FRONTPAGE Intel Skylake-X (i9 7900X) and Kaby Lake-X (i7 7740K) CPU Review

[Alaric]

Methinks were derailing the thread just a little bit though

Me derail a thread? I don't believe it. LOL. OK, I believe it.
I read for stories, I game for other fun, so I'm good with the history filling in the story.

 

[Woomack]

Except 2-3 titles per year there is nothing interesting (at least in last ~6-7 years). I guess that players have more fun on consoles. On PC most popular games are FPS, single sports games or some that already have 2-3 years+. Like there was a lot of noise about Skyrim or Witcher but these games are not new, just get updates. Most games don't even have good graphics and are based on 5 year old engines. Look at last Fallout, old engine, improved textures. Graphics quality is not improving as fast as graphics cards power and prices are rising. Some games require GTX1060 to run good but graphics is like in 4-5 year old titles which were good for GTX560.

Methinks were derailing the thread just a little bit though

Not much ... but maybe better back on track

 

[Kenrou]

Except 2-3 titles per year there is nothing interesting (at least in last ~6-7 years). I guess that players have more fun on consoles. On PC most popular games are FPS, single sports games or some that already have 2-3 years+. Like there was a lot of noise about Skyrim or Witcher but these games are not new, just get updates. Most games don't even have good graphics and are based on 5 year old engines. Look at last Fallout, old engine, improved textures. Graphics quality is not improving as fast as graphics cards power and prices are rising. Some games require GTX1060 to run good but graphics is like in 4-5 year old titles which were good for GTX560.

And then aberrations show up like Deus Ex: Mankind Divided that you need a 1080+ to get over 60fps at max settings

For good or for bad IPC/clocks are still kings, so KL will be top dog for a while longer. Only thing i have always had against Intel is the ridiculous pricing, lower it to Ryzen level and you will have more people going back to desktops instead of consoles IMO.

 

[Alaric]

And then aberrations show up like Deus Ex: Mankind Divided that you need a 1080+ to get over 60fps at max settings

For good or for bad IPC/clocks are still kings, so KL will be top dog for a while longer. Only thing i have always had against Intel is the ridiculous pricing, lower it to Ryzen level and you will have more people going back to desktops instead of consoles IMO.

Have to agree with you there. On the plus side, my OC'd Skylake beats a stock KL ( a smidgen) so I'm still good.

 

[Woomack]

In most games I barely see the difference between ~4GHz and anything above that and most games can't use more than 4 cores. Even these optimized for more cores are showing barely any improvements above 6 threads. For sure Skylake-X isn't good option for gamers mainly because of total price of whole platform. The same 8 core Ryzens aren't good for gamers because of the same high price of whole platform ( not as high as Intel but not worth to pay for more than 6 cores for games ).
Intel has for sure better motherboards and much better support so for work it seems better option than anything from AMD regardless if it cost more or less. In business difference like $200-300 isn't much but in global scale there are not so many companies which need many computers based on 6 core+ computers. Even typical graphics studios usually have 3-6 computers for rendering etc. I just wish to see sales raport in about half year and % of sales for all Intel series.

Even though I wish to have Skylake-X for benching then at least right now I feel like I will skip this generation. For sure I see no point to buy anything up to 8 cores and above depends on price which right now is ridiculous. On the other hand if rumours are right then AMD won't have anything better with max OC up to ~4GHz.

 

[||Console||]

In most games I barely see the difference between ~4GHz and anything above that and most games can't use more than 4 cores. Even these optimized for more cores are showing barely any improvements above 6 threads. For sure Skylake-X isn't good option for gamers mainly because of total price of whole platform. The same 8 core Ryzens aren't good for gamers because of the same high price of whole platform ( not as high as Intel but not worth to pay for more than 6 cores for games ).
Intel has for sure better motherboards and much better support so for work it seems better option than anything from AMD regardless if it cost more or less. In business difference like $200-300 isn't much but in global scale there are not so many companies which need many computers based on 6 core+ computers. Even typical graphics studios usually have 3-6 computers for rendering etc. I just wish to see sales raport in about half year and % of sales for all Intel series.

