Need help with overclocking. AN35N Ultra, Hard Locked XP 2500+ Barton, 2 sticks of 256 MB Kingston 2700 value ram, cas 2.5. Bios set to Aggressive and expert on ram, timings 7-3-3-2.5, at sd. setting of 166 processor speed was slightly below rated speed, I changed speed on ram to 168 and processor speed was then slightly above rated speed, I can't go above this or it won't boot. Tried increasing voltage and timing to 11-3-3-2.5 but still no luck. Can this memory be made to run faster? If so at what settings? Or do I need 3200 ram? Thanks
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AN35N Ultra--XP 2500+ Barton--Need OC help
- Thread starter PopRichie
- Start date
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Welcome to the Forums!
It all depends on your RAM as w\o multis your stuck with the default 11X & raising FSB only. You have up to 2.7V Vdimm, which isn't a lot, but depending on your Kingstons default voltage you might make 200FSB. Try upping VDimm to 2.6V and FSB to 170 then run Memtest & see if it passes. If so keep jumping up 5FSB & run Memtest again, when you get errors go to 2.7V VDimm until you get errors then you've reached your max with those sticks. Just don't try to boot into Windows if you're getting errors in Memtest. Make sure you can run at least 1/2 hr with no errors before trying, then run Prime to see if Windows is stable. Errors in Memtest an also be caused by not enough VCore so try that as well if the next level of VDimm doesn't work. Otherwise PC3200 Corsair Value RAM is only $40.00 per 256mb stick - get the CAS2.5 @ 2.5V not the CAS3.0 @2.6V These don't OC much past 210FSB but with a locked multi thats about as fast as your Barty will most likely run anyway but 2.2Ghz-2.31Ghz is a decent OC!
Good Luck!
Regards, Balrog
It all depends on your RAM as w\o multis your stuck with the default 11X & raising FSB only. You have up to 2.7V Vdimm, which isn't a lot, but depending on your Kingstons default voltage you might make 200FSB. Try upping VDimm to 2.6V and FSB to 170 then run Memtest & see if it passes. If so keep jumping up 5FSB & run Memtest again, when you get errors go to 2.7V VDimm until you get errors then you've reached your max with those sticks. Just don't try to boot into Windows if you're getting errors in Memtest. Make sure you can run at least 1/2 hr with no errors before trying, then run Prime to see if Windows is stable. Errors in Memtest an also be caused by not enough VCore so try that as well if the next level of VDimm doesn't work. Otherwise PC3200 Corsair Value RAM is only $40.00 per 256mb stick - get the CAS2.5 @ 2.5V not the CAS3.0 @2.6V These don't OC much past 210FSB but with a locked multi thats about as fast as your Barty will most likely run anyway but 2.2Ghz-2.31Ghz is a decent OC!
Good Luck!
Regards, Balrog
Last edited:
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Hmmmmm!
I don't believe MBM5 reads the VDimm on the AN35N Ultra, at least not on my 2 boards, where are you getting your reading?
VDimm could be 2.71V not 1.71V, that would either be your VCore or VAGP but that usually defaults to 1.5V
Sadly if you are running 2.71V VDimm at PC2700 speeds then its probably PC2100 thats been factory OC'd to those speeds & is already maxed out.
Regards, Balrog
I don't believe MBM5 reads the VDimm on the AN35N Ultra, at least not on my 2 boards, where are you getting your reading?
VDimm could be 2.71V not 1.71V, that would either be your VCore or VAGP but that usually defaults to 1.5V
Sadly if you are running 2.71V VDimm at PC2700 speeds then its probably PC2100 thats been factory OC'd to those speeds & is already maxed out.
Regards, Balrog
- Thread Starter
- #5
I may have miss read MBM or it is a false reading.
Just ran some more tests, settings
Advanced Chipset Features
System Performance--Expert
FSB Frequency 169MHZ
CPU Interface--Aggressive
Memory Freq--By SPD
Memory Timings--Aggressive
CPU Ratio/Voltage Control
CPU Ratio Select--Auto
CPU Voltage Select--Auto
RAM Voltage Select--2.70
AGP Voltage--Auto
Everything runs fine with RAM set at 168, setting to 169, mem test shows RAM 169 FSB 338 but BIOS still says FSB 336 at boot?? Mem test will run at 169 with no errors. Setting RAM to 170 BIOS starts with the usual one short beep, goes to update then gives one long beep and kicks to safe mode and FSB 200? Also tried increasing CPU voltage but same result.
Why is this happening? Could this be for the reason of the possibly factory overclocked RAM or do I have a BIOS problem?
