Building PC's?

[jack222]

I wouldn't buy parts from newegg, i'd get them straight from manufactours....somehow.

But that besides the point. I will plan for something like this. When i am 18, have some cash, have 3 years of though, more expeienrence and can put it all in my name, mayby something will happen.

(Its too late to think and i have to get up at 5 for a flight, ignore my spelling.)

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

I wouldn't buy parts from newegg, i'd get them straight from manufactours....somehow.

But that besides the point. I will plan for something like this. When i am 18, have some cash, have 3 years of though, more expeienrence and can put it all in my name, mayby something will happen.

(Its too late to think and i have to get up at 5 for a flight, ignore my spelling.)

most manufactures arn't going to sell you stuff at quantities at under 1000.. i know intel and amd sell at quantities at 1000, and 10,000, most other companies share a similar policy. its not profitable for them to sell you one piece at a time, and i'm not sure if it's legal for a wholesale to sell it to you without an actual resalers license. and once you have that you're eating a lot of $ in taxes...

come on guys it's not 1995 anymore a person that can build a computer is a dime a thousand.

and the way the market is for anything you sell you're only going to make 4 or 5% (before taxes), and with dell out there, it's going to be even tighter profit margins. to make it profitable you'd need to be shelling out a LOT of pc's, so you'd need some kind of staff..and you'd have to compensate them to make it worth their time ... and it sucks where you live because the metro area you there are a lot of people attempting what you're doing. i don't know where you would find a buyer base even if you could find enough people to help you build enough computers to make it profitable.


dell isn't sucessful because they build cheap pc's they are sucessful because they were innovative by using subpar parts and creating computers prived at under 1000 elbowing compaq out of the top spot.

now if you can think of doing it a way that hasn't already been done then you may be on to something, or inventing a kind of computer not out yet.. like a skateboard computer.. (patent pending)

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there is a place in flushing pretty close to shea that runs a computer business.. and even they can't survive by just building computers..most of what hes buying in bulk he's reselling to the public at a razor thin profit margin. the guy has problably the lowest prices in the city (where you are able to just go in and buy your stuff) they offer custom systems, web design, and a bunch of other service orientated stuff... because thats the economy of the US.. bah enough untill you get to ec201

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when you're 18 you have to ask your self

are you offering a product or service that a buyer can't do for themselves?

are you offering a product thats so good it's worth spending extra for ?

(or are you offering a product as good as the more expensive counterpart)

can you back your products up with your left testicle.

because if you can't answer these all yes you're dead before you hit the water.

 

[mdcomp]

even if the computer you build is cheaper than dell you just do NOT want to be tied to people for life for technical support

Exactly right. I started up selling computers at age 13, just through family and friends. I would always get phone calls, this doesn't work, that doesn't work...it was a pain. Most of the problems were not covered in the warranty, for example, spyware, printer problems, etc. The customers expect you to make house calls even for things not covered in the warranty for free. It is just a major pain dealing with those kinds of issues. If you do this, you really have to be a stickler about the terms of the warranty. I suggest maybe writing them up and giving them to each customer with every pc.

As somebody said above, the money isn't great. It is very difficult to beat out deals that Dell, HP and other companies have. I would recommend maybe a local repair business. I charge usually $30 an hour for private customers and $50 for businesses. The money is pretty good. You can just go to people locally and fix their computer or you can have them drop it off at your house. I do both and it's great. People are always looking for repair people because HP and Dell don't go to their houses to fix spyware or issues like that. Anyways, it's 3am, I am falling asleep here, I could go on and on, but I think you get the point. I will check this thread periodically for updates and add some comments. In whatever you decide, I wish you the best of luck.


Matt

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

Exactly right. I started up selling computers at age 13, just through family and friends. I would always get phone calls, this doesn't work, that doesn't work...it was a pain. Most of the problems were not covered in the warranty, for example, spyware, printer problems, etc. The customers expect you to make house calls even for things not covered in the warranty for free. It is just a major pain dealing with those kinds of issues. If you do this, you really have to be a stickler about the terms of the warranty. I suggest maybe writing them up and giving them to each customer with every pc.

