Barcelona And Beyond

[AlabamaCajun]

Looking at the news of 8 core Core Octos Intel is running to Nehalem at breakneck speed. http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/31408/135/
This more I see this stuff, the more I hope AMD has got more than rabbits in there hat. If chipzilla as INQ calls Intel, pulls off this kind of upgrade in 2008 it's going to be a really nasty battle next year. Quads will be the norm and only AMD's will be fully native. It's hard to believe that Intel will be able to get 4 dies on there CPU which means, as the article points out, they have to go with an onboard memory controller. I suspect it will be an onboard 975 ram controller which means the FSB will sill be there but at much higher rates.

What I see coming from this is a change in technology that will move from large centralized cores to cell cores of much smalles size. Only in servers is is necessary to have big caches in all the cores. With developers now looking to go to multiple threads, I can see compilers and code settings assigning worker threads to cores that fit the task. Current GFX cards are using stream processors, game consoles are using cell or cluster processors and Intel just announced an experimental 80 core processor. How this works, is that programs are going to have to split tasks up into thread groups. Some threads are the main body and graphics portions of the program. But if you look at todays games there is all these other little events occurring. All these smaller events, geometry, physics, AI and background actions in games can be split up amongst different processors. With AMD pulling in ATI combined with what is goind on with streame processors, I predict within 2 years we will see a different processor breed coming out. I can envision a 2 and 4 core processor with a cluster of 4 to 128 or more smaller core stream processors on die. Intel is already talking a rebirth of hyperthreading and both are taking about hybrid CPU/GPU on the CPU carrier or on die. I've mentioned this before, make a board with 2 sockets both having ram slots and at HT3 link between them. One for the CPU/PPU and the other for the GPU. If this come about then the next generation of PCs will crush our highest power sucking boxes built today.

AMD it's your move, Just Bring It! .......to my mailbox

 

[AlabamaCajun]

Even more info out on the next move to 45nm and a little bump to DD3. Expect the same jibe when we went to DDR2. Todays DDR2 is already hitting low end DDR3 speed so the complaints will be why change just as with DDR2. By 2009 DDR3 will dominate and DDR3-1200 should be common.

Anyway, a little DT dribble with some positive signs of progress.
http://www.dailytech.com/AMD+45nm+DDR3+and+Socket+AM3+in+2008/article7132.htm

 

[dem0lish3r]

Great finds man, i hope all this promise doesn't taste all bitter in the mouth when its either not fast enough or too expensive.

 

[AlabamaCajun]

If Brisbanes are the R-Derv's (leet) then Barcelona will be the main coarse. Expect them to run 200 2266 and up for the fast ones. Agenas should run about with the comparable Conroe is running.

 

[c627627]

AM2 was released a year ago. Now, what are best AM2 motherboards for overclocking and when were they released?

I assume after a year, best horses are out of the barn or are we still waiting on some as far as AM2 boards go?


I'm asking to get an idea how long after DDR 3 motherboards start arriving will we see a good revision DDR 3 motherboard.

When I do my drive image files, I want them to last (still on Socket A because of them )

 

[AlabamaCajun]

It's hard to put a best of sticker on the AM2 as most of the heavy spenders got sucked over to Intel. A lot of the AMD fan crowd as you've seen from posts are waiting until at least AM2+ for the faster HT. DFI still has the best overclock hardware for BIOS settings, ASUS is nearly as much OC but IMO, makes a little better boards. Biostar and ASRock both have good oc abilities with Biostar selling more boards than all the rest it seems. I also like ECS for having solid crash surviving budget boards that oc nicely on stock settings for SSF and Folding rigs. ECS has SLI and one top of the line board but can't touch the OC of the rest.

AM2+ will get you better HT if you want SLI stream processor cards NV8800 or ATI HD29xx that are bandwidth hogs.
AM3 will add the DDR3 which now that Intel has released near plans for DDR3 will mean AMD should be getting there next year.

As for you original quest to check how long maturity take. For AM2 it only took 2 months before we saw good boards but not the best. Biostar was there from the release with ASUS. Others followed within the next month. DFI took almost 6 months to get a few boards out which helped kill AM2 enthusiasm IMO. From all indications AM3 should be out in Q1 08. AM2+ should have mature boards by then so AM3 is just a DIMM socket change so give them 1-2 months to get a good selection.

 

[Memphis69]

the bottom line is if your an AMD fanboy ( witch i am ) its amd or no way for me.. and that the way it needs to be... let the sell outs to go intel and when amd reigns again then they will be back just like all the other ship-jumping sell outs... i really think that AMD as " it " in its sights " it " just needs to happen my guess 2-3Q of 07 well should see new goodies something to take on the c2d team... but thats just my 2 cents take it for just rambling b/c thats all it really is. lol

 

[c627627]

6 months, OK. So AM3 might be out in Q4 2008 actually so that would put a decent board on the market Q1 2009.

Since when does Asus make top notch overclocking mobos? Nice extras, sure but performance wise, they used to be no match for the likes of even cheap Solteks, are you sure Asus changed?


And yes DFI came out very late with the Socket A too. Even Abit took a while. Yeah, looks like it's 2009 for me then...

 

[The_Iceman]

6 months, OK. So AM3 might be out in Q4 2008 actually so that would put a decent board on the market Q1 2009.

Since when does Asus make top notch overclocking mobos? Nice extras, sure but performance wise, they used to be no match for the likes of even cheap Solteks, are you sure Asus changed?


And yes DFI came out very late with the Socket A too. Even Abit took a while. Yeah, looks like it's 2009 for me then...

