E4300@3GHz w/ Thermalright 120 Extreme - expected temps?

[Notlag]

I'm running an E4300 at 3GHz (9x 333FSB) at 1.2875V cooled by a Thermalright 120 Extreme. I have the voltage set to 1.2875V (below rated maximum of 1.325V - have found it to be stable at the lower voltage so I left it), but I'm concerned that I'm still receiving temperatures higher than what I'd expect for that speed / voltage / CPU. Following are measurements taken at two different times (case temp being the CPU temp reading given by the mainboard, and TAT being the internal temperature given by Intel Thermal Analysis Tool):

Ambient: approx 22C to 23C
Idle: 24C (case) / 39C (TAT)
Super Pi + Prime95: 43C (case) / 56C (TAT)
100% Load via TAT: 48C (case) / 61C (TAT)

Ambient: approx 26C to 27C (best guess - was after room had heated up some w/ a couple people and PC's in it)
Idle: 25C (case) / 41C (TAT) [measurement may be invalid due to SpeedStep]
Super Pi + Prime95: 47C to 48C (case) / 60C to 61C (TAT)
100% Load via TAT: 52C (case) / 66C (TAT)

Given that I'm not over-voltage and I know people run E4300's over 3GHz, I'm a little concerned by the temperatures - I would have expected lower w/ the Thermalright 120 Extreme (beast of a heat sink). I've tried re-installing the heatsink with varying amounts of thermal compound, to see if I was using too much or two little, but temperatures don't change hardly at all whether I use a grain of rice, a BB, or twice that. Currently I'm using some Antec Silver Reference thermal compound that I've had around for a few years, but has worked ok on other machines that are running stock.

Might I fare better using AS5 compound? Should I see about lapping the heatsink / heatspreader? Should I be applying a different amount of compound or applying it differently (I've always used the edge of a sheet of paper to spread it smoothly over the whole surface of the heatspreader, rather than leaving a blob in the middle and trusting to pressure to spread it out)?

Any thoughts much appreciated

Mike

 

[allen1090]

that does seem pretty warm.
the quad in siggy gets to around 62c with quad prime with ambient in the low 20's

edit: have you tried using a utility knife blade to check the flatness of the ihs/hsf

 

[jason4207]

Well the directions say to leave a blob, and so I do. I don't think you should spread it. For one it may introduce air bubbles, and two it may get lint from the paper in there. I'm not familiar w/ AS-Reference, but I know the AS5 is good. There are newer products out there (MX-2) that I'd like to try, though.

Your temps do seem a little high. How is your case cooling? I got an e6300 up to 3GHz undervolted w/ the stock HSF, and my temps were about the same as yours.

Lapping can only help. Don't spread the thermal compound unless the instructions for that reference stuff advise it. Now seems like a great time for you to try some new thermal grease. For the investment you can't go wrong!

 

[Notlag]

I'll check those things out

Guess I'm going to try some different thermal compound and see if that helps. I'll also try the utility knife trick to see how flat the heatsink is and may consider lapping it regardless.

As far as the thermal compound goes, just about a BB size bit in the middle and then put the heatsink down on it?

Also, is there anything else I could have done on my end that would affect the temperatures?

As for ventilation, right now I've been doing system testing and burn-in with the case laying flat and the side panel removed, so the heatsink fan (an Antec Tricool 120mm at high) should be sucking in air at ambient temperature. Eventually when I do close it up it should still be well ventilated (I'm mounting a side intake fan that will blow air to the inlet side of the heatsink fan).

Mike

 

[jason4207]

BB size...ehh...it's tough to get it right. I don't want to say yes or no, but you had the right idea above where you tried a little less...a little more. If you try an amount and then pull the HS off and it hasn't spread very far then you need a little more, but every time I do it I end up putting too much, and usually the 2nd or 3rd time I get it right. Try using less. I find less is more!

 

[Notlag]

Ok, so I started by lapping my CPU heat spreader and my heat sink. I started with 320 grit to flatten them out and worked up to 2000 grit. By the time I was done they had a nearly mirror finish (will see about getting some pics up at some point) and both show good flatness (very little distortion in the images reflected in the surface - just a bit of bending at the edges, so the middle is flat while the edges are slightly rounded off). To give you some idea of how flat they are now, I can run them with -no- thermal compound and only run about 3C warmer than with it.

But there's still the problem - while the lapping took 3C or 4C off my temps, with ambient temps in the mid-20's I'm still running around 60C measured w/ TAT using TAT to stres it, and about 56C using Orthos (again measured w/ TAT). Case temps are generally about 13C lower, which is typical. My idle temps on the other hand are pretty good - around 38C TAT / 23C case, which is basically ambient temperature.

I've tried it with no compound (about 3C warmer), a thin little line of compound down the middle as per Arctic Silver's directions, a few small dots on the top, and spreading out a thin layer out across the whole top of the heat spreader using a razor. All yield similar results. I could use more compound, but I would think that worse at this point - when I dismount the heatsink it's clear the compound is 'squished' out of the middle and spread all the way to the edges as a small amount overflows around all the edges.

Any idea what gives? Or other suggestions? The difference between idle and 100% load is around 22C. With the Thermalright Ultra 120 eXtreme I should be seeing a quarter to half that difference, and load temps around 10C to 12C over ambient. From what I've read it's not unreasonable to expect the Ultra 120 eXtreme to yield an overall thermal conductivity of about 0.1C/W (especially given the Antec fan I have on it is rated at 79CFM). Even at purely stock speeds (where idle temps are almost the same), the difference between idle and load is about 14C.

This seems way out of line, especially considering the lapping. Could I have either a defective CPU (not sure how that would affect it), or a defective heatsink (poor heat transfer from the base through the heat pipes)? The heatsink doesn't even become warm to the touch (admittadly it is a large heat sink so the heat is spread out a lot).

 

[pullmyfinger]

I would guess it's poor connection from base to heatpipe