80 PLUS (+) when Over Clocking?

00011011 · Apr 12, 2010

Any reason why you wouldn't want to use a highly efficient PSU when attempting significant CPU over clocks?

80 PLUS (80% efficient)
80 PLUS Bronze (82% efficient)
80 PLUS Silver (85% efficient)
80 PLUS Gold (87% efficient)

Drew@PSU · Apr 12, 2010

to the forums!

To answer you question, there is no reason to NOT use a highly efficient PSU, well, basically ever. It helps cut down on your electric bill and since those PSUs are usually of a higher quality, it ensures the quality of power to your components. This is dependent on the quality of the PSU though, not it's efficiency, they just go hand in hand with some brands.

Cowboy X · Apr 12, 2010

I just posted this in another thread but it is relevant here too, especially as you are talking about overclocking :

"It is also important to look at reviews and see where your intended power supply is most efficient. In other words how far along the performance curve does the PS retain an 80+ efficiency and specifically how does the PS do around the load that you intend to put on it."

It is no sense buying a PS that fails to maintain efficiency or quality power output at 650W when you know that your planned system will need 650 W, get something else. It might work if your system only needed 500W ...... maybe the PS's performance might be perfectly fine at that load.

Super Nade · Apr 12, 2010

00011011 said:
Any reason why you wouldn't want to use a highly efficient PSU when attempting significant CPU over clocks?

80 PLUS (80% efficient)
80 PLUS Bronze (82% efficient)
80 PLUS Silver (85% efficient)
80 PLUS Gold (87% efficient)

Energy efficiency of the PSU is an irrelevant metric when it comes to obtaining higher overclocks. In other words, a 70% efficient SPI unit would be a better choice than an 85% efficient Deer unit. The primary consideration when you strive for a higher overclock is stability of power delivery. A measure that quantifies stability is voltage regulation (actually it ought to be current regulation). I would suggest looking at units that are reputed to be stable, instead of going merely by efficiency numbers.

These days, there is a lot of choice available in the market in terms of good, stable PSUs. You don't have to hunt for a Zippy-EMACS to get the job done. There are several units that offer comparable performance for a fraction of the cost.

00011011 · Apr 13, 2010

Thank you all for the feedback.

My system design included: OCZ Z Series Gold OCZZ1000M 1000W ATX12V 2.3/ EPS12V 2.91 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply

I don't intend on fully taxing it, and suspect there will be a bunch of unused wattage. I know OCZ make a lot of high performance SSDs and RAM, but... do they also have the reputation for stability in their PSUs as you suggested important?

Super Nade · Apr 13, 2010

Welcome to the forums!

The unit you have purchased is quite well built. You should not have any problems. OCZ have had their fair share of misses but a majority of their PSUs are very reliable. It all depends on the OEM of the unit. The one you have selected is probably made Sirfa/Sirtec, a decent OEM. Not quite a home-run, but it will get the job done, no problem.

Cowboy X · Apr 13, 2010

00011011 said:
Thank you all for the feedback.

My system design included: OCZ Z Series Gold OCZZ1000M 1000W ATX12V 2.3/ EPS12V 2.91 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply

I don't intend on fully taxing it, and suspect there will be a bunch of unused wattage. I know OCZ make a lot of high performance SSDs and RAM, but... do they also have the reputation for stability in their PSUs as you suggested important?

Don't mind what is in my sig at present, I have the same PS in my system and i like it. The reviews of it so far have been very good. It is one of OCZ's 'hits' but time will tell as far as long term reliability of this model.

Evilsizer · Apr 13, 2010

exactly what computer do you have or gonna have you think you need a 1KW psu?

00011011 · Apr 14, 2010

I'm positive I don't need so much wattage... I guess I'm future proofed...

SYSTEM
Corsair Obsidian 800DW
OCZ Z Series Gold OCZZ1000M 1000W
Asus P6X58D Premium
Intel Core i7-980X Extreme Edition 6-Core
CORSAIR DOMINATOR-GT 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 2000 (PC3 16000) CMG6GX3M3A2000C8
Crucial RealSSD C300 CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1 2.5" 128GB SATA III MLC Flash SSD Reads 355 MB/s, Writes 140 MB/s
Crucial RealSSD C300 CTFDDAC256MAG-1G1 2.5" 256GB SATA III MLC Flash SSD Reads 355 MB/s, Writes 215 MB/s
SAPPHIRE 100283L Radeon HD 5770 (Juniper XT) 1GB

COOLING
Feser Xchanger Triple 120mm Xtreme Performance Radiator
Feser XChanger Single 120mm Xtreme Performance Radiator
Swiftech Apogee XT Extreme
Swiftech MCP655 12v Water Pump w/ Speed Control and 3/8" Conversion Kit (317 GPH)
FrozenQ PC Mods Liquid Fusion Reservoir 275ml with UV Cathode - UV Red Helix
Tygon R-3603 1/2" ID (3/4" OD) - Laboratory Tubing
Bitspower Chrome G1/4" Barb Fitting - 1/2" ID
Aquaero 4.00 USB Fan-Controller with VF-Display

EarthDog · Apr 14, 2010

Since you dont game, you can be futureproofed with a 650W PSU man... Save yourself some coin....not like it looks like you need to with that build!!!

Wait, why 2 rads for only the CPU? That Feser Tri should get you where you want to go (4-4.5Ghz 24/7) no?