Even though I wish to have Skylake-X for benching then at least right now I feel like I will skip this generation. For sure I see no point to buy anything up to 8 cores and above depends on price which right now is ridiculous. On the other hand if rumours are right then AMD won't have anything better with max OC up to ~4GHz.

and that makes total sense because Thread ripper is just a few R7s on the same chip I dont expect it to OC any better .

 

[wingman99]

The most interesting for typical gamers will be probably Ryzen 3 and above average graphics cards like GTX1060 or RX580. I count that average is GTX1050 as it's minimum to play new games in 1080p. Still each year gaming computers are more expensive while games are not much better looking and in general are less fun each year ( or I'm getting old ).

I agree games are not much better in the last 8 years.

 

[Alaric]

Whoopsie!

Not good news for early adopters of the X299 platforms https://www.techpowerup.com/234744/intel-x299-platform-called-a-vrm-disaster-by-overclocker-der8auer

 

[EarthDog]

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php/783002-Der8auer-x299-vrm-disaster

 

[Alaric]

DOH! I should have known our guys were on it.

 

[deeppow]

Came across this link (http://hexus.net/tech/news/cpu/107293-serious-intel-skylake-kaby-lake-microcode-bug-unearthed/) related to microcode on X series processors. Since I use a lot of threading in my coding it could be an issue for me. Anyone with experience or comments related to this?

 

[EarthDog]

It was fixed with microcode already. Update to yoyr boards latest bios if you havent already.

 

[deeppow]

BIOS? Did they actually fix the microcode or just disable threading? I didn't think control of processing at the chip level was done through the bios.

 

[Alaric]

No fix for my board. Not that I'm very worried about it, but March was the last BIOS for my board and that was a Vcore update.

 

[wingman99]

BIOS? Did they actually fix the microcode or just disable threading? I didn't think control of processing at the chip level was done through the bios.

I think modern CPUs use programmable instructions like GPUs. There is no Bios update yet for my board either.

 

[EarthDog]

BIOS? Did they actually fix the microcode or just disable threading? I didn't think control of processing at the chip level was done through the bios.

they didnt disable threading


https://hothardware.com/news/critic...ading-discovered-requiring-bios-microcode-fix

 

[deeppow]

Thanks EarthDog.

 

[EarthDog]

Maybe a BUMP here will bring discussion back to this thread instead of the guy asking about an i9.

Anyway, a good link I found that discusses the thermal properties of SL-X and the motherboard power... its a great read. Also for wingman just showing the minor clock differences you saw with my results were not throttling.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/-intel-skylake-x-overclocking-thermal-issues,5117.html

Conclusion
So, what’s the bottom line? Intel is pushing the envelope once again with a factory-overclocked Xeon processor doing double-duty as a high-end desktop masterpiece. We're getting the sense, though, that the revered Core architecture can't be pushed much further. Everything works well enough this time around, at least. And if Intel hadn't chickened out and put thermal paste between its die and heat spreader, there might have been a happier ending for everyone involved in this story.
As it stands, even a custom water-cooling loop has to throw in the towel at 250W, long before most motherboard voltage converters hit their limits. Under normal operating conditions, the CPU, and not the motherboard, always throttles first.
Nevertheless, motherboard manufacturers aren’t blameless when it comes to the issues we encountered at launch and continue battling today. Using more thermodynamic expertise and less flashy plastic pieces would have paved the way for brawnier motherboards at the same price points. This would have ended the speculation before it even started. Anything designed to be just good enough always leaves you with a bad aftertaste, particularly since you never know when you might need a little extra headroom.

 

[deeppow]

Very interesting read Earthdog. Now I've got to go back and study it, tons of info there.

 

[wingman99]

Yes I see now that VRM throttling is 1.2GHz at 105c untill it drops below 90c.