Just ran some more tests, settings
Advanced Chipset Features
System Performance--Expert
FSB Frequency 169MHZ
CPU Interface--Aggressive
Memory Freq--By SPD
Memory Timings--Aggressive
CPU Ratio/Voltage Control
CPU Ratio Select--Auto
CPU Voltage Select--Auto
RAM Voltage Select--2.70
AGP Voltage--Auto
Everything runs fine with RAM set at 168, setting to 169, mem test shows RAM 169 FSB 338 but BIOS still says FSB 336 at boot?? Mem test will run at 169 with no errors. Setting RAM to 170 BIOS starts with the usual one short beep, goes to update then gives one long beep and kicks to safe mode and FSB 200? Also tried increasing CPU voltage but same result.
Why is this happening? Could this be for the reason of the possibly factory overclocked RAM or do I have a BIOS problem?
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Yeah, double check that reading in MBM5 sometime, see if you can find the specs for your RAM at Kingston unless you know what the default timings & VDimm are. 11-3-3-2.5 is a good place to start, so is 2.6V for VDimm. You might want to try setting memory to 100% so that it stays in sync with the FSB, I believe setting it to Auto with FSB set to anything other than 166 will make it run async which kills performance & can cause instabilty. Make sure that Thermal Throttling (if your version of BIOS has this) Logo show & Spread Spectrums are disabled & Fast Writes are enabled. If you aren't using them try disabling your parallel & serial ports in BIOS as it will boot quicker, you can always change them back should you require them.
What brand is your PSU & specs?
How are your temps running?
Regards, Balrog
What brand is your PSU & specs?
How are your temps running?
Regards, Balrog
- Thread Starter
- #7
Balrog,
PSU is El Cheapo, 420watt OKIA, all rails are right on except +12 volt which is 11.72
CPU Temp is 42 C after 1hr. and 15 minutes of running Mem test, but have side off and small fan blowing in case, didn't want to over heat on test.
Setting memory to 100% fixed the problem
Used all your susgested settings and got to 205 on Ram but Mem test found errors on third pass, may try tweaking later, backed down to 200 on Ram and ran Mem test for an 1 hr. and 15 minutes with no errors, Std. test, is there any other Mem test I should run??
Will boot up tomorrow and run Prime 95 on it, didn't realize that it ran from within Windows.
I never ran either of these tests before so any susgestions is appreciated.
Thanks again for your help, I might have found the problem but might have got discourage and stopped trying also.
PopRichie
PSU is El Cheapo, 420watt OKIA, all rails are right on except +12 volt which is 11.72
CPU Temp is 42 C after 1hr. and 15 minutes of running Mem test, but have side off and small fan blowing in case, didn't want to over heat on test.
Setting memory to 100% fixed the problem
Used all your susgested settings and got to 205 on Ram but Mem test found errors on third pass, may try tweaking later, backed down to 200 on Ram and ran Mem test for an 1 hr. and 15 minutes with no errors, Std. test, is there any other Mem test I should run??
Will boot up tomorrow and run Prime 95 on it, didn't realize that it ran from within Windows.
I never ran either of these tests before so any susgestions is appreciated.
Thanks again for your help, I might have found the problem but might have got discourage and stopped trying also.
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Sweet!
Glad it worked out for you!
Yeah time for a new PSU as that 12V rail is too low for stable OCs
You could open it up to see if there are adjustable pots for tweaking the output - but that would void your warranty & is a dangerous if you don't know how to do it.
I use strictly Fortron\Sparkle PSUs & highly recommend them - get at least a 350watt & make sure the product name starts with FSP & not ATX which is the cheaper Power Q line. Antec are always good & if $ is tight TTGI\Superflowers from over at Directron are decent as well.
Seeing as this is a new set-up you'll need to burn everything in real well, after that you might get your FSB a bit higher. I used to run Memtest all night while I slept & Prime all day while I surfed for the first few weeks, that burns it in pretty well. In fact I have my mATX 8RGMi right behind me thats been running Prime all night using a new config, gotta throw it in the case today. You might also want to run some type of graphics benchmark like 3DMark or play a few rounds of your favorite game using FRAPS to measure the performance increase your OC has given you.
Also try SiSoft Sandra as it gives you lots of info regarding your rig as well as benchmarking & burn-in tools.
Good Luck!
Keep us posted!
Regards, Balrog
Glad it worked out for you!
Yeah time for a new PSU as that 12V rail is too low for stable OCs
You could open it up to see if there are adjustable pots for tweaking the output - but that would void your warranty & is a dangerous if you don't know how to do it.
