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Couple noob questions for the experts

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kermdawg

Registered
Joined
Dec 8, 2011
So I had a couple ideas that I wanted to see if anyone else has done or if anyone thats been water cooling for a long time can comment on.

This is my first water cooling build, but I was looking at something that was somewhat "modular". By that I mean easily upgradable. From what I've read, the only items I have intentions to run water too are my CPU (currently) and GPU(future).

For the record, I got a i5-3570k processor(that I would like to overclock as high as I can to a 24/7 stable speed) and a nvidia GTX650. I'm still on the fence deciding if I'm just going to add another video card in SLI, or overclock the one I got to the max. I'm thinking I'll get more performance out of an SLI setup than overclocking a single card (especially a mid-tier one), so I'm holding off on that for now, seeing as how my current setup allows me to do everything I need it to do, at maximum settings(gaming and heavy multi tasking(videos, internet, office)) at very acceptable speeds.


I was thinking something along the lines of a 120.4 radiator. My thing is, I don't want to have to buy parts twice. I would like to be able to buy a bigger radiator than I need now, and be add my GPU in later, if I decide to go that route.

My main question is about the pumps. I have alot of experience in the piping trades, and I know how we do it on the job(chip plants, refineries, etc.) Obviously, these pumps are a little differant than the ones I'm used to piping in. But, I was wondering if the basic concepts are the same, which I think they are.

Firstly, I wanted to run two pumps in parallel. My thinking was, they would alternate their cycles somehow, either based on the power switch, timing, or water temperature. This is mainly to extend the life of the pumps (and yes I usually turn my computer off at night...usually), and secondly, to provide redundancy in case one fails. I don't want to be dead in the water waiting for a pump in the mail and have to reconfigure my computer and reattach the stock heat sink and all that crap. After all, if the pump stops working, your CPU is gonna get fried right?(I guess the thermal shutoff would kick on....) Which model pump would you guys recommend for a good combination of performance, longevity, and price?

Secondly, do you guys factor in flow restrictions of your fittings and valves into your loop? In my trade we have to factor all that stuff in, especially with pumps. I was wondering if anybody had any charts for that stuff.

Lastly, I've read alot of reviews about water blocks. i can't seem to figure out if high flow is good or bad with these, seeing as how alot of people seem to think that the more restrictive ones will give you a bit better cooling potential, due to the water being in the block longer.

Once again, I'm looking for a 24/7 overclock with keeping my temps as low as possible. I'd really like to see what kind of chip I got, but I cant do much with the stock heat sink, and I'm not buying a 100 dollar air cooler when I can spend a bit more on a water cooling setup and get temps that are half that of the air cooler.

thanks in advance guys!

P.s.-I figured my price to be around 300 dollars for a setup like this. A 120x4 rad(no fans included), 2 pumps, 10 feet of 1/2" tubing, and a res that I'm still deciding on. That sound about right?

Edit-Couple other things. I only have a 650 watt power supply. As it stands, in addition to all the above, I was thinking about adding possibly 1-2 more hard drives(one probably being a SSD) I have one 640gb 7200 rpm drive right now. The PSU is brand new, I bought it with the rest of the rig in November. But, I wouldn't be adverse to having some of those 120v pumps that plug into a wall socket if the PSU couldn't handle 2 pumps, and all the additional fans too! 120.4, in push/pull, thats 8 more fans right?
 
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So I had a couple ideas that I wanted to see if anyone else has done or if anyone thats been water cooling for a long time can comment on.

This is my first water cooling build, but I was looking at something that was somewhat "modular". By that I mean easily upgradable. From what I've read, the only items I have intentions to run water too are my CPU (currently) and GPU(future).

For the record, I got a i5-3570k processor(that I would like to overclock as high as I can to a 24/7 stable speed) and a nvidia GTX650. I'm still on the fence deciding if I'm just going to add another video card in SLI, or overclock the one I got to the max. I'm thinking I'll get more performance out of an SLI setup than overclocking a single card (especially a mid-tier one), so I'm holding off on that for now, seeing as how my current setup allows me to do everything I need it to do, at maximum settings(gaming and heavy multi tasking(videos, internet, office)) at very acceptable speeds.

A 650 isn't worth watercooling. It will cost about $80 to cool that card, for a card that only cost $150


I was thinking something along the lines of a 120.4 radiator. My thing is, I don't want to have to buy parts twice. I would like to be able to buy a bigger radiator than I need now, and be add my GPU in later, if I decide to go that route.

Have you done any heatload calculations? To know why a 120x4 is needed?

