Why wouldnt you use AA and AF?

[Matthias99]

You toggle it in the driver settings (right-click on the desktop, choose "Properties", and keep drilling into the "Advanced" menus until you get to the ATI settings pages) -- either you can set it to "Application", in which case games that support it should have an option to turn it on/off, or you can manually set it to whatever level you want and it will always be on. Also note that you can set it separately for OpenGL (Quake3, RTCW, etc.) and D3D (UT2K3, HL/CS, most other games). I think the 9600Pro should run alright with it at 4xAA/4-8xAF in most games, unless you're pushing the resolution way up. Give it a shot and see what works best for you.

And it only affects 3D mode. It doesn't make sense to try to anti-alias your desktop, as it isn't being "rendered" in the same way and so any aliasing is inherent to the image.

 

[GWN]

thanks!

 

[Overclocker550]

hows your 9600 pro? how much slower do games run now than your old ti4200? how many 3dmark 2001 did you lose?

 

[CamH]

hows your 9600 pro? how much slower do games run now than your old ti4200? how many 3dmark 2001 did you lose?

And a few more questions for you: How much did your visual quality increase? How much did your 3Dmark03 score increase?

Nice buy with the 9600! Much better than any GeForce 4.

 

[CrystalMethod]

The difference in detail is very very noticable. Anyone who says its not has their head shoved up thier rectum where they can't see to clearly.

Hmmm... Noticible? Yes. Necessary to play? Hardly. (I'll assume we're talking about games, not rendering 3D graphics).

 

[harryinny3]

Well oc550

I will Gaurentee his games did NOT slow down. Um do you remember i HAVE a Ti4200? HELLO!

And Whats the deal with the 3dmark2001 love affair? It proves NOTHING with todays cards. You can NOT use todays features On cards and in drivers with the thing. 3dmark is a true test of cards today. You wont mention 3dmarko3 because YOUR card wont run the dang thing and if it does your scores so low your embarresed to post it.

Ill agurentee HIS 9600PRO whoops your old rusty 4200's butt in 03. Thats what counts, Not that outdated 2001 benchmark you rely on to make your card look better than it will EVER be in TODAYS games, not the games of YESTERYEAR.

Enjoy your DX9 Card man, It will rock your G4 in TODAYS games.

Harry

PS. Set your aa and af to where your frame rates are still good. YOU WILL NOTICE a difference in IQ! AF is a bit better to use more of than the AA. if you can and still get great framerates.

 

[JigPu]

3DMark01 is still as valid this year as it was last year, as it was valid the year before. A benchmark is a benchmark, and it does exactly that. While it may not test all the features of the card, it still tests some of them. It won't give you the complete picture, but one set of numbers rarely does. Multiple benchmarks are the only way to truly assess a system's (and video card's) performance.

Currently, Today's games still do not use DX9 to any significant extent. They (like the games of Yesteryear) still use DX8, and still are great games. 3DMark03 shows what cards should do on future games (Doom, HL, ect.), utilizing DX9. 3DMark01 shows what cards should do on current/past games using DX8.


Yes, the 9600 will indeed do quite well for Tomorrow's games (congrats on the purchace GWN!), does rock for Today's games, and kicks butt for Yesteryear's games.



[devil's advocate mode]
Apparently though, OC550 does not care about rocking games. He wants a game to be playable, and enjoy the game simply because it's a game, not becuase he can enjoy that game with full quality settings at a nice resolution. If he did care about rocking, he wouldn't have a TI4200, would he? He's not stupid enough to not know that modern cards are faster, have better IQ, and can play DX9 games in all their glory. But he knows that the game will be the same, regradless of jaggies, regardless of PS2.0 in all it's glory, regardless of the loss of quality settings. The game is a game, and making it look prettier only makes it easier on the eyes and brain

The man is happy, leave him alone
[/devil's advocate mode]

JigPu

 

[theflyingrat]

hows your 9600 pro? how much slower do games run now than your old ti4200? how many 3dmark 2001 did you lose?

Hahahahah! I'm using a Ti4200... and it's definitely nothing special for most any game I play. The quinnux (sp...bah, who cares, it's a useless mode) anti-aliasing mode looks like garbage. Seriously, ATI's 2x Performance mode on the 8500 rocked this thing. Just like for overall image quality. And trying to use any setting and still get playable FPS above 4x for AF is a lost cause.

In some games, the Ti4200 can make a decent accounting of itself in raw FPS with no FSAA or AF turned on. But I have to admit, it still doesnt' look half as good as a 9600's picture. I guess that's just my preference. But that's also why I'll be upgrading in the next few months. I play a lot of flight sim, where most lines are on a near-hoizontal or near-vertical plane. Thus, jaggies even make themselves noticed distinctly at 1600x1200 resolution. It's preferable to use one res setting down a notch and FSAA instead - jaggies disappear almost completely with the right settings. And the 4200 doesn't have the horsepower for that, as sad as that is.

I used to have an 8500 LE. I bought it for $85 at the time. I sold it and replaced it with the Ti4200 that I purchased for $175, not more than a few months later. It's the most 'meh' upgrade I've ever made. The 8500 could be doing just as well as the 4200 if I'd still had it.

And I can't even belive that people still CARE about 3DMark2001. Seriously. IT'S NOT A REAL GAME! It tells me nothing about how any of my games will actually run. Just how well my system will run 3DMark2001. Even if I upgraded to a different card and lost 3000 3DMarks if I bought a 9600, I know I'd be getting higher FPS in the games I play while using high FSAA and AF settings. And much better image quality to boot.