00011011 · Apr 15, 2010

You're right, not for gaming at all; its for software development at work.

I've decided not to cut the case (because my cooling needs are not too extreme) so I will down-size the smaller Rad and go with:

Feser Xchanger Triple 120mm Xtreme Performance Radiator
Feser XChanger Single 120mm Xtreme Performance Radiator

But I was hoping to be in the 4.5 - 5.0 GHz range... possible?

EarthDog · Apr 15, 2010

I cant say I know too much about them and their 24/7 operation at 4.5Ghz+. I would imagine 4.5Ghz is doable, but not easy... Maybe someone that owns one will chime in with more accuracy on if thats doable.

Evilsizer · Apr 15, 2010

on a hex core IMO you have a better chance of hitting 4-4.2 ghz then 4.5ghz. the newer rev D0 quad core's, you might get lucky to hit 4.5ghz for 24/7 use. about the only way i think 4.5ghz+ for 24/7 would be possible on a six core cpu is gonna be with a Phase setup for cooling.

EarthDog · Apr 15, 2010

There have been posted 5Ghz on air screenshots... have you seen these things tear up the bot at 6.3Ghz+ on LN2?

I would imagine 24/7 4.5Ghz with water would be possible... anything over that is gravy.

00011011 · Apr 15, 2010

Evilsizer said:
about the only way i think 4.5ghz+ for 24/7 would be possible on a six core cpu is gonna be with a Phase setup

So continuing to add Radiators (and possibly another pump) can't always cut it to reach these goals? Is the problem... that the water just cannot pull the heat out of the CPU water block as fast as the CPU is creating it?

baris_ · Apr 15, 2010

00011011 said:
So continuing to add Radiators (and possibly another pump) can't always cut it to reach these goals? Is the problem... that the water just cannot pull the heat out of the CPU water block as fast as the CPU is creating it?

Probably, that's what came to my mind. Not sure though.

PS: What does the number 27 mean to you?

Bobnova · Apr 15, 2010

The issue is that you can only get your water temps down to close to ambient.
A good 360 on just the cpu with some decent fans should give you a water temp of <10*c warmer then the ambient air temp.
Two 360s might give you 5*c over ambient.
Three 360s might give you 3.5-4*c over ambient.
See where this is going?

Even if you go extreme and use a copper truck radiator and 12" fans, you're still in the 1-2*c above ambient range, which is only 8-9*c colder water temps (and hence, core temps) then a single 360.

It's worth noting that i made all the numbers up on the spot to illustrate the effect.

EarthDog · Apr 15, 2010

00011011 said:
So continuing to add Radiators (and possibly another pump) can't always cut it to reach these goals? Is the problem... that the water just cannot pull the heat out of the CPU water block as fast as the CPU is creating it?

Its not the heat that will be the factor in such a high end water, its the voltage needed to be stable at such clocks. Its not 24/7 voltage I would imagine.

Evilsizer · Apr 15, 2010

EarthDog said:
There have been posted 5Ghz on air screenshots... have you seen these things tear up the bot at 6.3Ghz+ on LN2?

I would imagine 24/7 4.5Ghz with water would be possible... anything over that is gravy.

just CPUZ ss's right? i dont think 5ghz on air for a hex core would be all that stable for a 3D run or 24/7. i could see it being stable enough for a 1m run. i guess i need to hit up XS more...

00011011 said:
So continuing to add Radiators (and possibly another pump) can't always cut it to reach these goals? Is the problem... that the water just cannot pull the heat out of the CPU water block as fast as the CPU is creating it?

like pointed about water it can only do so much.

EarthDog said:
Its not the heat that will be the factor in such a high end water, its the voltage needed to be stable at such clocks. Its not 24/7 voltage I would imagine.

heat is one of the things but the higher voltage on water wouldnt be good IMO. since going on past readings, with higher voltages and getting 24/7 stable. you really need lower temps, like what a phase system would offer. Either that or if it was big enough in terms of the heat load it could handle, a water chiller system.

*edit*
slipped my mind that the new six core cpus are 32nm. you might be able to get away with a quad rad dual fan setup and hit 4.5ghz. im still iffy about a six core cpu doing that for 24/7 usage even at 32nm.

00011011 · Apr 16, 2010

baris_ said:
PS: What does the number 27 mean to you?

my birth day :bday:

Bobnova said:
The issue is that you can only get your water temps down to close to ambient.
A good 360 on just the cpu with some decent fans should give you a water temp of <10*c warmer then the ambient air temp.
Two 360s might give you 5*c over ambient.
Three 360s might give you 3.5-4*c over ambient.
See where this is going?

Even if you go extreme and use a copper truck radiator and 12" fans, you're still in the 1-2*c above ambient range, which is only 8-9*c colder water temps (and hence, core temps) then a single 360.

I guess what I don't understand is... if you do what is required to keep the core temps down and prevent the CPU from burning up, why can't you continue OC'ing... 10 GHz, 100 GHz. Is it the voltage required to do so? At some point, the voltage will not be able to remain in the 32nm process, correct?

Well, all the system components came it today, so I'm a get building. Hopefully the LCS parts will be in early next week. I will post what I get it to. Wish me luck, my first water-cooled system!

:comp:

Thank you all for your input, and taking the time to help others!!!!! Priceless...

80 PLUS (+) when Over Clocking?

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