My main question is about the pumps. I have alot of experience in the piping trades, and I know how we do it on the job(chip plants, refineries, etc.) Obviously, these pumps are a little differant than the ones I'm used to piping in. But, I was wondering if the basic concepts are the same, which I think they are.

Yep, exactly the same. We have STICKIES in yellow that will give you info, links and more to learn about the pumps we use and love.

Firstly, I wanted to run two pumps in parallel. My thinking was, they would alternate their cycles somehow, either based on the power switch, timing, or water temperature. This is mainly to extend the life of the pumps (and yes I usually turn my computer off at night...usually), and secondly, to provide redundancy in case one fails. I don't want to be dead in the water waiting for a pump in the mail and have to reconfigure my computer and reattach the stock heat sink and all that crap. After all, if the pump stops working, your CPU is gonna get fried right?(I guess the thermal shutoff would kick on....) Which model pump would you guys recommend for a good combination of performance, longevity, and price?

Pumps in parellel? If one pump dies the other will backfeed and you will have no cooling. Again, you really to learn about PC watercooling, it's a fully diff animal. For redundancy (dunno why, our pumps have a 50,000 MTF failure rate. And if the CPU overtemps the Bios will auto shutdown, we all use that. Some need the extra pumpage of two pumps, but really it's not needed.

Secondly, do you guys factor in flow restrictions of your fittings and valves into your loop? In my trade we have to factor all that stuff in, especially with pumps. I was wondering if anybody had any charts for that stuff.

Yes, Martin has a flow rate calculator to learn with. His link is mentioned in the Stickies. It's not a big deal really, one good pump overcomes any flow rate ussues as long as you don't get silly.

Lastly, I've read alot of reviews about water blocks. i can't seem to figure out if high flow is good or bad with these, seeing as how alot of people seem to think that the more restrictive ones will give you a bit better cooling potential, due to the water being in the block longer.

Overthinking. High/low flow is a misnomer. Buy a top 5 CPU block, your good.

Once again, I'm looking for a 24/7 overclock with keeping my temps as low as possible. I'd really like to see what kind of chip I got, but I cant do much with the stock heat sink, and I'm not buying a 100 dollar air cooler when I can spend a bit more on a water cooling setup and get temps that are half that of the air cooler.

Temps to silly unreasonable levels gain you nothing in the world of ambient watercooling. With 24/7 cooling anything in the normal ranges will be just fine. Spending $400 extra to get the Dt temps 5 C lower gains nothing for the long term life of the parts.


thanks in advance guys!

P.s.-I figured my price to be around 300 dollars for a setup like this. A 120x4 rad(no fans included), 2 pumps, 10 feet of 1/2" tubing, and a res that I'm still deciding on. That sound about right?

Nope. Pumps, good ones are $80 each. A CPU block is $70ish. The rad you want? $100. A res can go from $25 to $100. Add $40 for a fan controller. $15 per fan. $70++ for fittings and tubing.

Edit-Couple other things. I only have a 650 watt power supply. As it stands, in addition to all the above, I was thinking about adding possibly 1-2 more hard drives(one probably being a SSD) I have one 640gb 7200 rpm drive right now. The PSU is brand new, I bought it with the rest of the rig in November. But, I wouldn't be adverse to having some of those 120v pumps that plug into a wall socket if the PSU couldn't handle 2 pumps, and all the additional fans too! 120.4, in push/pull, thats 8 more fans right?

No one uses 120VAC pumps, well some do in extreme multi rig setups. Usually we see the choices the uninformed make and they don't buy it due to many reasons.

The added wattage of a pump and a few fans is NEVER an issue. It's lowww wattage. A 120x3 rad with 3 fans and a popular pump is 40 watts. That's it.

Great deep thought here, good for you. Your gonna do well once you learn. But you really don't know squat about PC watercooling. Thats why we have the YELLOW stickies up top. Many sucessful builders spend a few weeks reading and learning, reading LOTS of posts here and treating ALL the stickie info as important.

If you see a few threads where the OP meanders, and has 70 posts in their thread, it's usually they didn't do the research and are probably prone to fail.

Lastly, you can buy a great WC rig kit of top stuff for $300 or less. Not fancy, but will cool the CPU wonderfully for MANY years, and a bit of add with a rad and GPU blocks it will last forever.

Ask me about stuff like that in 2-3 weeks. I been at it for years and seen it all. It's up to you, best of luck!

Ohh I'm a maintenance guy too and deal with pumps of all soerts, water, mixing, hydraulic etc. So I know where your coming from.
 
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