Identifying Bags and Materials as Antistatic

[zzzzzzzzzz]

The questions of this thread seems best answered by engineers.

Sensitive electronics should be stored in antistatic containers or bags.

Other than when a bag or container is clearly marked as such, there does not appear to me to be an obvious way of identifying whether a container or bag is antistatic.

There are many plastics bags and containers hat hold a charge, while others do not.

The Questions:
How can a bag or container be identified as antistatic?

How can a bag or container be (simply?) tested to determine whether it is suitable as an antistatic container or bag?

Are particular types of plastics or category of plastics better suited for antistatic containers?

 

[bob4933]

any antistatic bag designed for electronics WILL be labeled as such. Im not aware of any markings or specifics regarding them other wise.

That said, a ziploc bag stored ina cardboard box will be JUST FINE. unless you like to rub your head with ballons before touching electronics lol.

 

[EarthDog]

Not always. For example, I believe the pink , small bubbled, padding is anti static.

 

[Mr.Scott]

Not always. For example, I believe the pink , small bubbled, padding is anti static.

Also, the pink non-bubbled.

 

[petteyg359]

That's just a little bit paranoid. My brother went to an electrician training thing for a while before he dropped out, and they were teaching that tiny (i.e. 3.6V lithium batteries) could electrocute you to death. Anecdotally, I have horribly dry skin, I always work on my electronics on carpet, and I never use any special wrist straps or pads. In well over 10 years, working with every computer component imaginable from 1 MB SIMMs to soldered RJ-45 ports to open pins on fan controllers, I have never had anything damaged or even felt any sort of discharge.

Teaching caution is great, but the atrocious embellishment really needs to stop.

On topic, I recall reading somewhere that there is some industry regulation such that bags and bubble wrap (and possibly peanuts) are required to be anti-static if they are in a pink color. Can't find the source again, though, so that's possibly totally wrong.

EDIT: Found a quote saying pink is just a de facto industry standard.

 

[Mr.Scott]

My brother went to an electrician training thing for a while before he dropped out, and they were teaching that tiny (i.e. 3.6V lithium batteries) could electrocute you to death.

It's not the volts that kill you, it's the amps. And yes, .1 amp can kill you if delivered to the right location.

 

[Bobnova]

Hell, 0.010 amps can, if it's in the right spot and high enough voltage.

The trick is, you have to get the current into you. You're high enough resistance (skin especially) that without working at it quite hard 12v doesn't get through skin in any measurable amount.
120 is enough to punch through.
240 is enough to punch through rather better and push more current.
440 more so.
2000 more so again.
Etc.

 

[petteyg359]

It's not the volts that kill you, it's the amps. And yes, .1 amp can kill you if delivered to the right location.

Hell, 0.010 amps can, if it's in the right spot and high enough voltage.

And my point is that it's rather extremely challenging for any person not actively trying to kill themselves to do so. You can kill yourself just as easily by walking face-first into a door frame at the right angle, yet we don't put 20-bullet-point warnings on door frames.

 

[Mr.Scott]

And my point is that it's rather extremely challenging for any person not actively trying to kill themselves to do so. You can kill yourself just as easily by walking face-first into a door frame at the right angle, yet we don't put 20-bullet-point warnings on door frames.

You under estimate the stupidity of some people.

 

[Bobnova]

I agree with both of you.

 

[petteyg359]

You under estimate the stupidity of some people.

There's are too many images to choose from with the text "Don't kill all the stupid people, just remove all the warning labels."

There is nothing either "atrocious" nor an "embellishment" about anything I wrote. It's all 100% industry standard ESD stuff (TTBOMK and recollection, keeping the original Caveat & Disclaimer in mind), except, again, TTBOMK and recollection, those points I clearly noted are not.

You are, of course, free to believe what you wish to believe. But your mere belief does not constitute fact.

Compare injuries (both human and property) from static discharge to anything else, and then compare whatever warning labels (if any) that specific "anything else" has on it. The stuff about ESD is, in fact, very embellished. Whether that fact is an atrocity is subjective, but I am definitely in the remove-all-the-warning-labels camp.

 

[Bobnova]

Btw: The current that a 3.6V lithium cell can supply can indeed "electrocute you do death" [sic], if it's applied properly.

