendations greatly.

Absent of that info, I generally do not suggest the new Ultra 2xx series for anything. The number of situations where it preforms comparable to its cost is very very small. In almost all professional applications AMD's 9950x or 9900x outperform even the more expensive Ultra 285.

In HEDT AMD is hands down the winner on everything BUT entry price, some of the sapphire rapids based builds offer access to the HEDT platforms at a lower entry level price, but they wont win you any benchmarks. You will get PCIe and RAM slots, you wont get much of a CPU at that price.

 

[Demon of Elru]

Right now just an 8 port USB 3.1 expansion card and replacement NIC since the onboard 10gb doesnt support wake on lan and the other oboard intel controller has very poor throughput. I had more use for PCIe before I decided to remove the sound card in favor of an external DAC like the X4. I would like a free slot just incase such as a PCIe capture card. I also do video encoding, and reauthorizing video formats.

 

[infinitevalence]

Are you using the GPU or quick sync or just general CPU cores for encoding?

 

[Demon of Elru]

Are you using the GPU or quick sync or just general CPU cores for encoding?

I use the GPU since my CPU doesn't have quick sync. Its a 10900X.

 

[infinitevalence]

honestly then I would just go AMD and get a 9900x or 9950x along with 96gb (2x 48gb) of DDR5. Keep your 3090 and NVME.