dual core/ quad core...

how would one determine if he could maximize his output by using a quad core processor or even a dual core...how would these two compare running astronomy software?

I am looking to build a computer to run my telescope and it will need to have 4 or 5 seperate programs running at the same time...there's no way to limit these...it is what it is...what I'm trying to figure out is if I need the fastest CPU (being dual core or quad core) with the largest bus to keep things from getting dropped/lag as data passes back and forth from the scope mount to the computer and from the guide scope to the computer and finally the image from the camera being downloaded to the computer...

For a little clarification...

Mount control = planetarium program and EQMOD run USB (or serial if there is a serial port - there will be a serial port!!)
Guide Cam = Starshoot autoguider camera and PHD Guiding run USB
Main Camera = capture program run USB

It doesn't sound like alot but seems to be very taxing on a computer when we are doing this for 6 to 8 hours a night...the mount tracks the object across the sky while autoguiding issues corrections so I don't have star trails...and well the capture program kinda speaks for itself...

On another note...I have an older custom build from a few years ago...Its got an ASUS P3B-F MB the rev on the board is 1.03 so I can not go any higher than a PIII 600 cpu (which it has...showing as 601 Mhz w/ 100 Mhz FSB)...I just ordered 3 sticks of 256MB SDRAM to top out the memory at 1 gig...my question is will overclocking the cpu help in this situation and where might I find overclocking info on a PIII 600...I'm actually a little out of my league when it comes to this type tweaking but if I had a good set of "destructions" I could probably pull it off...

right now I use my laptop to do run everything but its alot newer...and every once in awhile it will lock up when I'm on an imaging run...so if nothing else I would like to split the main camera off to the laptop and let the other computer run the mount...but it would be nice to be able to do it all off one machine...



Thanks for any insight you might offer on the subject...

Welcome to the Forum! http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=491697 tiggere
What's your budget?

seeing as how its going to be an observatory comp only...as cheap as possible that will do the job without fail...its hard to put a number to something until you figure out exactly what its going to take processor wise to make everything work...

I guess I also need to ask what you guys think the limiting factor is going to be in a system like this...do I need something I can throw tons of memory at...is the FSB the limiting factor and I need to step up to something like the LGA1366 with QPI? don't really want to OC it or go bonkers but I do need a super dependable and stable system that will just hum along without a care...

If I was to put a price to it probably in the $1000/$1200 range...it doesn't need a huge HD...or even a sound card for that matter...no HDTV outputs...nothing fancy/showy...just a hardcore work machine...

More cores imho. Multi-threading is the current directions of software. You can get some good deals on quad cores.

I doubt you'll be doing anything TOO crazy with this besides running typical astronomical software and other misc apps...so you prob would be fine with a dual core. Really comes down to your budget. You could grab an i3 for under $150 or you might even consider going with AMD, they have some great procs for super good deals.

Oh yeah if you're not gaming or going to be doing anything than processing raw data you could def get an i7 with that budget. Ideal work machine = lots of memory && fast good processor.

If your running 4 or more programs at the same time..then a quad core is probably the way to go for you.

If you can afford 1000$ to 1200$ the I would go for socket 1156 with the new i5 2.66ghz 750 CPU (199$)or i7 860 at 2.8ghz (279$)

The main difference between (Other then clock speed) is the 860 has "Hyperthreading" and that will add 4 "Virtual" CPU's (So you can have 8 software threads running at the same time) It's not a must have thing, sometimes it helps people that have alot of programs running at once, but it realy depends on the software...it's up to you if you think the extra 140mhz and Hyperthreading are worth 80$

Read this article: http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3641

I should also mention that Intel CPU's (Unlike AMD) also have "Turbo Mode" wich under the right conditions, can "Auto Overclock" and give you a nice little speed boost...though some articles I have read suggest that the gains from this are not substantial, but they are there.

Though you may be tempted by AMD's lower price up front...they are in general a bit more power hungry than an Intel, so overtime you do get back some of that money in your electric bill.

I suggest you read all the current articles from Anandtech (Say the first 2 pages) to see the pro's and cons of ALL the latest offerings from AMD and Intel so you can make an informed decision.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/

I spent about 20 minutes putting together a sample setup, that includes everything for around 900$ when you use combo deals and a few rebates (I don't worry about rebates when choosing parts...if they have them great, most people never send them in)

It Includes Windows 7 64bit, a DX-11 Video card, 8GB of memory, 1TB hard drive, DVD burner, an energy efficient and highly rated single rail power supply...if you hung on to a 600MHZ P-3 all this time, you don't upgrade often so I took that into account when I chose these parts..should make it another 10 years! (Your software might not work on Win 7 64 bit, if not I suggest getting Windows XP 32 bit)

The motherboard also supports USB 3.0 and Sata 3, things I think will be important down the road, and you might regret skipping.

319$ I5-750 and Gigabyte socket 1156 motherboard combo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.319613

159$ Corsair DDR3 1333MHZ 4GB kit(You have to order 2 of them for 8GB!)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145251

79$ Corsair 550 watt energy efficient Power Supply
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139004

95$ Seagate 1TB hard drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148433

99$ ATI 5670 DX-11 512MB video card
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161319

59$ Antec Mid Tower case (Has good cooling and free shipping, most cases are 15-20$ shipping)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042

23$ DVD burner (SATA! Don't get the IDE version, they slow your whole system down)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136167

104$ Windows 7 64 Bit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116754

943$ total
13$ shipping
956$ grand total (936$ if you send in the 20$ rebate)

EDIT: I forgot to use 2 promo codes they have, wich shave 13$ more off the price! (920$)

Like I said, I carefully chose things that will last and are good values, buying the cheapest part is not always the best, I read the customer reviews and I have kept current with hardware overall by reading most of the new articles on a weekly basis at places like Anandtech or Hard OCP.