As somebody said above, the money isn't great. It is very difficult to beat out deals that Dell, HP and other companies have. I would recommend maybe a local repair business. I charge usually $30 an hour for private customers and $50 for businesses. The money is pretty good. You can just go to people locally and fix their computer or you can have them drop it off at your house. I do both and it's great. People are always looking for repair people because HP and Dell don't go to their houses to fix spyware or issues like that. Anyways, it's 3am, I am falling asleep here, I could go on and on, but I think you get the point. I will check this thread periodically for updates and add some comments. In whatever you decide, I wish you the best of luck.


Matt

pretty good forum going on here.

on paper the written warranty is a good idea, but in reality even that won't work. because if the computer isn't booting up and its day 91 on a 90 day warranty the person is likely to chuck a brick through your window or something, if you refuse to do anything about it (since you're doing this out of your home).. and even though they don't come to your door, dell is backing their stuff up for 3 years.. no way you ever want to be tied to a person that long for tech support. local computer business is good though for stuff they can't cover over the phone,

Your rates are very reasonable (50/30). i would do 60 dollar flat rates per computer, and it'd generally be 2 hours. so 50 dollars pocket cash, and 10 for food/expenses for the night. and for 3 or 4 clients a week it's good cash for a student.. but it gets tedious sitting in a sweaty apartment with a bunch of pets hearing about a persons trip to the mole doctor.. *shudders*.. but all flashbacks aside,, you could have people drop them off as the neighborhood fix it guy for extra cash.. it sounds like you have a pretty good gig lined up, you'll do well.

 

[CrystalMethod]

i'm not discouraging him from doing it to be "mean", i'm discouraging him from doing it based on facts and personal experience. if it looks like someone is about to jump off a bridge would you encourage him to do it to be supportive, or try to talk him down.

its nice to have pie in the sky dreams, but its just unrealistic especially in this market. the boys up at compaq couldn't and keep it profitable and they had millions of dollars in investments, and bought parts dirt cheap in bulks of a thousant at wholesale prices, and had people in india putting them together, so how is one guy going to run it out of his basement, buying parts retail from the egg.

Read my earlier post. There's nothing stopping him from buying from a local distributor, and not having to buy retail. You think the local shops buy direct from the manufacturers? Think again. All it takes is some leg work. I'd hardly compare it to "jumping off a bridge". Even working as a freelance tech carries about the same risks. In some cases it's worse (always remember, DATA is worth way more than hardware). What you can put on the line, is your reputation and your experience. It's not always about the lowest price. Heck, I could put together a system for under $300 CAD, and advertise it. Will it sell? Of course it will. It's a computer, it's cheap. Who wouldn't want a system for that price. Would I want to sell a system like that with my name on it? Not in a million years. I can under cut most of the freelance techs in my area by about $15 an hour, and about 35% on some parts. You just have to do the homework, and get good reps at the distribution level. "experience" is very relative in this field. The part about parts being assembled in India is completely irrelevent. What's the difference? They all have to meet the quality standard. I'll even bet the drives made in america fail just as much, or more than those made elsewhere. How's a person to compete? Which would you choose? Your system or a Dell? Your system or a Compaq? Gateway? Build your equivelent system on their site and compare it. Price and performance. Who's does better? If it's a Dell or Gateway, or HP, then why'ed you build your own? Why not just buy a branded system? If you did build it yourself, why? Why not just buy a top of the line alienware or falcon?

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

you're missing the point, the fact that their built in india means dell pays them 10 dollars a week. yes the quality is still good.

the thing is, i build my own for tweaking options, but a person that can appreciate overclocking etc, is savvy enough to build their own without a middle man. for the average person a cheap dell with 3 years tech support gets the job done, period, whats the market for a custom build pc , with enthusiasts building their own and average and low end users going for price, and reliability.

performance isn't the top issue for average user or lowend user, reliability is.. and a trusted name brand and 3 year warranty is reliability.