I use strictly Fortron\Sparkle PSUs & highly recommend them - get at least a 350watt & make sure the product name starts with FSP & not ATX which is the cheaper Power Q line. Antec are always good & if $ is tight TTGI\Superflowers from over at Directron are decent as well.
Seeing as this is a new set-up you'll need to burn everything in real well, after that you might get your FSB a bit higher. I used to run Memtest all night while I slept & Prime all day while I surfed for the first few weeks, that burns it in pretty well. In fact I have my mATX 8RGMi right behind me thats been running Prime all night using a new config, gotta throw it in the case today. You might also want to run some type of graphics benchmark like 3DMark or play a few rounds of your favorite game using FRAPS to measure the performance increase your OC has given you.
Also try SiSoft Sandra as it gives you lots of info regarding your rig as well as benchmarking & burn-in tools.
Good Luck!
Keep us posted!
Regards, Balrog
- Thread Starter
- #9
Tried to run Prime, with Ram at 200 but it found errors. Had to back off to 186, it has been running over an hour now, a little disappointing but I think it is a good starting point with the present hardware. As I was typing this, Prime stopped with an error, guess I will try 184 on ram and see what happens. Maybe a little more voltage will help, will try that first.
The Board, Processor and memory are about a year old, new to me however, so I don't think they need much burn in. I did lap the copper pad on the heat sink, CPU temp is holding at 43C with side fan.
As for the games, I am not into that now, guess it is my age, was at one time, just like to try new things and overclocking is the latest.
PopRichie
The Board, Processor and memory are about a year old, new to me however, so I don't think they need much burn in. I did lap the copper pad on the heat sink, CPU temp is holding at 43C with side fan.
As for the games, I am not into that now, guess it is my age, was at one time, just like to try new things and overclocking is the latest.
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
If Memtest is fine @200FSB but Prime gives errors its most likely caused by low VCore or that crappy 12V rail on your current PSU, don't give up hope. If you can run Memtest @200FSB for say 3-4 hours with no errors then you should be OK. Due to low 12V rail you may need to use more VCore as supply is low so its not stable -this will stress the PSU more however & you don't want it to fry - seriously consider a better PSU before pushing too far & killing your rig. Did you ever check for internal pots? I think with a good PSU you'll get 200FSB X 11 stable, whats your HSF? You may need to improve your case ventilation to help keep temps in line.
Regards, Balrog
Regards, Balrog
- Thread Starter
- #11
HSF, they are stock AMD as per sticker on fan.
You just answered my next question about that if Mem test ran with no errors then the problem is not the memory.
Increasing Ram voltage to 2.7 did nothing to help, even got worse on Prime but mem test was still ok.
Will try increasing V Core voltage.
Question why does Bios at boot not report correct 2xRam speed sometimes? But Mem test always does??
PopRichie
You just answered my next question about that if Mem test ran with no errors then the problem is not the memory.
Increasing Ram voltage to 2.7 did nothing to help, even got worse on Prime but mem test was still ok.
Will try increasing V Core voltage.
Question why does Bios at boot not report correct 2xRam speed sometimes? But Mem test always does??
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Yeah, some super-locked Barton 2500+ will run 200FSB on stock Vcore, others won't. As long as your CPU temps are OK you should be able to get it stable @200FSB with no more than 1.75V VCore, anymore means that PSU 12V rail is really bad & you may as well wait until you get a better one.
I'm not sure I understand your BIOS question
Some early BIOS won't tell you that you're in dual channel at boot even though you are.
If FSB is set to say 185 it should read memory running @185Mhz\370 Mhz DDR or something like that as long as you have BIOS set to 100% & not SPD.
Regards, Balrog
I'm not sure I understand your BIOS question
Some early BIOS won't tell you that you're in dual channel at boot even though you are.
If FSB is set to say 185 it should read memory running @185Mhz\370 Mhz DDR or something like that as long as you have BIOS set to 100% & not SPD.
Regards, Balrog
- Thread Starter
- #13
If I put 190 Mhz in as memory speed and save to bios, then let it boot, bios checks memory and then lists 378 DDR instead of 380 DDR?? Doesn't happen at all settings and sometimes the same setting that was off before will be right. However putting in 200 Mhz it lists 400 DDR. Memory is set to 100%. Yes, I am in dual channel. My bios does not report this. Been running Mem test for over 2 hrs. with no errors at 200 Mhz/400 DDR, will also run with older ver. of Mem test. Will switch now.