That being said..you could probably chop a few hundred or more off the price if you want to cut some corners (I don't mean sacrificing the quality of the parts though!) Going to a 30-40$ DX9 or 10 video card, an AMD Quad or even a dual core, smaller hard drive, less memory, cheaper case etc. I do suggest you get that power supply though for whatever build you go with..too many people get that 30-40$ el- cheapo and it fails, or even worse takes out your system with it! (Not to mention they aren't as kind with your electric bill!)

EDIT 2: You could also go to Dell and for nearly the same price (900$) you can get the XPS 9000 that has an i7 2.66ghz CPU, 3GB of memory, and a 500GB Hard Drive, and on board video! (Note the sarcasm)

http://www.dell.com/us/en/home/desk...=desktop-studio-xps-9000&s=dhs&cs=19&ref=dthp

I also spent a bit of time looking up your old 600MHZ system!

First thing I should mention though is that when you spring for the memory I hope it was 133MHZ, not the garden variety 100MHZ..it may make it more difficult (But not impossible) to Overclock...maybe you can return it and get the 133mhz stuff if it's not to late...though sometimes it's REALY expensive, and not worth it!

By simply changing your FSB to 133MHZ, you will end up with a 800MHZ proccesor. (You might also have to increase the CPU voltage)

Here are the other settings:
105FSB=630MHZ
110FSB=660MHZ
120FSB=720MHZ
140FSB=840MHZ
150FSB=900MHZ

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/mainboards/display/asus-p3b-f.html

Now pay attention to the chart that is similar to the one above...you will see it list the PCI Frequency...it's oringinally supposed to be 33MHZ, and once you start getting much over that it can mess with your AGP video card (If you have one and not a PCI card...though some video cards back then were designed with this in mind but they are rare)

The "Ideal" setings are 100, 124 and 133MHZ to keep the PCI bus at or below 33MHZ, only testing can confirm one way or another.

Not all P-3 600's are created equal...if you have the "E" version..it is a potential good overclocker (850MHZ in the article below) the EB's have 133FSB and are harder to OC, and the early ones are built using a different core and don't do so well (Maybe 650-700MHZ)
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/600eoverclocking/

You can either look on the CPU itself, or the easy way is to get a program called CPUID and find out that way.

http://www.cpuid.com/

Another motherboard review with Overclocking info:

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=160&page=4

You might want to se what revision motherboard you have, some of them can support higher clocked CPU's (Up to 1.4ghz) with a Bios update!

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/149216-30-asus-bios-speed

Here is the newest "Beta" bios I could find, I would update to this if you plan on overclocking or upgrading the CPU.

http://fileforum.betanews.com/detail/ASUS-BIOS-P3BF/949353102/1

On a very "Personal" note, I have a soft spot for Overclocking old hardware..I have an AMD K6-2 533MHZ that I have running at 605MHZ..wich believe me, is hauling butt for a K6-2!

It's at #8 overall at the K-6plus website, and is actually the second fastest K6-2 (Number one is 632MHZ, and it was a rare 550MHZ model..I have the fastest 533!)
The rest of the spots are taken by the K6-3 CPU's wich are much easier to OC.
http://www.k6plus.com/ocdb/frontend/ (Sort by MHZ and look for $Solid$ Necro)

Sooo...If you want some personal help on your old school endevor, want more advice on the new build..or maybe talk astronomy or quantum physics, add me to your MSN or Yahoo IM:

[email protected] works for both and is my email too.

EDIT: and FYI, if you go with the socket 1156 Intel system and a board like the one I reccomended and spring for a 35$ CPU cooler, they easily overclock to 4GHZ...you can also reach that speed or close to it on the stock cooler, but it will run on the warm side.

I thought about going out and just buying one but the satisfaction from putting it all together to work for a specific purpose is going to win out here...Win 7 is definately out as most of the software won't work with it...yet...so cutting some corners I can probably go the i7 route and stay about the same price...I'm assuming the LGA1366 is the latest and greatest...if so I probably need to go that route because I do tend to hold on to computers longer than most...

what are the greatest strains on a system...meaning I know you need lots of HD space to keep it from bogging down...throw all the memory at it you can afford...what else would help a system to run at peak performance...obviously not installing alot of crap on it that needs to boot everytime...but some of the lesser know tricks...

Yeah 1366 is going to give you more powerful options down the road. The i7-920 has great potential either way you go and with that x58 board you can jam TONS of memory in there.

You can save a ton of money buy not worry about a fancy vcard or "extreme cooling," although I agree with $SOLID$Necro, pick up a after market CPU cooler.

Hey guys this is the CPU-Z file of the system thats currently running my scope...

http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=988818

its also my laptop that I play with so its got other stuff loaded and running...with knowing this do you think I would be able to get by with just a pretty good upgrade?...maybe something like this...

Mobo/CPU combo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.319613

Graphics...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150369

Memory...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145251

Power...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005

Sound...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829102012

Case...
whatever...possibly even recycle the one I have...

HA...I have been doing so much reading and with all the numbers running through my head I remembered $SOLID$Necro had laid out a system...its pretty much what I typed above so I guess the answer is yes...


$SOLID$Necro...sorry I have not gotten back with you yet...I have been pretty sick this last week...I will take you up on the offer to help with the overclock on the PIII 600...I am still waiting for the memory to get here that I ordered off fleabay...it should be here today or tomorrow...