Joe sixpac will buy a 2ghz celeron for 300 with 3 year warranty, and the dell logo before he buys a 3 ghz p4 for that price, from a non name brand, and no warranty... 99 times out of 100. So will the business owner, etc etc .


sure you can buy from a distrubutor (another middle man) in smaller quantities... but its just as bad as retail because again with a distributor you need a quantity... at least retail you can order with no money down. and even if you do get a good deal on parts you're making pesos per pc, and the tech support plague would more than eat you up.

--
bottom line is computer building business out of your basement, house is not feasable or profitable in 2005. unless you can REALLY build a computer.. meaning design your own chipsets, etc with core parts like capacitors, transistors, etc...

 

[CrystalMethod]

are you offering a product or service that a buyer can't do for themselves?

are you offering a product thats so good it's worth spending extra for ?

(or are you offering a product as good as the more expensive counterpart)

can you back your products up with your left testicle.

because if you can't answer these all yes you're dead before you hit the water.

ok, shouldn't be a rule at any age (IMO).

1 - I can build a system faster and better than most people in the city. (goes for 90% of the members around here) You better make damned sure you learned something around here. You take more than 20 mins to put a system together (for a client) in my crew, you'ed be fired yesterday.

2 - You're only offering what you yourself would be happy with. (they want something else, go elsewhere. No money gained, no money lost). Most expensive part is the same part under a different/brand name. Do the reasearch and find out which is the most viable closest priced match. (I had to change an order from a Gigabyte 6600GT to Leadtek 6600GT, because I couldn't get the gigabyte for 3 weeks, and I could get the Leadtek tomorrow/today). (I'm [personally]paying the extra dollar so the client can get their system 3 weeks early)

3 - I was young and stupid once and I'm trying to save you all the pain. I've, made all the previous afore mentioned mistakes. Already lost my left testicle, you guys and gals will have to settle for the remaining one (should things go badly).

/me prays. "please let it work, please let it work, please let it work, please let it work, please let it work, please let it work..."

If you need help dude, just ask. I can only point you in the right direction though. You're going to have to do the rest of it. Takes a certain ammount of commitment.

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

listen to my last post... the fact that you can build a better system for the same price , or the same for system for less - makes no difference. you as an individual can't come close to the reliability of their support. and honestly, the way the market is now, i honestly do not think you can out do some of dell's deals (replacing 2.4ghz p4 with athlon XP2400+ is NOT matching the deal). the person buying their system for email, internet and dvd's doesnt care about 2ghz vs 3ghz - because for those tasks after 1000 mhz speed really "doesn't" a difference.

 

[CrystalMethod]

you're missing the point, the fact that their built in india means dell pays them 10 dollars a week. yes the quality is still good.

the thing is, i build my own for tweaking options, but a person that can appreciate overclocking etc, is savvy enough to build their own without a middle man. for the average person a cheap dell with 3 years tech support gets the job done, period.

performance isn't the top issue for average user or lowend user, reliability is.. and a trusted name brand and 3 year warranty is reliability.


sure you can buy from a distrubutor (another middle man) in smaller quantities... but its just as bad as retail because again with a distributor you need a quantity... at least retail you can order with no money down.

--
bottom line is computer building business out of your basement, house is not feasable or profitable in 2005. unless you can REALLY build a computer.. meaning design your own chipsets, etc with core parts like capacitors, transistors, etc...

This is where I completely disagree. I get the same deal outta my main distributor as when he sells to Compaq. (yes, Compaq/HP) if you really want to compare pricing I'll PM you my cost on whatever component (if it's availible to me) vs. whatever retail quote you can give me. If you personally don't choose to sell crap, and you sell what you're confident in, I really don't see where the problem is. It's not so much the product that you're selling. It's your expertise, and your knowledge. If you sell crap, you're going to be stuck servicing it forever. You sell something you, yourself would use. How often you going to have to sevice that for running at stock specs for a hardware defect? All the rest is the user screwing poop up, and which is entirely not your fault. Meaning you charge them an hourly rate to fix it.