Thanks,
PopRichie
Thanks,
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
200FSB Cool!!!
The stock AMD sink can cool @2.2Ghz if you lap it well, use a good thermal compound like AS5 or Ceramique & a medium speed fan. If you keep OCing though you might want to invest in a little better cooling so you can run with case side on.
I've recently purchased 2 of these & they work great -all copper, nice 2300rpm quiet 80mm fan for under $19.00 delivered!
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=35-150-040&depa=0
I have one on an MN31N I volt modded to run a Barton 2500+ @2.2Ghz, the other I have on my 8RGMi with a manual speed controlled 80mm fan that keeps things cool up to 2.5Ghz+
The Thermalright ALX-800 is also a nice budget sink but hard to find these days
I use one of these on my AN35N:
http://www.ajump.com/ajump/product.asp?dept_id=3867&pf_id=8840040&sku=99-99-99-99-99-8840040
Ajump are good people - only $29.00 delivered, NewEgg is still trying to get $38.00
Details of my V-12 testing are found here:
http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=257770
Regards, Balrog
The stock AMD sink can cool @2.2Ghz if you lap it well, use a good thermal compound like AS5 or Ceramique & a medium speed fan. If you keep OCing though you might want to invest in a little better cooling so you can run with case side on.
I've recently purchased 2 of these & they work great -all copper, nice 2300rpm quiet 80mm fan for under $19.00 delivered!
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=35-150-040&depa=0
I have one on an MN31N I volt modded to run a Barton 2500+ @2.2Ghz, the other I have on my 8RGMi with a manual speed controlled 80mm fan that keeps things cool up to 2.5Ghz+
The Thermalright ALX-800 is also a nice budget sink but hard to find these days
I use one of these on my AN35N:
http://www.ajump.com/ajump/product.asp?dept_id=3867&pf_id=8840040&sku=99-99-99-99-99-8840040
Ajump are good people - only $29.00 delivered, NewEgg is still trying to get $38.00
Details of my V-12 testing are found here:
http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=257770
Regards, Balrog
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2003
- Location
- N.J. USA
PopRichie, post listing the frequency incorrectly is just a quirk. I've found that 219 is also listed as 436 not 438. The cpu is running at the correct speed though.
- Thread Starter
- #16
Thanks, GrimReality, I suspected that since other things report it correctly.
Each time I tried Prime, I had MBM running but didnt put the Dash Board up, was just looking at temps in system tray, if I had put it up I would have saw that V core was low. Set BIOS to 1.80 on v core then MBM listed it at 1.74, been running, 200/400 and Prime for 4 hrs. now, will leave it run all night, CPU temp is holding at 48C, and Bios shut down is set at 60C, as low as it will go. Hope it runs all night.
PSU is down some but I think the v core regulator is off some also, will verify that tomorrow.
Does anyone know where I can get a PSU schematic? I like fixing or altering, haven't opened this one up yet but if it has pots I would be very surprised.
PopRichie
Each time I tried Prime, I had MBM running but didnt put the Dash Board up, was just looking at temps in system tray, if I had put it up I would have saw that V core was low. Set BIOS to 1.80 on v core then MBM listed it at 1.74, been running, 200/400 and Prime for 4 hrs. now, will leave it run all night, CPU temp is holding at 48C, and Bios shut down is set at 60C, as low as it will go. Hope it runs all night.
PSU is down some but I think the v core regulator is off some also, will verify that tomorrow.
Does anyone know where I can get a PSU schematic? I like fixing or altering, haven't opened this one up yet but if it has pots I would be very surprised.
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Actually a lot of older PSUs had pots, the only newer versions that I know have them are Fortron\Sparkle, PCP & C with 3 each, TTGI\Superflower 2 each & some of the top of the line Enermax & Antecs - don't know how many.
I always run Prime with MBM5 or Speedfan display on screen
AN35Ns undervolt VCore ~.03-.04V so the PSU is most likely causing the rest of your loss. There is plenty of VCore in BIOS so its not really an issue.
Let me know if you find pots & I'll tell you how I tweak my PSUs.
Regards, Balrog
I always run Prime with MBM5 or Speedfan display on screen
AN35Ns undervolt VCore ~.03-.04V so the PSU is most likely causing the rest of your loss. There is plenty of VCore in BIOS so its not really an issue.
Let me know if you find pots & I'll tell you how I tweak my PSUs.
