Intel Applied OEM Thermal Compound

RollingThunder · Dec 9, 2009

Notice the photos in this thread from Bing showing the default factory application of the thermal compound in three places from Intel on their E series CPUs.

http://www.ocforums.com/showpost.php?p=6306058&postcount=25

Most suggest wiping it off and applying new. I’ve always done that until I built an E7500 home server. I left the default compound application on as an experiment and it runs 10 C cooler that my E8500 with the same OC, voltages, stock coolers, etc. I also reapplied Arctic Silver twice to my E8500 in the event I didn’t get it right the first time and the result was the same; no lower temps.

Wouldn’t Intel know the proper application of their compound better than anyone else? What’s wrong with the Intel OEM application?

I.M.O.G. · Dec 9, 2009

The cheapest, mass producible, good enough solution isn't the best solution.

Makes sense to me.

Kuroimaho · Dec 9, 2009

I agree, just like the cooler size and copper core, the cheapest what is good enough for the most of the market is all they need. I guess same goes for the tim and how it is applied as well.

RollingThunder · Dec 9, 2009

You're missing my point:

New Arctic silver cleaned and self applied twice runs hotter by 10C (E8500) than Intel OEM compound left on E7500. Similar chip (E7500 & E8500), same voltage, same OEM cooler, same % overclock, same environment and ambient. Ten degrees Celcius is a LOT.

SamSaveMax · Dec 9, 2009

It's good to hear Intel applied FREE TIM on cpus.
But I would like to point out and believed that E7xxx series do not put out as much heat as E8xxx series given the same OC clock rate or voltage.

benbaked · Dec 9, 2009

RollingThunder said:
You're missing my point:

New Arctic silver cleaned and self applied twice runs hotter by 10C (E8500) than Intel OEM compound left on E7500. Similar chip (E7500 & E8500), same voltage, same OEM cooler, same % overclock, same environment and ambient. Ten degrees Celcius is a LOT.

Those chips are from different batches. Your E7500 is a R0-stepping, and your E8500 is either a C0 or an E0 (according to intel processorfinder). Also the E7500 has half the L2 cache of the E8500 (the other half is disabled I think). I'm not surprised that the E7500 runs cooler. One way to test your theory is to replace the stock compound on your E7500 with some AS5 and then measure the temps.

gwar2288 · Dec 9, 2009

Of course new Arctic Solver runs hotter. AS takes 9001 hours to bloody cure.

I.M.O.G. · Dec 9, 2009

I'm confused, sorry.

The OEM applied paste runs 10C cooler.

Your asking what's wrong with it?

I'm not trying to be thick, but I'm not understanding that part.

As for the chips, they do have some difference, although I agree that I wouldn't expect 10C worth of difference under similar conditions like you state:
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=36503
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=33911

RollingThunder · Dec 9, 2009

I.M.O.G. said:
I'm confused, sorry.

The OEM applied paste runs 10C cooler.

Your asking what's wrong with it?

I'm not trying to be thick, but I'm not understanding that part.

As for the chips, they do have some difference, although I agree that I wouldn't expect 10C worth of difference under similar conditions like you state:
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=36503
http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=33911

IMOG, guys,

I don't know the temp characteristics between the two chips if any. What you're telling me makes sense, I don't know.

IMOG, as far a "wrong" is concerned, most here will tell you to clean and remove the OEM paste and apply Arctic Silver. If the OEM application is not as good, well, you see my point: It's 10 C cooler than Arctic Silver so it can't be that bad. No?

Kuroimaho · Dec 9, 2009

RollingThunder said:
You're missing my point:

New Arctic silver cleaned and self applied twice runs hotter by 10C (E8500) than Intel OEM compound left on E7500. Similar chip (E7500 & E8500), same voltage, same OEM cooler, same % overclock, same environment and ambient. Ten degrees Celcius is a LOT.

Even among the same cpus you could get different temps not to mention different revs etc. If you would compare the AS to the OEM after you wipe off the oem that could be acceptable, even then you should try both few times for more samples and getting a near perfect mount is far from trivial.

RollingThunder · Dec 9, 2009

Kuroimaho said:
Even among the same cpus you could get different temps not to mention different revs etc. If you would compare the AS to the OEM after you wipe off the oem that could be acceptable, even then you should try both few times for more samples and getting a near perfect mount is far from trivial.