 

[TruckyJ]

Hmmm... Noticible? Yes. Necessary to play? Hardly. (I'll assume we're talking about games, not rendering 3D graphics).

Yes, I was refering to games. Of course it's not necessary. However, the ability to run image quality features without a big performance hit is a great thing. I am glad that manufacturer's keep working on creating less and less of discrepancy between "stock" performance, and performance when image quality settings are enabled.

As far as Oc550's usual TI4200 rant/trouble making...heh. I just gotta say that while the TI4200 is a great card (especially when on considers its current price), its not a 9600pro. It doesn't perform better in terms of gameplay. It just doesn't. The question, "how much slower do games run now than your old ti4200?" is asinine. Most games run better from what I've seen except for high fps games using openGL (quake 3). In this case, the framerate hit seems irrelevant since the game still runs extremely fast. Furthermore, while 3dmark 2001 scores are one way to look at a card, its not a well rounded way that is indicitive of the full picture on a graphics card.

Here's a link from hardocp concerning using futuremark's benchmarks.

Linky

It's one of the better reads I've had in a while. What's said makes 100% sense in my book. Enjoy.

 

[Overclocker550]

"anti-aliasing mode looks like garbage."


exactly. listen guys, he is right. I also tried it on a ti4200 and ti500 and it doesnt seem any better than no aa to me. it just blurs the jaggies. maybe from a distance it may help a bit or in high res, but I gain triple the fps without aa so forget aa. and if you dont like jaggies, just run 1600x1200, they are so small just look 2 feet from the screen and its pratically clean

 

[harryinny3]

oc550 come on now please

"Hahahahah! I'm using a Ti4200... and it's definitely nothing special for most any game I play. The quinnux (sp...bah, who cares, it's a useless mode) anti-aliasing mode looks like garbage."

He was talking about useing it on his 4200. AA looks awesome on my ATI card. And i dont have to overdrive my monitor neither.


Harry

 

[JigPu]

My best friend has a 4200, so I'll see just what it's AA looks like. AFAIK most of the time he keeps it off since it can't handle it, but I'm interested in seeing just what it looks like. I've taken some screenshots with and without AA on my card, and I would be interested in a comparison between each card's AA.

AA is just for me, but whatever man
JigPu

 

[harryinny3]

Yah, I got some screenshots too

There is a noticable difference with aa and af on. I took shots at different res and different aa and af settings. Its cool to see the differences of each picture. But what amazes me is the IQ of the ATI cards. Stunning.

Harry

 

[StillLife]

I have grown tired of overclocker550's 4200 fanboy rant. Someone please give him a newer ATI card, he is suffering from delusions. I have friends that have The 4200 and the 9600 pro and hands down the 9600 pro looks nicer, there may be a difference in framrate if you actually looked at the numbers, but its not perceptable to me whatsoever. I did percieve the better image quality though and so have my friends.. 9600 pro wins... Thats why I am going to get a 9600xt and my friend that has a ti 4200 is going to get the same.

He needs his AA and AF turned off to make the girl in his avatar hot and thin!

 

[CamH]

He needs his AA and AF turned off to make the girl in his avatar hot and thin!

Actually, if you think about it, the lines on the girl are blurred. That's all AA does. Blurs lines to make them look smooth.

 

[Overclocker550]

I might grab a 9600(se) on black friday depending on prices and if it bundles free hl2

 

[harryinny3]

Oc550 Where ya live?

If there is a compusa near you they have the Pro for $149 and it includes the HL2 coupon. Also If you have that coupon the guy at bestbuy today told me that Valve is letting anyone with the coupon DL the first HL and any of the extras(Everything) That they put out before HL2. Then you get HL2 when its released.


Harry

 

[Overclocker550]

wow nice so you basically get BOTH HL1 and HL2? neat! I have never seen a HL2 coupon in a 9600 pro, just 9600xt($200) and 9600se($130) but theres a rumor that the 9600(could be the se) will be $70 on black friday. I know the 9600s, especially the se is crap but I get both half life games free and I can always resell the 9600se(ill try it first with aa/af just to see the deal with it) on ebay and get my money back so basically free games

 

[harryinny3]

Could be the se on black friday

But i was told that its the NP 9600. But as i stated The 9600pro does come with HL2. So expect a little price drop on the XT version soon. Valve Is offering The downloads of there First HL to us ATI folks because they feel they Want to Make what has gone wrong with the HL2 relese(though its not there fault) Right.

I think its a great gesture and applaud valve for it.

Harry

 

[snyper1982]

"anti-aliasing mode looks like garbage."


exactly. listen guys, he is right. I also tried it on a ti4200 and ti500 and it doesnt seem any better than no aa to me. it just blurs the jaggies. maybe from a distance it may help a bit or in high res, but I gain triple the fps without aa so forget aa. and if you dont like jaggies, just run 1600x1200, they are so small just look 2 feet from the screen and its pratically clean

he was talking about a garbage aa mode on an old card. quincux aa, is extremely blurry. it supposed to offer performance and quality, but it just blurs, true aa doesnt blur, if i remember right, and if it does, it is not NEARLY as noticeable, except for the fact that it is jaggyless. i played mafia with and without, and it makes a world of difference in it. but you know what, i didnt notice any framerate drop. hmm i wonder why that is? oh yeah, cause i run ati! LOL