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

thats the thing! the average user doesn't know the difference between things they poop up or things you poop up. they will come to you no matter what, and if you wont fix it, you sold them a bad computer, and you better believe you're getting a brick through your window. Dell covers everything. FOR 3 YEARS.

And being able to build a computer isnt a skill. if you have enough sense to read a manual you can do it yourself. There is no college major for "computer building" or even "computer repair".. you can learn this stuff on a sunday afternoon from a book.. or website. being able to build a better computer is a non saying.. it either works properly or it doesn't. there is no half way here..

The point here isn't how cheap you can get parts.. on your best day i'd say 50 dollars is what you'd make on a custom build, but for arguement sake lets say you make 100 bucks per build. so at 100 bucks, you will sell MAYBE 3 computers in a week (because like i said whats the market for custom computers,, when dell is giving computers that do the same thing with 3 year warranty).. thats MAYBE ..(here that is) competition is stiff.. at 3 computers a week you can make 300 bucks a week... now thats well below poverty line (here at least.. me and jack are in the same market...maybe montreal the cost of living is lower, and you can live on 15k a year) not only that. but for the year you have 150 computers under warranty. meaning if 30% of your buyers (which is VERY modest) has a problem every week you will be on the phone with someone for 3-4 hours a week offering techsupport free of charge. and then another year add 150 more computers... hypotheticly if your business grows the calls will snowball.

This is NOT profitable.

 

[Sjaak]

I have tried this two years ago, when i was 16. I had an advantage though, as long as you make less then a certain amount of money from it (i think it was 3500€ a year), you don't have to register here in Holland, so no big paperwork and selling licenses.

A nice .NL website, some friends spreading around the news that i build custom pcs...it all went nice untill i went on holiday and someone got problems with their pc...i wasn't there to fix it! Eventually i closed it down after half a year, made like 1000€ in profit or so, but it was just taking up too much of my time and effort. Plus, you have the problem of people wanting specific things then changing it later...don't underestimate the 'i think i know alot about pcs' customers.

See the problem? The rest of your life will get in the way...

 

[CrystalMethod]

listen to my last post... the fact that you can build a better system for the same price , or the same for system for less - makes no difference. you as an individual can't come close to the reliability of their support. and honestly, the way the market is now, i honestly do not think you can out do some of dell's deals (replacing 2.4ghz p4 with athlon XP2400+ is NOT matching the deal). the person buying their system for email, internet and dvd's doesnt care about 2ghz vs 3ghz - because for those tasks after 1000 mhz speed really "doesn't" a difference.

Now you're just picking on me personally. The shop I work for survives on service. Which is me, and one or two other techs when I choose to have them in to do the routine work. I can actually beat out Dell's deal here, because we worked out a better deal with Bell Canada, Intel, AMD, Kingston, Microsoft, and a few others for this month. If Dell can offer a free computer, then they got us beat... or a computer for 49$. Then yeah, Dell wins, small guy sucks, you're the king, <add in any thing you want here>. Other than that, this shop has been here for over 9 years as "the small guy", that's with "the fact that you can build a better system for the same price , or the same for system for less - makes no difference. you as an individual can't come close to the reliability of their support.". My support is better than Dell's. I offer something more than "put in your restore CD and at the command when it tells you all the contents of your drive will be erased, select "yes" to deleting my entire client database, and all the past years invoices." That's not my version of support. (I have 3 Dell's and 2 HP's on my service shelf, that are here because of their "suport").

I'm sorry if things didn't work out for you with the computer hardware business. But, you're looking at it from the negative side, and assuming he's going to make the same mistakes you made. Why don't you just tell him, I dealt with XXX distributor, and they screwed me. Delivery time was crap with XXX distributor. XXX distributor only warranties the items 30 days, the rest is up to you. Let him decide on his own, or better yet, let this thread show our support for a fellow member. Do a lil' to do some reaseach for him. point him in the right direction.