Asus currently has a few boards that are the top C2D boards and their AM2 boards are top notch as well. Better than DFI's AM2 Lanparty board, their Infinity line for AM2 is better.
In the past, the Asus P4C-800E Deluxe was THE top socket 478 board, though up until recently, their AMD boards were lacking. Right now, Asus is top for AM2.

BTW, greetings to all. My first post.

 

[AlabamaCajun]

the bottom line is if your an AMD fanboy ( witch i am ) its amd or no way for me.. and that the way it needs to be.

I resemble this remark

Welcome: The_Iceman

ASUS can't beat the DFIs when oced at least in the $50-$150 range, too many people here can attest to that being the middle ground for ocers.

P4C800E "was" the king for a long time, too long. The thing is technology has gotten so refined for MOBOs that the line between best and good is narrow but we still have some dogs, always will.

 

[The_Iceman]

I resemble this remark

Welcome: The_Iceman

ASUS can't beat the DFIs when oced at least in the $50-$150 range, too many people here can attest to that being the middle ground for ocers.

P4C800E "was" the king for a long time, too long. The thing is technology has gotten so refined for MOBOs that the line between best and good is narrow but we still have some dogs, always will.

My first board for AM2 was an Abit KN9-SLI, what a nightmare that board was. No PCI lock, USB ports quit working and the worst part, the PCI-E voltage spike was so bad, it killed my 7800GT (It would jump from 1.49 to 1.89v quickly).
I then purchase the DFI Infinity NF UltraII-M2, that was a very good board. It took all my peripherals without a hitch and overclocked very nicely.
I then got a new Asus M2N-SLI Deluxe for a great price, so I replaced the DFI. The Asus has been just as trouble free and overclocks a bit better than the DFI. That could, however, just be luck of hardware matching up nicely.
So if you can't agree they are the best right now, they are at the very least, top contenders.

 

[AlabamaCajun]

I have to agree from looking at the review track record. I've bought a lot of ASUS boards in the past and still like their boards but the prices were a little high for decent boards. A lot of the lower cost ASUS boards had Via and SIS chipsets where other brand boards had NVidia and ATI in the same price range. I'm strongly considering an Asus when I go for my next main rig build to replace my P4C800E, ECS and DFI are still on the list but so far the Quality is still on ASUS's side.
With the Phenum FX going to socket F,F+ I'm leaning toward the LN series but I only want the 2 card SLI version. I'm not a heavy gamer but I need CPU power and awesome graphics. For the most part all I need is one great Vid card and I'm happy. Civ 4 eats lots of CPU and only needs a generous GFX card to run. I would have gone with the current LN1 but it was overkill.

 

[IAmMoen]

I have the new name for amd. The Octeron. Or is that what they are going to be called. Either dual quad cores on one die or a 8 core architecture will be the octeron.

 

[AlabamaCajun]

Solid numbers on Barcelona performance, but we need to see the data not a blurry picture.

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39756

If this holds true then you can OC the competitor until the chip glows and still not beat K10!

 

[hUMANbEATbOX]

i wouldn't call those numbers solid, but at least they are numbers.

the score went from 2200 to 4000, and the amount of cores went from 2 to 4. if this bench was written to exploit 4 cores, then this isn't a massive gain. i would hope for at least a 100% improvement with 100% more cores and a supposedly much faster architecture.

maybe i would be more impressed by these numbers if there were anything in the way of details provided. so we continue to wait...

 

[Douken]

.... From all indications AM3 should be out in Q1 08.....

Don't you agree Q1 2008 is helllll waaayyy too soon, its like giving AM2+ less than 10 months of life. I believe Q4 2008 to Q2 2009 sound more likely to be.

 

[AlabamaCajun]

8 months to 1 year remains to be the current window. DDR3 and PCIE-2 are starting to become reality, how long can they wait. Remember socket 754?

HB, the real numbers remain to be seen like two enemy quads in a dual or an Athlon X2 facing a Phenom clock-clock.
We wait

 

[Molester]

here's what we know based on links:

it's 4 quad-cores K10's vs. 4 dual-core K8's, everything else is the same except the bios update for the K10's

the quad-cores are in the 65w thermal envelope, and not the highest clocked versions to be released when K10 is released

K10's did just over 4000 pixels/s in 56 seconds

K8's did ~2200 pixels/s in 112 seconds

http://www.uberpulse.com/us/2007/05/quadcore_opteron_demo_barcelona_twice_as_fast.php
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39756

it would have been nice to see dual-core vs dual-core, or even 2 quads vs the 4 duals....

but here's what we can take from this:

the K10's performed almost twice the pixels/sec in half the time

if K8 and K10 performed exactly the same, one could assume that twice the amount of cores would account for half the time OR twice the pixels/s, BUT NOT BOTH

 

[ronaldo]

If K10 finished in 56s vs 112s this is a around 2x faster, so nothing to be happy about. And a note: Both systems were equally configured with the processors at equal clock frequency and running the POV-Ray benchmark.

Its normal that K10 scored 4000 if it finished 2x times faster, its like in cinebench, a cpu that get 2x score, do this in 2x less time, and that DONT MEAN IS 4x faster, but only 2X.

 

[IAmMoen]

K10's did just over 4000 pixels/s in 56 seconds

K8's did ~2200 pixels/s in 112 seconds

the K10's performed almost twice the pixels/sec in half the time

These are contradictory. Because you say it performs at 4000 pixels PER SECOND not 4000 pixels over 56 seconds (likewise 2200 pixels per second not 2200 pixels over 112 seconds). So it is only 2x and not 4x because it is going through the SAME amount of pixels, it is just that one does it at a faster rate, i.e. a faster time as well.