Sure, if you shank yourself with electrodes on either side of your heart perhaps.

 

[bob4933]

Are we seriously considering that an unplugged mother board with static build up can kill you? I swear thats what Im reading lol.

Static, by its very nature, is very very very low amperage. Im guessing the next course of action is to explain how balloons applied to the head are lethal weapons for children's amusement and clothes fresh out of the drier are murdering people.

Besides the fact that human skin is naturally almost 1MΩ, it would take an incredibly high amount of voltage to create the current needed to kill you, or a voltage applied over an impressive amount of time. Static shock from the carpet to your mother board is neither.

Lightning on the other hand....

Btw: The current that a 3.6V lithium cell can supply can indeed "electrocute you do death" [sic], if it's applied properly.
Jim

No, no it cant.

Worst case scenario for a human being is wet skin and clothes and shocked on the left side of the body with no shoes on. Your bodies natural resistance drops an impressive amount to ~1000ohms. This means that 3.6v battery will be providing a whopping .0036A at worst case for a fully charged battery and would drop continuously. Thats with you being continuously wet, standing on a perfect ground (you're not lol), not wearing shoes, and the air temperature is both dry and cool. If you're dry and naked, you will recieve ~.0000072A

Not always. For example, I believe the pink , small bubbled, padding is anti static.

I've always seen those pink bubbly wrap things with a sticker on them, but I guess that would be easy enough to lose If you're "shopping for one" it will be labeled.

 

[Mr.Scott]

Are we seriously considering that an unplugged mother board with static build up can kill you? I swear thats what Im reading lol.

Static, by its very nature, is very very very low amperage. Im guessing the next course of action is to explain how balloons applied to the head are lethal weapons for children's amusement and clothes fresh out of the drier are murdering people.

Besides the fact that human skin is naturally almost 1MΩ, it would take an incredibly high amount of voltage to create the current needed to kill you, or a voltage applied over an impressive amount of time. Static shock from the carpet to your mother board is neither.

Lightning on the other hand....




No, no it cant.

Worst case scenario for a human being is wet skin and clothes and shocked on the left side of the body with no shoes on. Your bodies natural resistance drops an impressive amount to ~1000ohms. This means that 3.6v battery will be providing a whopping .0036A at worst case for a fully charged battery and would drop continuously. Thats with you being continuously wet, standing on a perfect ground (you're not lol), not wearing shoes, and the air temperature is both dry and cool. If you're dry and naked, you will recieve ~.0000072A

Be sure you explain all that to the guy with the pacemaker.

EDIT- and see post #10.

 

[bob4933]

Be sure you explain all that to the guy with the pacemaker.

EDIT- and see post #10.

.0036A wont stop a pace maker


And if you're using a pace maker, standing naked on a copper plate put on the ground, soaked head to toe and playing with batteries... well, you have your own obligations to attend

I whole heartedly agree with post 10 as well haha.

 

[repo man11]

Anecdata is of very little use when talking about ESD. It's akin to saying "I've never had the flu vaccine, and I've never had the flu, so the flu vaccine is either useless, or its value is overstated" or "I've been driving without wearing a seat belt for decades, and I'm still alive".

It's already been stated that the voltage that can cause ESD damage is far below the threshold of a discharge that you can actually feel. And the worst part is, the component you are working with may still work, but it has mysterious problems. Most often people will blame the manufacturer in these cases.

 

[Automata]

I think this thread is quite off the topic of identifying static bags.

 

[petteyg359]

Anecdata is of very little use when talking about ESD. It's akin to saying "I've never had the flu vaccine, and I've never had the flu, so the flu vaccine is either useless, or its value is overstated" or "I've been driving without wearing a seat belt for decades, and I'm still alive".

False. There is evidence that seat belts save lives. There is evidence that flu vaccines are effective (and then there's the herd aspect). Saying that static wristbands save you from ESD killing motherboards is as provable as my slightly dirty walls saving me from nose bleeds. You can't prove a negative. There's also no "herd immunity" to ESD.

 

[Mr.Scott]

.0036A wont stop a pace maker

Link to positive proof please.
Since suddenly you're a doctor, this should be easy for you to come up with.

 

[Automata]

However, I can prove this thread is off topic.

neat eh