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

how am i picking on you personally i'm just telling you the truth. Are you covering your computers for 3 years ? dell offers the chance for you to mail your system back , most times they will send you a fresh one, YOU CANT BEAT THAT.. they will have your system maybe 2 weeks, if they bring it into you you'll have it maybe 4 days.. but still... you arn't covering products for 3 years and selling at their prices, i dont see it coming. you've already admitted you're only still alive because of the service side of it.. the whole point of the thread is there is no building computers for a profit in 2005.

I've never tried a full blown computer building business, only a couple of refurbs, and ran into the technical support problem fast, as did everyone else that tried it.

The right decision is there is no way to make this profitable in new york (and 90% of other markets) and hes setting up a HARD fall.. Computer building is a service that ANYONE CAN DO.. thats also my point, its not unique in the sense that a customer has to depend on you to do it.. and when you throw in a bunch of other people doing the same thing you're just setting yourself up for a hard fall.

and the house computers you have in your client base, you're charing 60 bucks an hour for at least 3 hours, and a healthy markup on parts .. so it could come close to 200, enough for a new low end system.. thats all fine and good for the person who doesn't know anything about computers, or the market, and is just willing to pay more than do a little extra work.

On paper it makes more sense to have a complete system from a name brand thatw will cover the machine for 3 years and that will have more resale value in the future, then to buy a custom one from a small shop that covers the computer for 6 months, then charges 60 bucks an hour for any problems that it will have.

even if you're building 4 computers a week with 100 dollars profit (which i'm sure will NOT happen) its poverty line.

This is the truth: Computer builders offer a service that is only useful to a person too lazy to read a manual or shop around themselves, with a little more money to spend. "Yes i said it".. and just the fact that they stumbled on to your website already means they are shopping around.

but tell me, i should be telling him not to make the mistakes i've made, or anyone else in the thread! we've all sold great computers fort the price that worked when sold.

if the mistake is getting involved and offering free technical support on the product, SORRY for not wanting ****ed off enemies especially ones that know my address.

the fact that you keep bringing in the deal your distributors are giving you means you're missing the whole point.

 

[Elif Tymes]

how am i picking on you personally i'm just telling you the truth. Are you covering your computers for 3 years ? dell offers the chance for you to mail your system back , most times they will send you a fresh one, YOU CANT BEAT THAT.. they will have your system maybe 2 weeks, if they bring it into you you'll have it maybe 4 days.. but still... you arn't covering products for 3 years and selling at their prices, i dont see it coming. you've already admitted you're only still alive because of the service side of it.. the whole point of the thread is there is no building computers for a profit in 2005.

Thats not service, thats a warranty.

Servise is actually working WITH the person to fix the problem, without causing loss of data.

Dell can offer a warranty, home builders can offer service

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

no person can guarantee no data loss.. i'm not talking about working with the customer.. as far as i understand they either drop it off... or you go there and fix it.. right ? keeping data backed up is the responsibility of the buyer anyway.

 

[Elif Tymes]

Theres a difference between trying to save their date(I.E. dumping it, formatting, bringing it back) and "Oh? Your new printer won't work? Pop in the restore CD!"

.

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

if a buyer is smart enough to back up their stuff periodiclly, whats so bad about just a warranty ?

 

[petteyg359]

What you could do just to make some money, is instead of building computers, just offer support. Support tech at my middle school got paid $80 an hour, and he couldn't even fix half the things I could.

 

[Mr_Fuchs]

What you could do just to make some money, is instead of building computers, just offer support. Support tech at my middle school got paid $80 an hour, and he couldn't even fix half the things I could.

yes, thats the consensus..i think he has already decided to do tht. at least repairing a system requires a skill beyond reading a manual..but computers is a no go.

 

[Elif Tymes]

IF people were smart enough to back up their data, they prolly wouldn't need PC Support .

But, yea, repair is where the moneys at.