Regards, Balrog
Richie, AN35N actually has working memory dividers. could be the ultra version of the chipset - on my nf7 results are not so good when i try that. i've replaced my sis' burnt nf7 with AN35N and was pleasantly surprized that i could run locked 2500+ at 200 fsb while keeping ram at 166; all stable and with little hit to speed. i don't remember of the top of my head but there's an auto setting for memory fsb somewhere - it should keep your ram at 166. try that, see if it helps.
- Thread Starter
- #19
PSU is new, about a year old but was never used till this build, it was bought for a backup PSU for our Compaq, with 1.3 Duron and my first build, Shuttle AK12, with 1.3 Duron, The old 230W PSU that I used for the AK12 build has pots, and the spec. on it is as good or better than most 250s. I had the 420W PSU so I used it. When I stop Prime from running I will check for pots in the PSU and will post back with findings.
Prime has been running now for 16hrs,plus.
Settings are 2.6V on memory, actual unknown.
V Core set to 1.8, MBM shows 1.74, memory set to 100%, timings 11-3-3-2.5, mem freq. 200Mhz/400DDR, CPU speed shows 2205Mhz. CPU temp is holding at 47to48C.
I am pleased.
Thanks for the reply --mecoleg-- but I don't understand what you are saying, maybe you could explain in more detail. I am a nubee at overclocking. I do know that my CPU is one of the newer ones that is hard locked or multi locked at 11X, and the last time I checked about 6 months ago there was no chip mod that would unlock this CPU. I bought used because of price and in the hope that I would get an earlier processor. No Bios setting can change this as far as I know from reading in Forums. I also tried. From what I have learned is that CPU speed is a multiple of memory speed X CPU setting which in my case is locked at 11X, then 11X200Mhz=2200Mhz CPU speed. I am happy with the present results but always ready to learn dufferent ways of doing things.
Prime has now ran 17 hrs. Happy--Happy--this old lap top that I am using drives me crazy, hate touch pads, allways draging my thumb across it. It was a gift and it works so I guess I shouldn't knock it. Guess if I could type better that wouldn't happen.
Later guys,
PopRichie
Prime has been running now for 16hrs,plus.
Settings are 2.6V on memory, actual unknown.
V Core set to 1.8, MBM shows 1.74, memory set to 100%, timings 11-3-3-2.5, mem freq. 200Mhz/400DDR, CPU speed shows 2205Mhz. CPU temp is holding at 47to48C.
I am pleased.
Thanks for the reply --mecoleg-- but I don't understand what you are saying, maybe you could explain in more detail. I am a nubee at overclocking. I do know that my CPU is one of the newer ones that is hard locked or multi locked at 11X, and the last time I checked about 6 months ago there was no chip mod that would unlock this CPU. I bought used because of price and in the hope that I would get an earlier processor. No Bios setting can change this as far as I know from reading in Forums. I also tried. From what I have learned is that CPU speed is a multiple of memory speed X CPU setting which in my case is locked at 11X, then 11X200Mhz=2200Mhz CPU speed. I am happy with the present results but always ready to learn dufferent ways of doing things.
Prime has now ran 17 hrs. Happy--Happy--this old lap top that I am using drives me crazy, hate touch pads, allways draging my thumb across it. It was a gift and it works so I guess I shouldn't knock it. Guess if I could type better that wouldn't happen.
Later guys,
PopRichie
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2003
- Location
- Massachusetts, U.S.A.
Very Nice!!!
Anything over 12hrs Prime stable is a winner!
I used to run 24hrs but now I find that 12-16hrs seems to yield the same results for me.
But as yours is a new rig the extra is worth it for the burn in value
Temps looks good considering the stock sink - in real world use you'll never push it that hard anyway unless you run folding@home maxed out.
Remember that even though you're running stable with that PSU unless we can tweak that 12V rail its really stressing the PSU & sooner or later something will give & it can take out the MoBo & all the components with it -I got lucky with the one that I fried (cheap generic) in that it only toasted the MoBo. I don't want to sound like a broken record but I'd hate for you to lose your rig.
Regards, Balrog
Anything over 12hrs Prime stable is a winner!
I used to run 24hrs but now I find that 12-16hrs seems to yield the same results for me.
But as yours is a new rig the extra is worth it for the burn in value
Temps looks good considering the stock sink - in real world use you'll never push it that hard anyway unless you run folding@home maxed out.
Remember that even though you're running stable with that PSU unless we can tweak that 12V rail its really stressing the PSU & sooner or later something will give & it can take out the MoBo & all the components with it -I got lucky with the one that I fried (cheap generic) in that it only toasted the MoBo. I don't want to sound like a broken record but I'd hate for you to lose your rig.
Regards, Balrog