Kuroimaho,

Understood. Am well aware of "getting a near perfect mount is far from trivial"

These push pins are a royal PITA all the time.

Leaving nothing to chance, and with a nice cool running mildly overclocked E7500 (3330 MHz), I don't think I'll risk your suggested test. My wife doesn't like to hear me swearing. :chair:

I.M.O.G. · Dec 9, 2009

It makes perfect sense to me now, sorry for being slow on the uptake.

RollingThunder · Dec 9, 2009

I.M.O.G. said:
It makes perfect sense to me now, sorry for being slow on the uptake.

Wait'll you get my age.............

Neuromancer · Dec 10, 2009

You are not comparing hte same chip in the same box, so would not but any credence in hte testing saying it as good or better. BUT, does stock TIM work "well enough" depends on the manufacturer of course but usually yes. They dont use the bubble gum TIM anymore.

EarthDog · Dec 10, 2009

Although I see the point here, there are incredibly too many variables to make this a valid comparison. If you had the same chips I would be more inclined to think otherwise. I would go along with it if it was tested on one chip stock cooler/TIM and stocker cooler/aftermarket TIM..

Its possible the Tjmax is somehow wrong on your temp program as well.

In my limited experience in this area, temp difference across the same chip on the stock cooler with intel TIM and AS5 were only a few C.

Just throwing some things out there, but yeah, two different chips (lower FSB, half the cache, different VID's, etc) cant be compared together like this for valid results.

RollingThunder · Dec 10, 2009

EarthDog said:
Although I see the point here, there are incredibly too many variables to make this a valid comparison. If you had the same chips I would be more inclined to think otherwise. I would go along with it if it was tested on one chip stock cooler/TIM and stocker cooler/aftermarket TIM..

Its possible the Tjmax is somehow wrong on your temp program as well.

In my limited experience in this area, temp difference across the same chip on the stock cooler with intel TIM and AS5 were only a few C.

Just throwing some things out there, but yeah, two different chips (lower FSB, half the cache, different VID's, etc) cant be compared together like this for valid results.

ED, Neuro,

I agree the examples have flaws but a full 10C is not a trivial difference for chips that are very similar. A few degress Celcius wouldn't have raised an eyebrow. I would like to make valid comparisons but messing with those push-pins turns me off!

Neuromancer · Dec 10, 2009

Chips that are very similar? Maybe.

But, unless you are running them in the exact same case, with same configs, etc. 10C is not that much

Also dont forget that E8XXX software temp reporting usually tends to be off by 10C...

EarthDog · Dec 10, 2009

You are seeing a significant difference b/c of those flaws is what I believe we are both getting at.

*Stock voltage for the chips are likely not the same (Check Coretemp/Realtemp for max VID or VID). So you say you have the same voltages, but if one started off .1 less than the other, than you raised the other... its a difference, significant as its common knlwedlge that voltage raises temps more than clockspeed.

*onboard cache is half. Again, part of the issue

*FSB differences, another part.

All of these, and more (completely different wafer, mounting inconsistencies, etc) are why you are seeing such a large difference. You are comparing an apple to a orange. I would bet if you pressed on the mounting of the warmer cooler youwould see temp drops in less than a minute...

@ Neuro - Temps 10C off in Wolfdale's? That was sort of the Tjmax issue I mentioned above. That has since been corrected (as good as can be) by Realtemp (Unclewebb) and Coretemp. They report accurately as far as we all know now.

RollingThunder · Dec 10, 2009

OK, I'm understanding that to many inconsistencies are at hand. Both were run under Coretemp showing the same voltage, both are still the lowest possible @ stock in the BIOS same motherboards (1.08v at idle). I don't have enough experience with the newer Intel chips to make too many valid observations.

Another error I might have made was to assume both chips are the same except for cache. I had assumed the E7500 was simply an E8XXX that didn't make the grade. Wrong assumption? I've looked at the URLs IMOG posted above on these chips and they are very similar.

Bobnova · Dec 10, 2009

Reported the spam.

I used the intel TIM on my e5200 at first, it worked decently well, chip ran around 50*c stock, i OC'd it to 3250ish and it ran around 65*c. With Arctic Alumina Ceramique, it ran 61-62*f.
Three to four degrees cooler consistently. Lapped with AAC, it ran just under 60.
The intel stock TIM is good, but it is not better (on my cpu, at least) then AAC, which is slightly worse then AS5.

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